Flexibility questions (shoulder,pike)?

[Laban]

I'll get straight to it :

1. How would one retain, or even improve, shoulder flexibility when working shoulder strength at the same time? - as these two things seem to work against each other.

2. What are some good solo drills to help reach a full pike fold? - the drills I've seen so far just don't cut it when working alone, since inflexible back and hamstrings limits my stretch at a certain point.
I need something that would weigh me down or press me, either by actual weights, but preferably by my own body somehow.

Thanks!

 

[fliptwisttwirl]

I have a good drill for the first question. Put your feet up on a spotting block and put your hands on the ground. Your butt should be over your head..kinda like if you wanted to do pile pushups. Pulse your chest in towards the spotting block..it opens your flexibility and adds strength!
Does the way I explained this make since?

 

[Mack_the_Ripper]

As for your pike, the best way to get it is just to practice it! Pike stretches as far as you can go, holding for 30 seconds. One-legged pike stretches (called "hurdler's" or "runner's" stretch sometimes) with the other leg bent can help too if you're really not flexible. You can also try standing with your hip next to a beam or counter, putting your foot up in front of you and placing it on the beam/counter. Then reach forward and try to touch your toe.

 

[monkeysmom]

Can you please dumb that down for something that could be done at home? Think "Stretching for Dummies." My daughter needs to work on her shoulders too, but I have no idea what you said other than I have some kind of very fuzzy vision of a weird handstand next to a big mat.............. thanks!!

 

[Laban]

haha...yes, monkeysmom has a point there Erin.Meisje - it wasn't all the clear from what you wrote. Plus, I would actually rather work my flex and strength at home - I don't like wasting gym time .

Mack_the_Ripper, thanks for the drill tips, but there was nothing new there. I need drills that would create some contrasting force against my own body. Touching my tows is no problem, folding completely is issue here, and I think its the hamstrings who limits me the most. Thanks anyway.

any other suggestions?

 

[iwannacoach]

Improvise/devise a "decline " ramp where you can sit straight legged with your feet at the down end and your bum towards the uphill end. Take any thing you can find that weighs about ten lbs/ 4.4 Kg and sit straight up with the weight on your shoulders at the base of your neck. Better yet, start with 5 lbs just to be on the safe side. Bend forward slowly, taking at laest three counts to get to the limit of YOUR flexibility. Come back up in a three count pace and repeat for up to 20 repetitions. increase the weight when you are totally adjusted to 20 reps with five pounds and at least one day into this drill. Move up in small weight increments and never produce pain by over stretching. What you should feel is fatique slowly building in the muscle as it warms up, tires, and then relaxes. You should "feel" at least a small improvement in your ability to pike comfortably where before you really felt at your limit. In other words, pre-drill (before today) pike and post drill pike are equal in angle, but the post drill pike will feel comfortable.

So try it my way with out any "attitude" for one week. Do it just as described above with-in the following boundaries;

Absolutely no pain, the only thing you should feel is the work, the tiring of the hams and lower back, and an increased comfort level at your maximum range of motion.

You should notice an increase in your pike stretch range of motion by the end of 1st week, and a huge increase some time during the third week once you've begun to strengthen you low back muscles and glutials.

Never increase your weight by more than 5 lbs in a single day, and not until you can do 20 reps with the strictest form and rythm.

Follow each drill with 30 seconds on each leg and center on straddle stretch x 2, and while stretching keep in comfortable.


This drill will increase the muscle's flexibility, strength, and "useful strength" at the range of motion limit. If you avoid painfull stretching you will improve the muscle's overall health and reduce potential for injuries to the muscle. So as you're reading this you're probably begining to wonder about the first part of your question. I'd like to answer that from the basis of my wealth of experiences in competitive weight lifting and collegiate gymnastics, both at the highest levels available considering my young age when lifting weights, which happened before gymnastics.

In a nut shell....yes you can increase strength and flexibility. IMO and experience they are not only able to co-exist, but they are in a sense....co-benificial, maybe even co-dependant. Maybe I'm a freak and cannot be looked at as an example, but when I started training to be a competitive lifter I was shown this exercise with a broom stick, that I could do with my hands slightly less than shoulder width apart. It goes like this.... With a broom stick held in front of you in an over-grip (think handle bars) about 2 1/2 or 3 shoulder width apart....Hyper extend as much as possible at your elbows and starting the bar at your hips, raise it slowly to an overhead position and continue on until it rests on your lower back, KEEP YOUR ARMS STRAIGHT YOU SLACKARD!!!, because being able to keep them straight means you have not put your hands too close together for a healthy exercise, and that's as important as knowing which side of your toast should get buttered...It's really a big deal........Anyway you move your hands fractionally closer on each repetition until you start to feel some effort to keep your arms locked out. Remain at this spread until the effort is reduced, then move them in slightly more. You can go up to 50 reps on this one as long as you feel absolutely NO PAIN, NO TWINGE, or any other sensation that is uncomfortable. If you do go into the pain range you will most likely irritate your long bicepts tendon and think it's just a little pain and you can handle it. If that's your thinking you should probably forget the whole shoulder strength bit all together, because it's easier to eat corn on the cob with no teeth than it is to back swing rings and p bars when you have tendonitis in that long head tendon. Oh yeah, forget the planche and inverted cross too, unless you like surgery. Sorry for the rant, but I hate to see gung ho people get hurt by their own enthusiasm. Do it all gradually and remember it doesn't matter how fast you are if you can't stay in the race.


Private Message me if you have any questions.....(See dunno, I do know how to spell.)

 

[Laban]

Thanks a lot iwannacoach! I never expected such an elaborated reply

I hope I'll be able to try that pike exercise you've mentioned - as I'm not sure I'll be able to come up with the proper ramp and weights.

About the broomstick exercise - I've heard of it and been doing it occasionally. Most times I actually use a towel instead, as it is easier for me. The closest I can hold is slightly wider than shoulder length, which is somewhat like a wide hold on the pull-up bar or a hand-towel's length. Even then, it hurts a bit, and when I go back to front, there's a clicking sound in my left shoulder - but yes, I'm exactly like those "gung ho people" you've mentioned...at least I know it's bad for me.
I still don't see how this exercise works strength? I've heard about it solely in the context of flexibility.

Thanks again!

 

[Laban]

Thanks a lot iwannacoach! I never expected such an elaborated reply

I hope I'll be able to try that pike exercise you've mentioned - as I'm not sure I'll be able to come up with the ramp and weights.

About the broomstick exercise - I've heard of it and been doing it occasionally. Most times I actually use a towel instead, as it is easier for me. The closest I can hold is slightly wider than shoulder length, which is somewhat like a wide hold on the pull-up bar or a hand-towel's length. Even then, it hurts a bit, and when I go back to front, there's a clicking sound in my left shoulder - but yes, I'm exactly like those "gung ho people" you've mentioned...at least I know it's bad for me.
I still don't see how this exercise works strength? I've heard about it solely in the context of flexibility.

Thanks again!

 

[iwannacoach]

A towel is "way 2nd best" becaue a towel allows too much movement in your hands and wrists. The exercise is only to promote flexibility in that specific motion, but it works more of the muscles involved in the shoulder girdle than any other I've found. I did not intend you to think of this as a strength exercise. If You're gung ho you can come up with some that make sense to you. Do what ever weights you want to build strength, follow that with 25% of max going to the extremes of the motion used for your strength work out. That will help increase the flexibility in that particular range.