WAG how old is the youngest female L10 gymnast?

[SMH]

I think it depends on the gym teacher. I haven't gotten my kids out of gym, but it doesn't thrill me that most of the classes involve some variation of whipping balls at each other.

Mine is just in 3rd grade, and they do a lot of cooperative play games, not a lot of whipping balls- their gym teacher is really good though. He’s also very supportive of her as a gymnast- when my daughter bruised the bottom of her foot he let her sit out of class for several days no questions asked, no note from me- she just said she had a meet coming and he said okay.
I don’t know how much has changed since I was in school (my 3rd grader is my oldest) but after elementary when I was in school you did not have to take gym ever again. Which is fine with me. But I do think if done right it’s a good kind of interaction for elementary kids.

 

[Jard.the.gymnast]

Mine is just in 3rd grade, and they do a lot of cooperative play games, not a lot of whipping balls- their gym teacher is really good though. He’s also very supportive of her as a gymnast- when my daughter bruised the bottom of her foot he let her sit out of class for several days no questions asked, no note from me- she just said she had a meet coming and he said okay.
I don’t know how much has changed since I was in school (my 3rd grader is my oldest) but after elementary when I was in school you did not have to take gym ever again. Which is fine with me. But I do think if done right it’s a good kind of interaction for elementary kids.

Im in 11th grade and forgot a note from my parents... they force me to throw balls with torn ligaments in my thumb. That seems great of that teacher!

 

[Freddy's Fred]

For me, one of the disconnects with the homeschool (online school) discussion here is that different people look at school in different ways. I think that most would agree the core academics are very important -- and can be met in a variety of ways in far less than 6-7 hours/day. It is the "other stuff" that different people view and value differently. Where one parent might see wasted time, another parent sees benefit. School and academics are not entirely the same thing, at least from my perspective.

And for instance, in our school district foreign language is considered core. We have daily instruction in foreign language starting in kindergarten (public school). As a result, our kids are taking Spanish V in 9th grade and graduate with near fluency. I would never give that up, but many students who are doing "just the core" in online school will graduate with 2 years of foreign language and that's it. And no art, no music, no psychology, etc. I do think it is a shame. I know that there are others homeschooling who are providing amazing integrated experiences for their children. It's this notion of doing the minimum that I find questionable.

 

[Freddy's Fred]

I see a lot of parents post (on different pages) about how ‘clever’ they are for getting their elementary aged kids out of gym class in school- so they don’t get hurt for their ‘real’ sport. I don’t get it. My kid loves gym and gets exposure to other sports, learns a kind of cooperation she won’t in gymnastics, and gets to interact with her peers in a way she doesn’t in the classroom. I think it’s valuable. I can understand high school aged kids opting out of gym, but for elementary, I think it’s important.

my gymnasts love PE!! And it's kind of fun to dazzle your classmates with your abilities (strength, speed, flexibility) since they have no clue what gymnastics is about anyway.

 

[Flyaway]

One thing I don’t get about the arguments about hours vs school vs high level gym is.. why? Just why would you ever want your young child training so many hours a week?

I’ve personally seen a six year old who trained over twenty hours a week. She was an outlier, but 7? 8? It was almost normal to train 20+. We homeschool because we want to- academically it became a better fit for my kids, so I’m not bashing homeschooling, and we spend NOwhere near a full 7 hours a day on school, so I’m not saying you can’t get it done more quickly at home. Homeschool has not been a hindrance to my kids education in any way.

But, I worry when school is at the gym. It’s way too much of a kids life wrapped around one place that isn’t their home... a place they may want to/be forced to leave- and the people there with it. Burnout, injuries, no time for free play, school at gym... what is the benefit? Some people say they’d have to slow their kids down on purpose to avoid all that. Ok. Why not? I can’t imagine the damage to the body with 5-10 years of L9+ skills on it 5-7 days a week. It just doesn’t seem worth the rush. Not to me, in my opinion.

...which brings us back around to my original question - why rush to upper levels at such a young age where 20+ hours/week is not only normal but probably needed to safely perform skills? Again, I believe I point the finger firmly at the gymnastics culture that we (meaning the US specifically) have arrived at since we began winning with very young girls. Families who have talented girls who could go far feel they cannot buck they system because they risk their gymnast's success... and at this point that's probably a true risk. Culture change is SO hard, especially when winning is involved and the pool of athletes and families willing to do whatever it takes and have the resources to do so is so large.

 

[LJL07]

...which brings us back around to my original question - why rush to upper levels at such a young age where 20+ hours/week is not only normal but probably needed to safely perform skills? Again, I believe I point the finger firmly at the gymnastics culture that we (meaning the US specifically) have arrived at since we began winning with very young girls. Families who have talented girls who could go far feel they cannot buck they system because they risk their gymnast's success... and at this point that's probably a true risk. Culture change is SO hard, especially when winning is involved and the pool of athletes and families willing to do whatever it takes and have the resources to do so is so large.

It's really not developmentally great for very young kids to be in the gym 20+ hours a week. I'm sure there may be some extremely focused and driven outliers, but for the most part I don't like this trend at all. Unfortunately it looks like it is here to stay. It's hard for me to put myself in the shoes of a 7 or 8 year old as an adult, but it sounds very exhausting.

 

[gymgal]

And for instance, in our school district foreign language is considered core. We have daily instruction in foreign language starting in kindergarten (public school). As a result, our kids are taking Spanish V in 9th grade and graduate with near fluency. I would never give that up, but many students who are doing "just the core" in online school will graduate with 2 years of foreign language and that's it. And no art, no music, no psychology, etc. I do think it is a shame. I know that there are others homeschooling who are providing amazing integrated experiences for their children. It's this notion of doing the minimum that I find questionable.

Most of the online schools require electives all throughout the grades. And yes, music and art are required at some point up through middle school. High schoolers can choose to focus on other areas instead but they are still required to take electives to meet the minimum credits required for graduation and be competitive for college applications. This is true whether the student is online, traditional, or homeschooled. Another thing to keep in mind is that often, high level athletes (or other talent driven students) utilizing alternative schooling can also school at least part of the summer to be able to spread out those hours and courses. College athletes often need a 5th year and take summer classes to reduce the workload during the year.

Foreign languages? Most students across the country are graduating with only 2 years of languages regardless of their athlete status and most colleges only require that. Why? Because the two years provides the benefit to the brain development and demonstrates the student's ability to adapt and learn but recognizes that most students have no desire to spend the time involved to become fluent, especially if there is no necessity for it - no plans to go into a field where it would be helpful. For those who are interested, they can continue to pursue it in college. What you are saying sounds great but break it down - These students start learning this language in K and it takes them all the way to 12th grade to become "near fluent"? Does that sound like a good use of time and money? Personally, I don't. Especially when you considering most of these students will forget most of it within a few years of graduation. Use it or lose it.

It really comes down to - to each his/her own. I personally think it's a shame that calculus in not a requirement for high school graduation. Much more than any art or music appreciation course. But that's just me because I am a math/science geek.

 

[Freddy's Fred]

Most of the online schools require electives all throughout the grades. And yes, music and art are required at some point up through middle school. High schoolers can choose to focus on other areas instead but they are still required to take electives to meet the minimum credits required for graduation and be competitive for college applications. This is true whether the student is online, traditional, or homeschooled. Another thing to keep in mind is that often, high level athletes (or other talent driven students) utilizing alternative schooling can also school at least part of the summer to be able to spread out those hours and courses. College athletes often need a 5th year and take summer classes to reduce the workload during the year.

Foreign languages? Most students across the country are graduating with only 2 years of languages regardless of their athlete status and most colleges only require that. Why? Because the two years provides the benefit to the brain development and demonstrates the student's ability to adapt and learn but recognizes that most students have no desire to spend the time involved to become fluent, especially if there is no necessity for it - no plans to go into a field where it would be helpful. For those who are interested, they can continue to pursue it in college. What you are saying sounds great but break it down - These students start learning this language in K and it takes them all the way to 12th grade to become "near fluent"? Does that sound like a good use of time and money? Personally, I don't. Especially when you considering most of these students will forget most of it within a few years of graduation. Use it or lose it.

It really comes down to - to each his/her own. I personally think it's a shame that calculus in not a requirement for high school graduation. Much more than any art or music appreciation course. But that's just me because I am a math/science geek.

All I can say is ugh. Ugh about your attitude towards having understanding or curiosity about the rest of the world. You know elite gymnasts from the US do occasionally travel to other countries and how cool would it be to attempt to communicate with them. Enjoy your xenophobia.

 

[duyetanh]

There are also those who abhor mathematics and live for languages and actually work in positions where multiple languages are required...none of this is said with malice btw....but I can tell you that as gifted as my kid is in terms of intelligence, she is not into math. I can already tell that Linguistics will be a passion in the future....I think that is what makes the world so great! Everyone has their own strengths and joys

 

[gymgal]

All I can say is ugh. Ugh about your attitude towards having understanding or curiosity about the rest of the world. You know elite gymnasts from the US do occasionally travel to other countries and how cool would it be to attempt to communicate with them. Enjoy your xenophobia.

Dictionary result for xenophobia
/ˌzenəˈfōbēə,ˌzēnəˈfōbēə/
noun
noun: xenophobia

1. dislike of or prejudice against people from other countries.

It has nothing to do with xenophobia. Having curiosity about the rest of the world and learning about other cultures and actually being fluent in their languages are completely separate. Yes, I am fully aware that elite gymnasts travel to other countries. Are you aware of how few gymnasts are awarded these spots? Are you suggesting that all these young 6 year olds spend 12+ yrs mastering another language (which one by the way, since they potentially could be traveling to any one of 10+ countries) in hopes that they might be one of the roughly 25 who actually get an international assignment and visit a country that speaks the same language in which they have been studying?

 

[gymgal]

There are also those who abhor mathematics and live for languages and actually work in positions where multiple languages are required...none of this is said with malice btw....but I can tell you that as gifted as my kid is in terms of intelligence, she is not into math. I can already tell that Linguistics will be a passion in the future....I think that is what makes the world so great! Everyone has their own strengths and joys

Exactly!!! And that's why we should not be trying to force the arts on students who have no interest in them. That was my only point. My comment about Calculus was made in jest. And I am not saying that we shouldn't be offering it in the schools. I am all for providing a wide variety of elective options and allowing the students to gravitate towards the courses they show the most interest in.

 

[RTT2]

Exactly!!! And that's why we should not be trying to force the arts on students who have no interest in them. That was my only point. My comment about Calculus was made in jest. And I am not saying that we shouldn't be offering it in the schools. I am all for providing a wide variety of elective options and allowing the students to gravitate towards the courses they show the most interest in.

This is so far off topic, and I don't believe anyone here intends any malice, but I think the arts are a crucial part of general education and understanding the human condition, that they should be "forced on" students, just as math (which I loathed) was forced on me for so many years! To be well-educated is to learn a broad range of subjects, not just the stuff you really enjoy learning.

 

[gymbeam]

But, I worry when school is at the gym. It’s way too much of a kids life wrapped around one place that isn’t their home... a place they may want to/be forced to leave- and the people there with it. Burnout, injuries, no time for free play, school at gym... what is the benefit? Some people say they’d have to slow their kids down on purpose to avoid all that. Ok. Why not? I can’t imagine the damage to the body with 5-10 years of L9+ skills on it 5-7 days a week. It just doesn’t seem worth the rush. Not to me, in my opinion.

Actually gym school frees up lots of time for the things you mention: home, time for free play.

So think about it...a kid goes to school at gym and lets say they practice 4 hours and also do school there for 4 hours. That’s 8-9 hours away from home including lunch time.

If they were in a regular school, they’d be there roughly 8-3. That’s 7 hours. Plus an additional 4 hours of practice at night. That’s a total of 11+ hours away from home when you also count transport time between their school and gym.

Gym school kids get much more free time than traditional school kids.

Also, having the option of gym school allows working parents to drop them at one place for the day. Not everyone can have the flexibility to homeschool or do half days at a traditional school and drive their kids to gym in the middle of the day. I feel very fortunate that I can and choose not to utilize our gym school, but there are many parent s who don’t have that flexibility.

I do agree that the down side is that when their gym career ends at any point, they need to move on to a different school. But, kids switch schools all the time and are just fine. The benefit of more time at home in the evening is worth the trade off in my opinion.

Oh, and not all gym school gyms are rushing kids to high levels. So that’s a totally separate issue not related to whether or not someone “gym schools”.

 

[MILgymFAM]

Actually gym school frees up lots of time for the things you mention: home, time for free play.

So think about it...a kid goes to school at gym and lets say they practice 4 hours and also do school there for 4 hours. That’s 8-9 hours away from home including lunch time.

If they were in a regular school, they’d be there roughly 8-3. That’s 7 hours. Plus an additional 4 hours of practice at night. That’s a total of 11 hours away from home.

Gym school kids get much more free time than traditional school kids.

Also, having the option of gym school allows working parents to drop them at one place for the day. Not everyone can have the flexibility to homeschool or do half days at a traditional school and drive their kids to gym in the middle of the day. I feel very fortunate that I can and choose not to utilize our gym school, but there are many parent s who don’t have that flexibility.

I do agree that the down side is that when gym ends at any point, they need to move on to a different school. But, kids switch schools all the time and are just fine. The benefit of more time at home in the evening is worth the trade off in my opinion.

Oh, and not all gym school gyms are rushing kids to high levels. So that’s a totally separate issue not related to whether or not someone “gym schools”.

The same hours could be freed up doing homeschool at home. That was where I was going with it, not to traditional school. I’m not saying all gyms rush kids through, but homeschool programs in our experience are a more fast paced, high pressure experience. They just are.

 

[gymbeam]

The same hours could be freed up doing homeschool at home. That was where I was going with it, not to traditional school. I’m not saying all gyms rush kids through, but homeschool programs in our experience are a more fast paced, high pressure experience. They just are.

Right but not everyone can, or should, homeschool.

 

[gymbeam]

And there are many high pressure gyms without gym schools. Gym school isn’t really the issue.

 

[kecks]

in germany there is this idea from the 19th century invented by mr. humboldt, it is called "allgemeinbildung", something like "general education". mr. humboldt thought that every individual has a unique personality and unique talents and everybody has the right (!) to develeop this unique personality to the fullest. this is impossible if the individual doesn't get the chance to practice every sience, every art, every sport and so on before they go on to train to specialize in a certain profession. hence public schools in germany to this day train every kid in every subject up to at least year 9 to make sure everybody gets the chance to explore all there is to find the parts that are their own thing. if you want to attend university you have to do at least 12 years of general education up to relativly high levels in every subject, no way out. i think this system is great and it is a really bad idea to keep a young kid in the gym for 20+ hours a week. (and i coach elite sports.) they miss out on way too many things that way. (btw homeschooling is illegal here, too).

 

[reluctant]

Dictionary result for xenophobia
/ˌzenəˈfōbēə,ˌzēnəˈfōbēə/
noun
noun: xenophobia

1. dislike of or prejudice against people from other countries.

It has nothing to do with xenophobia. Having curiosity about the rest of the world and learning about other cultures and actually being fluent in their languages are completely separate. Yes, I am fully aware that elite gymnasts travel to other countries. Are you aware of how few gymnasts are awarded these spots? Are you suggesting that all these young 6 year olds spend 12+ yrs mastering another language (which one by the way, since they potentially could be traveling to any one of 10+ countries) in hopes that they might be one of the roughly 25 who actually get an international assignment and visit a country that speaks the same language in which they have been studying?

I'm suggesting that having knowledge of a foreign language is a really amazing way to experience the world and that we can all benefit from it. I am throwing on the lens if international assignments so that people who eat, breathe, and sleep gymnastics and think their child is going elite can understand it's value. Of course I know how few gymnasts will ever get international assignments. I am just trying to speak the language of the obsessed who value gymnastics training over a "proper" education. And by the way, those same kids that are wasting all their time studying foreign language and net being quite fluent (because only native speakers are truly fluent) are also taking AP stats freshman year and BC Calculus junior year. And art, oh heavens art.

 

[GymDad44]

While I understand this discussion has become focused toward younger students at this point, our public district has a high school which is geared specifically toward students with outside commitments (listed specifically as jobs, arts like music or dance, and high level sports). All electives are strictly online, and most cores are mostly online. Freshmen are required to be on site 15 hours per week and it decreases from there. Those in it really like the school, and you end up with the same public school diploma as with any of the other high schools.

Since that's only 9-12, we currently muddle through 8-3 traditional school (7th grade) and 20 hrs/week of practice. It would be nice to have her home more, and if our gym had a schooling program, we'd be all over it. Then again, DD is incredibly self motivated in school.

 

[Peachy88]

I see a lot of parents post (on different pages) about how ‘clever’ they are for getting their elementary aged kids out of gym class in school- so they don’t get hurt for their ‘real’ sport. I don’t get it. My kid loves gym and gets exposure to other sports, learns a kind of cooperation she won’t in gymnastics, and gets to interact with her peers in a way she doesn’t in the classroom. I think it’s valuable. I can understand high school aged kids opting out of gym, but for elementary, I think it’s important.

Mine loves gym class!