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The USAG text states the the first step of the curved rn should be forward toward the corner and have the foot turned to the side If child is a rightie the steps would go right left r left leap....I am a judge and we take off in artisty for the curved run almost every gymnast! Check the text also should be looking over left shoulder whil steppinf first two steps.
Now we have two different opinions on this. Does anyone else want to chime in...please. I'm also adding a poll to this one.
This part does not seem as simple as everyone says. I am a Level 6 coach...and I sick of getting deductions for this part.
EDIT: I have heard Tom Koll say multiple times that this step does not go towards the corner. However, I have heard multiple coaches and judges say that is does go into the corner. What/who is right? Obviously judges have the final say.
This part does not seem as simple as everyone says. I am a Level 6 coach...and I sick of getting deductions for this part.
EDIT: I have heard Tom Koll say multiple times that this step does not go towards the corner. However, I have heard multiple coaches and judges say that is does go into the corner. What/who is right? Obviously judges have the final say.
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I remembered seeing something about this and I searched it. It doesn't answer the first step question though, just curving the run.
Dear Judges and Coaches,
If you have the base tape watch this part. TOM KNOLL says step should be toward the corner with the foot facting the side this is where the confusion is coming from!
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emacmommy
If you've been to any of the JO Committee's workshops, Laurie Reid, Tom Koll, Cheryl Jarret, etc. and I've been to them all at least once (Laurie was actually my first coach), then you know they preach the TEXT is the BIBLE OF GYMNASTICS. The pictures in the Handbook are not accurate, the video's released by various professionals are not guaranteed accurate. Go by the text.
And, since I am saying this and I'm at home and not at the gym, I promise I will find the wording, word for word in the Text and quote it here on this forum.
My recollection is the text states SIDE number 8 (Sides being even#'s 2,4,6,8; Corners being odds#'s 1,3,5,7) I might have that number assignement reversed.
Here is how I teach it... after finishing the arched steps into the corner facing the corner, i.e. on the diagonal, picture there is now the interpretation of straight steps "into the corner/diagonal" (zero degrees), a pure direct side step (90 degrees), or the in between step on the "gymnast's diagonal" (45 degrees). The gymnast's diagonal is the correct interpretation of Tom Koll's comments. I'm almost sure of it.
I draw a curved line on the floor with x's for where the steps are supposed to be. This seems to have helped with those that want to take the forward step sharp turn, and those that keep wanting to take the first step with the wrong leg and step across the body to turn. I still have some careless curved runners though, regardless how they've been taught.
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emacmommy
Here is the exact lines from the Text.
"The steps should be performed in demi-plie and follow a curved pattern 135 degrees to the Right along Side 1 toward Side 3. Step Right, Left, Right (the first step moves diagonally, 45 degrees to the Right)."
Diagonally means the gymnast's diagonal, not the floor's diagonal. Stepping on the diagonal would be a straight forward step. So the answer is not forward, not sideways... but in between.
Really either of the choices for the survey are incorrect.
"The steps should be performed in demi-plie and follow a curved pattern 135 degrees to the Right along Side 1 toward Side 3. Step Right, Left, Right (the first step moves diagonally, 45 degrees to the Right)."
Diagonally means the gymnast's diagonal, not the floor's diagonal. Stepping on the diagonal would be a straight forward step. So the answer is not forward, not sideways... but in between.
Really either of the choices for the survey are incorrect.
(the first step moves diagonally, 45 degrees to the Right)."
Diagonally means the gymnast's diagonal, not the floor's diagonal. Stepping on the diagonal would be a straight forward step. So the answer is not forward, not sideways... but in between.
Really either of the choices for the survey are incorrect.
Your statement makes no sense to me. Stepping 45 degrees off of the floor's will always take you to a side. If you want to step in between the corner and the side, you would have to step 22.5 degrees. A sideways step would be 90 degrees.
However, I think we are trying to say the same thing..."towards the side of the floor." Is this what you teach?
EDIT: Above should read...."45 degrees off of the floor's diagonal will always take you to a side.
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It is a little confusing but I guess would interpret the text to mean what you are calling a side step. With the gymnast facing the corner (after the waltz step thing) if you were to draw a line straight ahead (connecting to the corner, we'll call this x) and then out from the gymnast's side (connecting to the side of the floor I guess, we'll call this z. It won't be straight out). The gymnast is upright, y, so we have a 3D "corner" with 90* angles. Stepping 45* to the right from x will the true side step if you were to draw a radian. What confuses me is "the gymnast moves diagonally" part since that doesn't really seem like a diagonal movement to me. If we interpret x to be connecting to the opposite side of the floor (if a true square was simply drawn in the corner - imagine gymnast as a dot on the 45 degree line from the corner and then connect straight lines to the side) then the 45* line is obviously along the floor's diagonal. However in the first model, I guess the 45* step towards the SIDE of the floor would be the gymnast's diagonal.)
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emacmommy
I just quoted directly from the text as it is written. Let me try and write this without any geometry or usage of degrees, or X, Y, Z. You have the gymnast standing on the floor facing the corner she landed in. Now, draw a circle around her, and label it as a clock, 12:00, 1:00, 2:00, 3:00. Straight forward to the corner is 12 o'clock high. If she was to stick her right leg or arm directly out to the side that would be 3:00. The text is prescribing a step exactly 1/2 way between 12:00 and 3:00... or about 7.5 minutes, right smack between the 1:00 and 2:00.
Does that clarify things for you... taking the overly simplified geometric language stated in the text out of the picture?
Does that clarify things for you... taking the overly simplified geometric language stated in the text out of the picture?
Yes...we teach it the exact same way.
This part has just caused so many disagreements at our club...I want as much input at possible in this thread. So please, keep it coming.
I am from Nebraska and have actually competed with Tom's gym. At meets I see kids do either one but I believe the first step goes toward the corner with the foot in turn out so it appears as if you are going to the side. I have not taught this routine for a year now so I can't be 100% certain but that's my opinion.
I'm a judge/coach/gymnast, and you always go by the text (or the latest errata). As emacmommy quoted, the gymnast steps to her diagonal, which is towards the side of the floor.
(Also remember that the most text-error laden routine can only lose up to .4, and that's if you can barely recognize it as being a compulsory routine.)
This thread makes me laugh. All I wanted was concrete proof (because the actual text is not good enough for the people I coach with) that the step goes to the side of the floor (the gymnasts diagonal)...the way I have always taught it. However, this is obviously a confusing spot for the whole country.
I'm going on record here...in my opinion:
I'm going on record here...in my opinion:
The gymnast should step towards the side of the floor on the first step of the curved run.
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