WAG Falling forward on mill circle

[Alibri]

It took my 6-year-old L2 daughter quite a while to get around the bar on the mill circle, instead of falling back. Finally, about 6 weeks ago, she was finally getting around fairly consistently with no spot. Now, a week before her very first competition, she is going too far and falling forward 99% of the time. What could be causing this? What might she need to do to prevent herself from going too far and falling forward? She can't get up from it, and her coach needs to pull her up after this happens. What is the deduction for this? Is it the same as if she never made it around the bar at all? Or getting around with a spot?

 

[e'smum]

if the coaches touch her i think it's a .5 deduction. i think it's fairly common for that to happen with that blasted mill circle.
i think there would be a deduction for the coach helping her and a deduction for the issue with the mill circle. not sure how much though. it might also depend on the judge. there can be a range of how much they can deduct and some judges are kinder than others. we host a meet every year and i've heard the stories! the judges get very chatty with each other and there are times i want some popcorn to go with the drama. haha

 

[wandrewsjr]

There is no additional deduction for the coach helping her back up on top of the bar if she falls forward after completing the first circle. She would just be deducted for the fall(0.5). Coming up short on the first circle and falling back would be fall plus deduction of incomplete element(up to value of skill). Getting spotted on mill circle itself would be 0.5 deduction plus deduction of full value of skill. All three scenarios also could incur any form deductions on the skill itself.

 

[Alibri]

There is no additional deduction for the coach helping her back up on top of the bar if she falls forward after completing the first circle. She would just be deducted for the fall(0.5). Coming up short on the first circle and falling back would be fall plus deduction of incomplete element(up to value of skill). Getting spotted on mill circle itself would be 0.5 deduction plus deduction of full value of skill. All three scenarios also could incur any form deductions on the skill itself.

Ok so you're saying that out of the three scanarios with problems with the mill circle, getting spotted is the worst, falling back is potentially as bad but not nevessarily, and out of the 3, falling forward after completion of the circle and having the coach help her back up is the least bad?

 

[wandrewsjr]

Ok so you're saying that out of the three scanarios with problems with the mill circle, getting spotted is the worst, falling back is potentially as bad but not nevessarily, and out of the 3, falling forward after completion of the circle and having the coach help her back up is the least bad?

Yes, assuming same form on all, has the lowest likely potential deduction. And don't be surprised if it clicks back again any day. It will come back(and may leave again), very common!

 

[sce]

I could speculate why she is falling forward, but I assume her coach is already giving her the appropriate corrections. Just let it go and let her work it out.

 

[Alibri]

Yes, assuming same form on all, has the lowest likely potential deduction. And don't be surprised if it clicks back again any day. It will come back(and may leave again), very common!

Ok thanks! I was wondering why the coach was spotting a couple girls who can't get around consistently, but then just letting my daughter fall forward without a spot. Your response helps that make sense.

 

[Ms.Pak-Man]

A spot on an element in USAG L2 is up to the value of the element plus .50 deduction. They can also take deductions on dynamics which is an overall deduction, and some may take off for the lack of connection, which is a rhythm deduction (I think this is really covered in the fall, tho).

In Optionals a spot is .50 deduction and no VP awarded. Compulsory the only time you get no VP (or more) is if you omit an element (VPx2) or change an element (VP). Otherwise the deduction is up to VP, so some credit will be awarded, but is subjective. If a coach just has a hand out and gives a little stop to the mill circle, this is less deduction than a coach having two hands around a kid and supporting throughout the element. In the latter case, it would be pretty much the full VP, maybe give a tenth or two if the kiddo initiates the circle before coach steps in.

 

[Flyaway]

She will get it right eventually. We had several girls that would routinely do 2 or 3 mill circles before they could get themselves to stop! lol.

 

[EGPtriumph]

Milk circle = why? Just why? [emoji30]

 

[Deleted member 18037]

Ah the dreaded mill circle. There are going to be many more skills down the road.... The dreaded kip, ROBHS, dreaded xyz................ Skills will come and go, take forever, come quickly and disappear. Any number of things.

She will get it. And the cool thing about the mill circle, whether she gets it great or not.................. After L3 it will never be seen again.

 

[EGPtriumph]

Milk circle = why? Just why? [emoji30]

Mill not milk [emoji57] dang autocorrect

 

[SurpriseGymMom]

I coach L3. I hate the mill circle. Her coach is most likely giving her things to work on to stop herself, it is a really common thing for the girls to have to fix. Sit back and enjoy watching her gymnastics, leave the "fixing" to her coach(es).

 

[FlippinPrincess]

If the mill circle is not needed after level 3, why do they keep it? Is there something special about it that gymnasts should learn?

 

[duyetanh]

If the mill circle is not needed after level 3, why do they keep it? Is there something special about it that gymnasts should learn?

You know...it really is the beginning of kids learning to shift their hands, which becomes paramount later (said by child, not me...i have no idea and hated that skill!)

 

[FlippinPrincess]

You know...it really is the beginning of kids learning to shift their hands, which becomes paramount later (said by child, not me...i have no idea and hated that skill!)

I figured there had to be something but couldn't, for the life of me, figure it out!

 

[ayyyrial]

It's also one of the only lower-level skills that's done in a different grip.

 

[Mamabear123]

You know...it really is the beginning of kids learning to shift their hands, which becomes paramount later (said by child, not me...i have no idea and hated that skill!)

That's what DD's coach told me too. She said that the switch in their wrists help with getting up from the kip. DD just finished level 3 and still falls occasionally on that mill circle. Smh.

 

[Ms.Pak-Man]

Front hip circle is teaching wrist shift for kips, mill circle is also teaching wrist shift, but in under grip. There are lots of grip changes in different positions in optionals, so exposure when they are little is going to help with that. The mill circle is also good for body awareness in circling sills going forward. When gyms skip these skills by only doing levels 4 and 5 (and never teaching mill circles, front hip circles) they may have a harder time overall with wrist shifting, being comfortable in an under grip, going fast forward, etc. The inner ear is not accustomed to all this crazy stuff and getting the feel and balance early on is important.

Shoot-thru, another one of the skills that gets a bad rap, is getting them comfortable lifting their butt, core, and shoulders over the bar, more than they can in just a cast at level 3. This is for getting to handstand. You have to get your shoulders over the bar, with straight arms, driving heels back and lifting core while opening shoulders. In a shoot thru they get a little bit of all that.