WAG Discussion of abuse in USAG - Nassar

[Sk8ermaiden]

That "Sorry, except I really didn't do anything wrong, I'm a victim of his manipulation too" apology is disgusting. She works in a psychologist position for the national team? And her first inclination was NOT to believe a woman when she said she was sexually assaulted. Gross. Gross. I'm all for people being allowed to apologize and grow, but someone in her position has NO excuse not to know better and do better. She shouldn't ever work with young girls again. Her non apology shows she still doesn't think she was wrong to doubt a SA survivor coming forward, only that she wished she knew at the time that it was true, so she didn't embarrass herself. Ugh. I have recommended her products to a friend. I won't make that mistake again.

 

[bookworm]

That "Sorry, except I really didn't do anything wrong, I'm a victim of his manipulation too" apology is disgusting. She works in a psychologist position for the national team? And her first inclination was NOT to believe a woman when she said she was sexually assaulted. Gross. Gross. I'm all for people being allowed to apologize and grow, but someone in her position has NO excuse not to know better and do better. She shouldn't ever work with young girls again. Her non apology shows she still doesn't think she was wrong to doubt a SA survivor coming forward, only that she wished she knew at the time that it was true, so she didn't embarrass herself. Ugh. I have recommended her products to a friend. I won't make that mistake again.

THIS X 1000!!! That was my point on "Doc Ali" and her "apologies"...they were excuses , nothing more, and Sk8ermaiden you are so correct...a psychologist in her position working for the NT with young girls and doesn't believe them?! If I were Perry, it would have taken me half a second to relieve Doc Ali of her duties, with cause, effective yesterday.

 

[Mish]

Can we pin this whole thread so that it is available for reference for everyone going forward?

 

[bogwoppit]

Can we pin this whole thread so that it is available for reference for everyone going forward?

Will do.

 

[tomtnt]

That "Sorry, except I really didn't do anything wrong, I'm a victim of his manipulation too" apology is disgusting. She works in a psychologist position for the national team? And her first inclination was NOT to believe a woman when she said she was sexually assaulted. Gross. Gross. I'm all for people being allowed to apologize and grow, but someone in her position has NO excuse not to know better and do better. She shouldn't ever work with young girls again. Her non apology shows she still doesn't think she was wrong to doubt a SA survivor coming forward, only that she wished she knew at the time that it was true, so she didn't embarrass herself. Ugh. I have recommended her products to a friend. I won't make that mistake again.

sounds like they only cared that she made sure the girls were able to perform. Doesn't sound like she did much for their mental health with regards to potential eating disorders, sexual/verbal/emotional abuse from caoches, etc.

 

[GymFan96]

Shawn has posted a very well spoken statement on YouTube. Not identifying herself as a victim, but criticizing USAG. She says “USAG failed these girls so badly” and that they were so consumed with winning that they ignored the fact that the people they deal with are children.

It was so much more heartfelt and sincere sounding that anything Nastia has said.

I hope Shawn wasn’t a victim and have a feeling that if she was, she would say something. She’s very open about her private life on YouTube. With the exception of Dantzscher, it does look like Nassar started small and then moved on to the “stars” as he got bolder and more brazen.

Does anyone remember Nassar saying on the Gymcastic podcast that Bela banned him from the Ranch for 6 months or something? He says it was over a dispute about simeone else saying that he’d criticized Bela, but I wonder if Bela just had a bad feeling about him?

 

[bogwoppit]

Does anyone remember Nassar saying on the Gymcastic podcast that Bela banned him from the Ranch for 6 months or something? He says it was over a dispute about simeone else saying that he’d criticized Bela, but I wonder if Bela just had a bad feeling about him?

Maybe it just takes one abuser to spot another?

 

[profmom]

sounds like they only cared that she made sure the girls were able to perform. Doesn't sound like she did much for their mental health with regards to potential eating disorders, sexual/verbal/emotional abuse from caoches, etc.

This is an excellent point. I don't know for sure, but I really wonder if the young women who saw her for counseling were properly informed or understood that she was not acting as a general psychological counselor but rather as an agent of USAG whose specific goal was to facilitate better and more consistent performance? I don't know much about psychology as a field, but it seems like in a situation where confusion about the agenda is a reasonable possibility, full revelation and appropriate consent should be pursued. I also wonder if the usual expectation of confidentiality of counseling revelations was respected, and if not, if those counseled were informed.

[I emphasize that these are genuine questions, not an attack.]

 

[Deleted member 18037]

I would hope that folks considering her Head Games enterprise would reconsider any support for this woman....

Not one penny.

That she felt more inclined to support and believe the colleague then multiple children. ........ children she professes she wants to help.

Not a penny

 

[Jenny]

The list of people who need to fall is just growing by the day. Klages and the Karolyis are the big ones that need to be dealt with next. The whole USAG thing is rotten to the core. And the people posting crap about their kids being at the last camp at ranch and being sad about the end of an era. You really don't get it. You are part of the problem, you should be shaking every time you see the ranch mentioned that your precious child was THAT close to being abused. Not lauding it as a wonderful special place. It matters not if the US never wins another major medal if it meant that one person could have been saved from that abuse.

 

[FlippinPrincess]

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.usatoday.com/amp/1056570001

Ali demands independent investigation into the USOC and USAG. She says the 3 board members resigning is not enough. Agreed!

 

[PRY9]

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.usatoday.com/amp/1056570001

Ali demands independent investigation into the USOC and USAG. She says the 3 board members resigning is not enough. Agreed!

What about her resignation? How did she have no idea this was going on? At minimum, she is ineffective because these girls should have felt they could come to her and she should have known there was something major impacting so many of the athletes she was working with. She's there to make she there are no mental blocks/emotional issues impacting performance - isn't she?

 

[SMH]

What about her resignation? How did she have no idea this was going on? At minimum, she is ineffective because these girls should have felt they could come to her and she should have known there was something major impacting so many of the athletes she was working with. She's there to make she there are no mental blocks/emotional issues impacting performance - isn't she?

If you click on the link it’s Aly Raisman - I was confused at first too.

 

[2gymmies]

My heart is aching for all that these young women and girls are dealing with. My heart is also aching for all of the current US National team members that are still in the gym working hard to have their chance at a time of such uncertainty. So many are supporting the victims publicly but I don’t hear much support for those girls still in the trenches. I hear so many say that this “battle” is for the next generation but I can’t imagine how the current national team members or aspiring national team members feel. They are close to their first international assignment at a time when most of the country hates gymnastics. They’ve worked for years to be in the limelight but who knows what will happen and how their opportunities might be affected. As much as you support the victims of Nassar, I urge you to think about these girls as well.

 

[bookworm]

The list of people who need to fall is just growing by the day. Klages and the Karolyis are the big ones that need to be dealt with next. The whole USAG thing is rotten to the core.
1. And the people posting crap about their kids being at the last camp at ranch and being sad about the end of an era. You really don't get it. You are part of the problem,
2. you should be shaking every time you see the ranch mentioned that your precious child was THAT close to being abused. Not lauding it as a wonderful special place. It matters not if the US never wins another major medal if it meant that one person could have been saved from that abuse.

It's interesting that you post this because my daughter just texted me about it ....

Point 1: we're not sad at all about the ranch closing . My daughter's text was "wow, mum, if I had ever had an injury , I don't want to imagine what he would have done, and what I would have agreed to do because that's how it worked down there. Do you ever think about it that way, mum?"

Point 2. To which I replied " you betcha, I am shaking in my boots thinking of the bullet we dodged by you not continuing with elite and the trips to the Ranch" . I thank my lucky stars every day that my girls were not part of the daily growing numbers coming out of the Ranch, Michigan and parts beyond.

 

[Sk8ermaiden]

Maybe it just takes one abuser to spot another?

I just listened to the Gymcastic podcast that talks about this. When Bela took a position with USAG instead of coming out of retirement to coach Vanessa Atler, someone in her camp sent USAG a letter (she insists it was not her and that she didn't know about it, but that it was obvious it was about her) saying Larry Nasser said Bela was abusive. Bela reacted by banning Nasser for a while.

I think it might have been on here that I read that Bela's reaction when he found out about Nasser was that if he had known he'd have shot him himself.

 

[strawberries]

What about her resignation? How did she have no idea this was going on? At minimum, she is ineffective because these girls should have felt they could come to her and she should have known there was something major impacting so many of the athletes she was working with. She's there to make she there are no mental blocks/emotional issues impacting performance - isn't she?

Um, you want Aly Raisman to resign? This will not be a popular opinion. better read the article you are referencing before replying next time.

 

[MILgymFAM]

My heart is aching for all that these young women and girls are dealing with. My heart is also aching for all of the current US National team members that are still in the gym working hard to have their chance at a time of such uncertainty. So many are supporting the victims publicly but I don’t hear much support for those girls still in the trenches. I hear so many say that this “battle” is for the next generation but I can’t imagine how the current national team members or aspiring national team members feel. They are close to their first international assignment at a time when most of the country hates gymnastics. They’ve worked for years to be in the limelight but who knows what will happen and how their opportunities might be affected. As much as you support the victims of Nassar, I urge you to think about these girls as well.

I believe the main message to those girls is that no assignment, no medal, no achievement is worth what the victims have been through. I would wager that they’d give those medals back in a heartbeat to remove the abusers. It might stink from a gymnastics perspective for those current girls, but it is all actually a gift for them as young women.

 

[Sk8ermaiden]

Um, you want Aly Raisman to resign? This will not be a popular opinion. better read the article you are referencing before replying next time.

I think it was the misspelling of Aly's name as Ali (Doc Ali's name) that caused the reaction. Especially since we had just been discussing her.

 

[profmom]

I think that both Raisman's and Biles' public commitments to continuing to compete helps on that count, 2gymmies. Raisman, on this point as on so many others, nails it by saying that she won't allow Nassar or anything else to take gymnastics away from her. If a true housecleaning takes place, she and Biles could be a big part of a redemption narrative for the sport if they choose to do so. I think they are angry enough and smart enough that they won't be satisfied with a cosmetic makeover.

Edited to add -- I now want to go back and reread Jennifer Sey's Chalked Up. She was warning us about this years ago but no one really listened in a way that led to change. I'd guess most parents would agree that even achieving something as stellar as a national championship was not worth the emotional damage she had to survive both to get there and afterward. It is good to see her in public now as a healed, compassionate, successful person who has overcome all that she suffered. I'm sure that many others never got to that place.