Level 5 judging... what are they looking for?

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mwmbs

Hello,
Just a quick question... we are new to usag and are a little confused as to what judges are looking for especially in level 5. It is obvious that form, presentation and body position are huge but our girls look just as good if not better than some gymnasts who are outscoring them. If anyone has any tips for improvement that would be greatly appreciated!
 
Hello,
Just a quick question... we are new to usag and are a little confused as to what judges are looking for especially in level 5. It is obvious that form, presentation and body position are huge but our girls look just as good if not better than some gymnasts who are outscoring them. If anyone has any tips for improvement that would be greatly appreciated!

Being more specific would help. Is it just 1 event you think your girls are being underscored on or all 4? Have the coaches talked with the judges about what they see as areas for improvement? That would be the place to start.
 
and you all probably know what i'm going to say...

let me know when you find out what they're looking for cause i've been lookin since 1964.:)
 
If someone could watch my DD's video, can you please explain where the 8.375 came from at the Chicago Style, our home meet no less! I was a gymnast and also coached before my kids were born. I just don't get what they are looking for either.

EDIT: Add video
[video=youtube;u95xSECdqJw]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u95xSECdqJw[/video]
 
Last edited by a moderator:
If someone could watch my DD's video, can you please explain where the 8.375 came from at the Chicago Style, our home meet no less! I was a gymnast and also coached before my kids were born. I just don't get what they are looking for either.
I should have said the 8.375 was on floor.
 
If someone could watch my DD's video, can you please explain where the 8.375 came from at the Chicago Style, our home meet no less! I was a gymnast and also coached before my kids were born. I just don't get what they are looking for either.

Your daughter has great tumbling...too many steps into that great tumbling though.
 
Aside from the extra steps into the tumbling, there is some leg separation in the tumbling, insufficient leg separations where required - and some text errors. C did a great job though, and she is as cute as a button :)
 
If someone could watch my DD's video, can you please explain where the 8.375 came from at the Chicago Style, our home meet no less! I was a gymnast and also coached before my kids were born. I just don't get what they are looking for either.

I believe most of our girls get the big deduction from the dive roll and the back extension roll. On the dive roll you really have to show flight .... my DD say that the coaches call it the superman roll (like you are going to take off and fly). And on the back extension roll...legs together and really show that handstand. Those are the only additional things I could see.

She looked really confident out there and I thought she did a great job!!! Her vault looked really good to me for her age!!
 
My daughter is an almost-10-year-old level 5. We went to a big meet with some pretty high-level teams this past weekend. I noticed on the floor routines that the little girls had a harder time getting higher scores. Kathy got an 8.6 on floor and I noticed some little girls (7-ish), who to my eyes had "slicker" routines (all of the little flourishes that my DD doesn't have) getting lower scores. I am not a coach, or a gymnast, or anything more official than a mom who writes the checks, but I chalk it up to "body confidence." As the girls get older, they just seem to look more graceful and in controll of their bodies. Last year Kathy had three teenaged level 4's on her team and if they did the exact same routine with the exact same level of skill, they just looked nicer doing it. I think that may affect some judges scoring more than others. Anyway, your daughter did an amazing job, and I'm sure that you are very proud!
 
Aside from the extra steps into the tumbling, there is some leg separation in the tumbling, insufficient leg separations where required - and some text errors. C did a great job though, and she is as cute as a button :)

I agree, cute as pie and just young and inexperienced! Indy gym mom is right, she had at least 2 extra steps into every tumbling pass & her leaps, at .10 each-they add up! The other stuff, leg & foot form, leg separations, bent arms on b. ext, needs bigger split on back walkover, etc will come w time & good coaching. (I see she goes to a great gym.)
 
My daughter is an almost-10-year-old level 5. We went to a big meet with some pretty high-level teams this past weekend. I noticed on the floor routines that the little girls had a harder time getting higher scores. Kathy got an 8.6 on floor and I noticed some little girls (7-ish), who to my eyes had "slicker" routines (all of the little flourishes that my DD doesn't have) getting lower scores. I am not a coach, or a gymnast, or anything more official than a mom who writes the checks, but I chalk it up to "body confidence." As the girls get older, they just seem to look more graceful and in controll of their bodies. Last year Kathy had three teenaged level 4's on her team and if they did the exact same routine with the exact same level of skill, they just looked nicer doing it. I think that may affect some judges scoring more than others. Anyway, your daughter did an amazing job, and I'm sure that you are very proud!


Thank you all! I know her coaches will address the issues, but to the untrained eye I question, obviously. She is my baby!! She was a perfect 10 to me!! And yes, no matter what the number of falls are, she will always make me proud!! Her classic, roll it off the shoulder reaction on bars was priceless!! I need to learn to handle life the way she does her gymnastics!! However, watch-Kid will schedule herself another private. She better get a job!!
 
She is adorable and what strength:) I agree with the extra step issue in tumbling pass, my daughter has the same problem. Also I understand the the rebounds need to have arms by ears and eyes focused on hands, front handspring that is. In all very solid routine:)
 
I just needed to ask... so if DD makes all three or is it 4 runs only at three steps each then the 10ths will add up? Each extra step is a 10th of a deduction? So that would be about 7/10 ? I counted her passes including the dive roll. She took 5 steps into the handspring, 5 or it looked like 6 steps into the round off flip flop flip flop. I asked her why she runs so much and she said because she has to get to the end of the mat. What happens when they are extremely little? She is shorter than most 5 yo. Is it okay to not make it to each corner of the mat?
Power isn't a problem. She can do RFBT from a power hurdle and from one knee. They do this in what she calls "Complex". She does have extreme power for a little one. Any and all advice would be greatly appreciated. She told her coach that she learned her straight arm kip from me. Not Really- but coach made the comment that he knows she could do it but isn't. That next Saturday she wanted to go to an open gym and I remembered her coaches comment, so I stopped to glide her through the kip with straight arms and she has been doing it ever since. I bet the extra runs into her tumbling could be the same if I just break it down for her as such.
 
lilgymmie7,

Yes, I think they get .10 deduction for anything over 3 steps on each pass. Not 100% sure if it is every tumbling pass (dive roll, FHS and ROBHSBHS) or not. My daughter takes extra steps into hers. I am sure if she just worked on starting off her run with a different foot she would take less, but that is for her coaches to work on with her. Yes, it adds up and it bugs me sometimes if I let it get to me, but I don't want to coach her. Not sure if it is an issue at the optional level or not. If it isn't, maybe that is why they aren't worrying about it now? I do know that when she did have a coach that made a big deal about only 1-3 steps, she would get confused and frustrated. I would just leave it to her coaches.

As to using the whole floor, I do not think there is a requirement for that. I have seen littles just use what they need to, as long as they are doing the floor pattern correctly.
 
lilgymmie7,

Yes, I think they get .10 deduction for anything over 3 steps on each pass. Not 100% sure if it is every tumbling pass (dive roll, FHS and ROBHSBHS) or not. My daughter takes extra steps into hers. I am sure if she just worked on starting off her run with a different foot she would take less, but that is for her coaches to work on with her. Yes, it adds up and it bugs me sometimes if I let it get to me, but I don't want to coach her. Not sure if it is an issue at the optional level or not. If it isn't, maybe that is why they aren't worrying about it now? I do know that when she did have a coach that made a big deal about only 1-3 steps, she would get confused and frustrated. I would just leave it to her coaches.

As to using the whole floor, I do not think there is a requirement for that. I have seen littles just use what they need to, as long as they are doing the floor pattern correctly.

Trust me, I do not coach C. However as a teacher, I have taken enough psych. courses to know that all kids do learn differently. DD learns best when she experiences/feels the move. Also she thinks she is doing it right at first take. After assessing she cleans up her mistakes. I have seen that in the classroom many times. Her floor coach just 'tells' the girls what to do, but not all girls are apt to do 'it' without breaking it down, feeling 'it, etc. Plus I heard one parent complain about what the coaches have said to her DD about not cleaning up mistakes. It is my job in that respect to help DD avoid that negativity. Since I heard it on here about the steps, I thought to ask further. C honestly thought she had to run into the passes not step into them. She can do her passes with no steps at all. Her front tuck is from a punch when in complex, etc. It shouldn't cause her confusion. But thank you Mariposa.
 
If I could figure out what the judges want at any level I could make big money!! LOL.

she has some good skills there as a mom who has many years of bleacher blisters but not a judge I could see some extra steps after the tumble here and there which could be a tenth for each step. Some areas extra steps going into the tumbling. I saw some areas that needed the pointed toe that weren't pointed or the legs togther that has some seperation. nothing really big just alot of small easy to fix stuff.

The best place to ask this is your DD's coach they know exactly where most of the deductions were.
 
If I could figure out what the judges want at any level I could make big money!! LOL.

she has some good skills there as a mom who has many years of bleacher blisters but not a judge I could see some extra steps after the tumble here and there which could be a tenth for each step. Some areas extra steps going into the tumbling. I saw some areas that needed the pointed toe that weren't pointed or the legs togther that has some seperation. nothing really big just alot of small easy to fix stuff.

The best place to ask this is your DD's coach they know exactly where most of the deductions were.

Thank you! I plan to email them. I carpool and run in to pick DD and her teammate up and we get home. I also have tended to wait until the coaches informed me of these things and then reacted to talk with DD which her coaches appreciate. But since I heard about the extra steps after I (JBS) posted her video, I thought to ask. She looks good to me, so I never would have thought at all about the steps. Why I didn't think before is beyond me! I tend to loose focus at times, so I have been told.
 
Thank you! I plan to email them. I carpool and run in to pick DD and her teammate up and we get home. I also have tended to wait until the coaches informed me of these things and then reacted to talk with DD which her coaches appreciate. But since I heard about the extra steps after I (JBS) posted her video, I thought to ask. She looks good to me, so I never would have thought at all about the steps. Why I didn't think before is beyond me! I tend to loose focus at times, so I have been told.

please don't do that. it really doesn't matter what the scores are. all that matters is that your daughter continues to improve. coaches HATE to be bothered with those kind of questions given all the variables of a competition ie; judges have bad days too.:)
 
Trust me, I do not coach C. However as a teacher, I have taken enough psych. courses to know that all kids do learn differently. DD learns best when she experiences/feels the move. Also she thinks she is doing it right at first take. After assessing she cleans up her mistakes. I have seen that in the classroom many times. Her floor coach just 'tells' the girls what to do, but not all girls are apt to do 'it' without breaking it down, feeling 'it, etc. Plus I heard one parent complain about what the coaches have said to her DD about not cleaning up mistakes. It is my job in that respect to help DD avoid that negativity. Since I heard it on here about the steps, I thought to ask further. C honestly thought she had to run into the passes not step into them. She can do her passes with no steps at all. Her front tuck is from a punch when in complex, etc. It shouldn't cause her confusion. But thank you Mariposa.

But it is coaching when you work with them on skills or tell them how to do skills/routines. So tempting (and I remember doing it when my DD was a level 4 and at a gym that wasn't coaching her well at all), but a slippery slope for sure. When you coach them from home (and any teaching them or corrections really is coaching) it interferes with the relationship between coach/athlete and causes confusion for the child as to who to listen to "Do I do what my mom told me or my coach?" And often at the compulsory level, some gyms don't always worry about fitting exactly into the compulsory mold. If the coaches aren't concerned with it and you trust their philosphy and coaching, then let it go. Because sitting with her and telling her to change her run into tumbling passes IS coaching.

If it concerns you that much, I would email the coaches and let THEM decide how to best deal with it.
 

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