Off Topic From the source: whats in pet food

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My labrador retriever developed what we found out is a grain allergy. The signs were her elbows lost fur, and she was practically eating her paws when she laid down for over 5 minutes. After being offered a $70.00 bag of pet food by the vet I decided to look into feeding alternatives. I saw a lot of DISGUSTING things about what's in petfood, but chalked a lot of it up to internet hype, haters, hippies :p, etc. Then I talked to my dad this week. He is part owner of a company that owns slaughterhouses and rendering plants in the western U.S. I went to him for the inside scoop, to confirm or debunk what I read. I grew up only knowing that some of what was made went to people, animal feed, and products like rubber. This is going to end up a loooong post. What he told me is nasty, so don't read if you're squeamish.

How it works is there's a big vat of byproduct 'soup'. What goes in that soup is roadkill, euthanized animals and roadkill from animal control, diseased parts of animals brought to slaughter, and expired meat and bread products from stores. It goes in as is, packaging (styrofoam & plastic), feathers, fur, hide, body bags, flea collars, etc. The explicit examples he gave me of diseased parts were abscesses and cancerous lungs and kidneys. What sticks out to me is they can cut those out with the legally required amount of additional tissue and continue to process the sick animal for human consumption.

It gets boiled to an insane temperature for a pre set time, then cools so a layer of fat forms on the top. The fat is scraped off and is sold as a separate product. 'Soup' goes into food as meat byproduct, the fat is sprayed onto it after to make carnivorous animals think it's tasty. It goes into herd animal feed too, but that gets a different treatment to make it palatable to them. This is all legal and standard. When I told my dad how disgusting that is he said food companies want a uniform product, you do what's legal and you do it like the rest of the rendering plants or you don't make money. Now I know how I did both gym and dance I guess. Plants that make a higher quality product aren't the same as the pet soup generic slaughterhouses at least.

I asked him if our family dog made it to 17 and a half years on this junk. He said nope, her food was no byproduct or grain and had USDA grade meat sources. Right back to $50-$70 a bag food, great. Marketing and advertising concerns are obviously the reason the media could care less. Though pet food recalls speak for themselves in the worst cases of vileness I suppose. I told him I was going straight to the internet and any pet owner I know with this, so obviously he named no names of buyers. If there's byproducts and no USDA grade meat source label it's a safe leap of logic to know what's in the food.

All my google-fu knowledge led me to change to a holistic vet. I told the vet what my dad had told me, and about getting insanely expensive food as my fix. (I don't have a vet in the family, so this is strictly his word I'm going by. Google may illuminate the truth of this claim, but I've made my choices so I'm done) He told me major manufacturers of pet food are consulted in the textbooks in veterinary school classes. They are essentially 'writing the book'. Their experts are also invited to give lectures on animal nutrition on lots of campuses. Then everyone graduates and gets sent all kinds of samples to push on pets at the office when they visit. Go figure!

So I'm sure lots of people may already know or had read what I wrote elsewhere. For those that didn't know or chalked it up to hype, there it is! I did feel compelled to write it because I'm sure how I feel about my pet is how others feel, and I was really disturbed.
 
God I have to stop eating dog biscuits! Gag....

Seriously though I have heard this before, ihave a good friend who has a husky/wolf cross thing way up in the Yukon and she only feeds it meat. Other wise the poor doggy's fur falls out, not good in the cold.
 
Wow.

I don't currently have a dog, but I've been thinking about getting one.

Good to know all this.

So what are the non-revolting brands of pet food?
 
God I have to stop eating dog biscuits! Gag....

Seriously though I have heard this before, ihave a good friend who has a husky/wolf cross thing way up in the Yukon and she only feeds it meat. Other wise the poor doggy's fur falls out, not good in the cold.

Wow that dog must look amazing! I've always thought Huskies are beautiful and smart. I only ruled that breed out because the weather here is too terrible in the summer imo. Meat is what I started feeding my dog too. I spent $38.00 for three weeks of food. Honestly $70 every three weeks or so would've been rough! If I had money to burn I would probably have done it. Big dogs and big servings make pricey food no fun. There are bonuses to the raw diet though!

Here's Annakins first day with the chicken part of her food
YouTube - annakineating.MOV

Wow.

I don't currently have a dog, but I've been thinking about getting one.

Good to know all this.

So what are the non-revolting brands of pet food?

These are the two I was considering for my dog:

CANIDAE® All Natural Holistic Dog Food - Grain Free All Life Stages dry formula

Meat-Based Pet Food – Premium Dog Food, Cat Food, Ferret Food, Dog Treats – EVO Pet Products

If you get a dog, I have the single most awesome piece of advice to stop destructive chewing and digging! My dog ate baseboards, UGG boots, and door trim as a puppy, grrrrrr. It got so expensive it had to stop. So I called a trainer who told me to get bitter apple spray, but not to use it as directed. He told me to soak a cotton ball, put it in her mouth, and hold her mouth shut for at least 30 seconds once a day for 3 days. Then to dilute it, spray it on the wood trim. For the digging he said bury a soaked cotton ball in her favorite spots. Even diluted, she was revolted and stopped chewing and digging immediately. It stinks too, so not having to spray it full strength was nice!
 
Most pet food is junk. But not all dogs need the grain-free food and for some I think they are better off without it honestly, it can be hard on their system. I wouldn't feed my particular dog the EVO grain-free as he is clearly not allergic to grains. They are meant to be omnivores and can eat these things, the problems with the "supermarket" brands are them being mainly corn and low quality ingredients/byproducts, additives that are toxic, etc. Petsmart is starting to have a little better options, but even they don't carry that much that is great. Independent feed stores you might have a little more luck.

If you get a dog, I have the single most awesome piece of advice to stop destructive chewing and digging! My dog ate baseboards, UGG boots, and door trim as a puppy, grrrrrr. It got so expensive it had to stop. So I called a trainer who told me to get bitter apple spray, but not to use it as directed. He told me to soak a cotton ball, put it in her mouth, and hold her mouth shut for at least 30 seconds once a day for 3 days. Then to dilute it, spray it on the wood trim. For the digging he said bury a soaked cotton ball in her favorite spots. Even diluted, she was revolted and stopped chewing and digging immediately. It stinks too, so not having to spray it full strength was nice!

I guess this is my bleeding heart at play but I'd think I'd deserve what I got if I held my dog's mouth closed like that. Make sure they can breathe at least, I guess :( Three separate times? This is not good for bonding in my opinion. But I am rarely a fan of any of the alpha rolling stuff. The best training method in my experience is to not leave them alone with they are little and to use the crate if that is not possible (for short periods). This is why there's no puppy in my future for a looooooong time. I would have to be able to stay home with it. I am lucky my mom works at home so I could have that experience as a kid and the puppy could be trained but that's not going to be an option for me for a long time.
 
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They are meant to be omnivores and can eat these things,

I wholeheartedly disagree, evolution and biology show differently. They do not have flattened molars all other omnivores or herbivores have to chew grain, veggies and fruits. They also do not have the digestive tract to process those foods in any nutritionally valuable way. The intestines of an herbivore and omnivore are much longer than carnivores to process those foods. They also don't eat stomach or intestinal contents. They empty both organs out and eat around fecal matter and partially digested food. Bile is so bitter I don't blame them for avoiding it and anything touched by it.



I guess this is my bleeding heart at play but I'd think I'd deserve what I got if I held my dog's mouth closed like that. Make sure they can breathe at least, I guess :( Three separate times? This is not good for bonding in my opinion. But I am rarely a fan of any of the alpha rolling stuff. The best training method in my experience is to not leave them alone with they are little and to use the crate if that is not possible (for short periods). This is why there's no puppy in my future for a looooooong time. I would have to be able to stay home with it. I am lucky my mom works at home so I could have that experience as a kid and the puppy could be trained but that's not going to be an option for me for a long time.

Bleeding hearts don't fix $1100 worth of destruction. Drywall, UGG boots, baseboards, door trim, dug up saplings in the backyard, all add up. I went bleeding heart too at first. She is crate trained, and only goes into it to sleep, not during the day. You can't exactly 'put the baseboards and drywall away for puppy!' so at some point enough is enough and it just needs to stop. Bitter apple is safe for dogs, drywall, splinters, and paint chips however are not. She can handle a mouthful 3 times for 30 seconds to avoid digesting things that are proven dangers.

As far as bonding goes, my dog and I are fine despite the bitter apple, and yes, it's obviously possible to do it without suffocating her so I don't even know why that was alluded to. She's been socialized with other dogs, children, and adults. Frankly she's the only dog I've seen at the dog park that will obey a 'sit stay' command from over 20 feet away by myself, husband, or kids. Or not take food straight out of children's hands at any given opportunity. 3 is still considered puppyish for a lab, so she's well ahead of the curve behavior and bonding wise. My son learned to walk by standing and balancing with his hands on her back, and she sits at my feet wherever I am in the house. As long as it's not the bedrooms where she's not allowed. She's a very big dog and I have small kids. Having no question as to whose the boss is safest for all involved.

Here's an example of training that was required by diet. She reached her full adult weight very early, something common in large dogs given carbs and fat content of puppy food. While she was still in her puppy 'spaz' phase, she used to knock Ashley down coming in and out of the house. Not to be mean or hateful, she was just a big 73 pound dog with a puppy attitude that saw an open door. Had I not been so bleeding heart, I'd have trained her earlier. She was already 45 pounds when we got her from a shelter at 5 months. I was enamored of the puppy-ishness of it all until my daughters knees got busted wide open on the door frame by that puppy exuberance. She had to learn that she's last to come indoors. Annakin will sit and wait now until everyone's inside and she's released from a 'sit' to walk indoors. Any door, gate or entry, she sits while people walk in first. Same thing when we cross a street. She waits in a sit until I look both ways and release her from it to walk across with me. I'm so glad we did it before we had our son too! Ashley was 3 or almost four when we got our dog, had I waited until I was pregnant and easily knocked over for obedience training it would have been rough. Or waited until after, Lord knows what she would've done to Richard as a baby without training.
 
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I can't believe I forgot to include the puppy-hood destruction of the backyard sprinklers as well. Not just the heads, but the solenoids, valves, and wiring too. I must love this dog!
 
Actually dogs have been suffocated by methods of training like this, trainers telling people to hold the dogs down, etc. I have seen some very sad stories. It is not something I would advocate for everyone. I'm glad it worked for your dog. Many behavioral problems are an issue of loneliness/stimulation. Having worked with hundreds of rescue dogs, many dogs are never walked, they don't know how to sit. Dogs have to go for walks, not just out in the yard. Many dogs are just left outside all day.
 
Actually dogs have been suffocated by methods of training like this, trainers telling people to hold the dogs down, etc. I have seen some very sad stories. It is not something I would advocate for everyone. I'm glad it worked for your dog. Many behavioral problems are an issue of loneliness/stimulation. Having worked with hundreds of rescue dogs, many dogs are never walked, they don't know how to sit. Dogs have to go for walks, not just out in the yard. Many dogs are just left outside all day.

I havn't heard any stories of dogs suffocating from bitter apple, though what you can do with a lab is obviously different than what you could do with a pug or other short snouted breed. That's where common sense comes into play! It's good to know what's worked for other people and have options to choose from. I agree with you about the dominance display training being awful. A lot of well known trainers advocate it, and I have read about people getting attacked over that, but not bitter apple. One in particular stands out, a lady who did it to her german shepherd after breaking up a fight he was in at a schutzhund event. She got 100 stitches in her face.

Speaking for my dog, she's not lonely but she did require tons of attention as a puppy. My husband usually works from home, and when he has to go to the office, I'm at home. If I gave the kids a bath or made them lunch, turn around...and there's annakin with a length of sprinkler wire, gnawing away on drywall, or other nonsense. It's impossible to stimulate them 24/7, learning how to just be is something they have to come to grips with at some point. She knows how to 'hang out' now without being destructive, it took exactly 90 seconds 3 days after 3 months of destructive behavior!
 
We use the bitter apple spray for aour lab too! It works like a charm. We don''t do the whole put it in her mouth thing we would just spray it on stuff when she was a puppy. She is scared even if she sees the bottle. The one thing she loves though is bread,and you cant spray it on that!
 
Thats so interesting. My poor golden retriever doggy will chew his paws raw so that he cant even walk. It's sooo sad and we never knew why he did it! Maybe it's whats in the food we give him! Although the vet wasn't worried, and we change his food often.
 
We use the bitter apple spray for aour lab too! It works like a charm. We don''t do the whole put it in her mouth thing we would just spray it on stuff when she was a puppy. She is scared even if she sees the bottle. The one thing she loves though is bread,and you cant spray it on that!

hahaha labs are so funny! Bread? lol! Ours actually licked the bitter apple off of stuff like 'in your face, I can handle it hahaha!' She's a sassy lab, but it's limited to grunting when she has to do stuff she doesn't want to do now. If I tell her to stay when I go to the garage she grunts a whole series of grumbles but she does it lol.

Thats so interesting. My poor golden retriever doggy will chew his paws raw so that he cant even walk. It's sooo sad and we never knew why he did it! Maybe it's whats in the food we give him! Although the vet wasn't worried, and we change his food often.

Awww that's too bad! There are tests that can be done to figure out what he might be allergic to though. We had to do it for our dog, though I was surprised paw-abuse is a common reaction to skin allergies! I had no idea, I thought something was wrong with her feet.

Here's an article on types of allergy tests for dogs

Allergy Testing & Immunotherapy in Dogs
 
So it's been nearly a month my dog has been on a raw diet. She looks fantastic, her coat was always nice but now she looks like she belongs in a shampoo commercial! There were two spots on her front legs that were balding, they are nearly all filled back in with hair. The best part about it is not having to pick up the poo anymore! It's much smaller amounts, and like chalk. It literally blows away after a day or so.

The food prep is easy. The big part of her meal is always a chicken quarter, but I add things like ox tail, tongue, liver, gizzards, pigs feet, chicken necks, and whole fish (once a week) to bring it up to just under a pound and a half a day. These are really cheap cuts of meat, I can get 10 pounds of chicken quarter in a bag for $6 and the rest is equally cheap. Divide daily portions into freezer bags and I'm done with enough food to last 2 weeks. Beats $70 kibble!
 

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