Off Topic Off Topic - Competitive Dance

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IreneKa

Proud Parent
For those who has any experience with competitive dancing, hypothetically speaking, if an 11 year old gymnast wants to try dance, would she be able to join a team in say a year or two, or would she be too old? Let's say she hasn't had any proper dance training, but she is a gymnast, so she has flexibility, strength, good body control, acrobatic skills, etc., so she should be able to apply those qualities to dance, and catch up quickly, right?
Also hypothetically, how would one go about finding a good competitive studio? Is there anything like "mymeetscores" for dance? How important is it to be at a good studio from the start? Can she take classes in a studio that doesn't compete for a year or two, and then audition for a team at another studio? Or should she be taking classes at the competitive studio from the start?
 
I have no advice but I'm totally following this!

ETA: FWIW, when my DD was 9 she did a try-it class at the local ballet company's school. They were very excited to potentially have a gymnast join. DD didn't do it, as they were going to dump her directly into ballet III, which would have trained some six hours per week, on top of her competitive gymnastics schedule. They did not want to let her do a lower level class (though perhaps had I argued more...).
 
We don't have competitive dance here in the same way that you guys have it so I can't help with that.

I've seen an 8 year old gymnast (probably equivalent to your L3-4) do well after being put straight into a RAD grade 3 ballet class.

I've seen a 14 year old maybe L4-5 gymnast take a year off then be put into Intermediate classes for ballet (pre-vocational).

The physical side of things I'd say are entirely possible to cope with with hard work and a willing teacher.
 
Competitive dance does not have the "too old" stigma to it that gym does. However, classical ballet can in terms of a "professional" type track of study. My DD tried to do both ballet and gym simultaneously but finally had to give up ballet because of the time commitment increasing as her level of ballet went up. Competition dance is much different. Dance competition websites do post results but nothing like mymeetscores.com kind of thing. I would say word of mouth would be the best way to investigate studios. I wouldn't be shocked if a gymnast made a competitive dance team very quickly. :)
 
We don't have competitive dance here in the same way that you guys have it so I can't help with that.

From what I understand, it's a relatively new thing here too, so not many studios do that. I only found one in the 25-minute radius so far.
But after watching Dance Moms, she wants to compete :D. IF she quits gymnastics that is, not both.
 
11 is fine- retired gymnasts to very well in comp dance. The best would be to look at results from local dance conventions which are happening now. If you PM me I'd be happy to help- some of the popular conventions are Jump, ASH and In10sity- if you go on their fb pages and websites you can get an idea of which studios in the areas they are traveling too are getting scholarhsip offers and titles. Like I said I am happy to help navigate- I have experience in this.
 
i think she would be able to, possibly immediately. Like gymnastics, it depends on the school/team what they are looking for. My sister used to do competitive dance. Be prepared that it can be more expensive than gymnastics. Each dance usually costs money to enter and they do multiple dances per competition, and have a costume for each one. It can add up. But again just like gymnastics it depends on the studio.

The other thing is I've noticed in the acro dances they do a lot of walkovers and bending their legs over their head, etc, more extreme than gymnastics, kind of a like a mix between gymnastics and contortion in some cases. So that is probably something to watch out for.
 
The other thing is I've noticed in the acro dances they do a lot of walkovers and bending their legs over their head, etc, more extreme than gymnastics, kind of a like a mix between gymnastics and contortion in some cases. So that is probably something to watch out for.
This is a very good point. If I remember correctly, your DD has had some pretty severe back issues in the past? (I could be confusing you with somebody else though). But if it is her, that may be something you want to consider very carefully. I had a teammate who did competitive dance and gymnastics, and she always had bad back issues. I took a few acro classes at a local dance studio for fun, and afterward, my back was killing me. We spent most of the time doing walk overs and limbers. However gymnastics should carry over to dance very well. It'll take some time for her to get accustomed to the different turning technique but she should catch on pretty quickly.
 
So I clicked through briefly on those other forums. It is amazing how many of the questions, issues, stories, etc. are so similar to the same things we discuss on this forum!
 
My dd13 has been a competitive dancer for the past 8 years, and my dd12 switched from comp dance to gym last summer. I have to admit, the change from dance to gym was very challenging for her, but the gymnasts who joined the dance team seemed to transition much easier.

There are as many different styles of dance studios out there as there are gyms, if not more. Many studios will take a gymnast onto team immediately and then work with her to get the ballet up to par. Other, more intense studios, will make a new dancer take technique classes for a year or more before auditioning for the team. But anyone with flexibility, strength, focus, and the desire to learn is very likely to make a team and do well there. And the more good quality ballet training she can get, the better!

We started at a small studio and stayed there for 10 years. They did a good job giving dd13 a strong foundation in dance. Last year she really wanted to ramp up her training levels and hours, so this year we switched to a studio with more teens and more technique classes. Our decisions were based on her goals. What would your daughter's dance goals be? To have fun and compete with a team?

www.dancemom.com is a great resource - I've been a member there for years and have learned a lot. They have a forum called Find a Dance Studio, and if you are willing to post your general area, the members will give you recommendations based on what your daughter's goals are. Also, if you want to go to a dance competition to watch and learn, check out www.dancecompetitionhub.com and use their search function to find competitions in your area to view. (And most have no admission charge - what a shock that was to me when we went to our first gym meets last year!)

And although the comp dance world has its fair share of CDMs, it's really nothing like what you see on Dance Moms the show!
 
This is a very good point. If I remember correctly, your DD has had some pretty severe back issues in the past? (I could be confusing you with somebody else though). But if it is her, that may be something you want to consider very carefully. I had a teammate who did competitive dance and gymnastics, and she always had bad back issues. I took a few acro classes at a local dance studio for fun, and afterward, my back was killing me. We spent most of the time doing walk overs and limbers. However gymnastics should carry over to dance very well. It'll take some time for her to get accustomed to the different turning technique but she should catch on pretty quickly.

Well, yes. That's the reason we are even considering quitting gymnastics. But she doesn't want to try any other sports. The only thing she is willing to try is dance. So, I figured if choosing between two evils, dance would be better than gymnastics. There are different styles of dance, so maybe we can avoid acro as much as possible. I guess it would depend on the studio, and their willingness to work around her issues.
 
Starting young doesn't matter as much in dance as it does in gym - in my area, many teams would be thrilled to take her because of her tricks. However, watch out for that because you may find you're paying a fortune to the dance studio and to competitions for her to compete things she already knew going in from gym - if you join a team/studio and find that your DD actually isn't learning how to dance, and is instead tumbling all the time, you need to reevaluate.

If the training is good, your DD will pick up very quickly and will be quite advanced in 1-2 years time max (any kid who is able to do beam is more than capable of picking up how to dance IMO, the performance aspect may be harder, but physically ex/current gymnasts usually pick up dance very quickly). Warning - depending on how internally competitive the studio is, you may need to watch out for crazy dance moms if your kid becomes good quickly (they are way worse than CGM's btw because it's much easier to buy/schmooz your kid to the top in dance than it is in gymnastics).

There is no mymeetscores in dance - the industry is very fragmented, with a huge variance in quality from studio to studio. There are no skills requirements/compulsaries, teacher certifications, etc. required, so basically anyone who thinks they "have what it takes" can open a studio, choreograph some routines and show up at a comp. Some do have what it takes, but many don't ;). Competition results also don't always tell the real story either because they are highly dependent on who else is there (a medicore studio can win everthing at a comp if everyone else there is bad). Also, because competition dance is a for profit business (with all of the different competitions competing against each other trying to get studios to attend and come back to their comp), a lot of them like to spread around the awards cause they don't want anyone leaving unhappy. There is also no central governing body like the USAG, so all the comps do things however they want. Oh, and everyone "qualifies" for nationals - pretty much all anyone needs to do to go is attend one of that competition's regionals and many don't even make you do that. There are also hundreds of Nationals to chose from - so don't be overly impressed by anyone bragging about being a "national champion" ;). And don't even get me started on how they do the levels - haha.

I'd say the best way to know what studios are good in your area is to ask people you know who compete dance to tell you who they think is the best, and then start looking for examples of routines on YouTube. Dancemom.com can be a good resource too. Looking at the results at Jump, NYCDA, Nuvo and ASH can give you an idea of some good studios, but you always, always want to observe class and see videos of group routines (group routines are the most important to judge by) before committing. You want to see routines where all the dancers are good/at the same level - not one or two great dancers backed up by kids who can't do anything.

Also, in my experience, competition dance is significanly more expensive than competiive gymnastics. Around me, a single dancer doing solos, duo/trios and groups at a quality competition studio can easily cost $10K, and that's not including travel costs. It is for this reason you will see a lot more wealthy families involved in competition dance than you do gymnastics.
 
What would your daughter's dance goals be? To have fun and compete with a team?

Yes, her goal would be to do something fun in place of gymnastics if she has to quit. And she loves competing, so she would want to be able to compete.
I just didn't want her to get her hopes up if it's too late for her. But sounds like it's not. :)
 
Yes, her goal would be to do something fun in place of gymnastics if she has to quit. And she loves competing, so she would want to be able to compete.
I just didn't want her to get her hopes up if it's too late for her. But sounds like it's not. :)
It's not competitive dance, but one of the best dancers I trained with didn't start until she was 14. She was way better than me by the time our course started when she was 16 (and I was 18), and I had 16 years of experience by that point! She's also worked professionally a lot more than I have and her technique was always great. And that's without a gymnastics background!

Dance is one of those things where if you're going to be good at it, you'll be good at it whenever you start, it's only the opportunities that differ - and even then, there are always opportunities to perform even if you start age 50 ;)
 
I have an 11-year old former gymnast that just started dance. She was training level 7 when she decided she was done for various reasons, but mostly because of the huge time commitment. She was also having some back pain and that scared me! She is currently enrolled in purely technique classes, namely jazz, contemporary and ballet. I wanted her to try some classes first before she commits to a team. Her strength and flexibility are definitely a huge benefit and she has amazing leaps from gymnastics! The things she has struggled with the most include the turns (apparently they are different in dance) and her hand/arm placement. She wants to salute after every move, haha :) But, she seams to be picking up things quickly and I think she will have no problem getting on a team next year if she wants to. It is definitely a different environment than gym, but she seems to enjoy it at this point! And the good news is that the back pain is gone, but she also hasn't attempted too much acro at this point.
 
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This is a little off-topic, but I noticed that you said that your daughter wanted to do dance because she had been watching Dance Moms. My daughter periodically, when something isn't going right at gym, says she wants to quit gymnastics and do dance. I know we're late to get on the Dance Moms bus, but we just started watching it this last summer. My daughter now says there's no way she would ever want to do dance after seeing how Abby and the moms act. I'm dressing up as Abby and my daughter as Chloe for Halloween this year.
 
I have an 11-year old former gymnast that just started dance. She was training level 7 when she decided she was done for various reasons, but mostly because of the huge time commitment. She was also having some back pain and that scared me! She is currently enrolled in purely technique classes, namely jazz, contemporary and ballet. I wanted her to try some classes first before she commits to a team. Her strength and flexibility are definitely a huge benefit and she has amazing leaps from gymnastics! The things she has struggled with the most include the turns (apparently they are different in dance) and her hand/arm placement. She wants to salute after every move, haha :) But, she seams to be picking up things quickly and I think she will have no problem getting on a team next year if she wants to. It is definitely a different environment than gym, but she seems to enjoy it at this point! And the good news is that the back pain is gone, but she also hasn't attempted too much acro at this point.

Thank you! This is very helpful.
Good luck to your DD!
 
This is a little off-topic, but I noticed that you said that your daughter wanted to do dance because she had been watching Dance Moms. My daughter periodically, when something isn't going right at gym, says she wants to quit gymnastics and do dance. I know we're late to get on the Dance Moms bus, but we just started watching it this last summer. My daughter now says there's no way she would ever want to do dance after seeing how Abby and the moms act. I'm dressing up as Abby and my daughter as Chloe for Halloween this year.

Yes, DD loves the show, and neither moms nor Abby deter her from wanting to do dance. If she can't make it to the Olympics as a gymnast, she wants to be on the DM show. LOL

Love the Halloween idea! :)
 
It really depends on the child and also on the studio. Like in gymnastics dancers often start at around 2-3 years of age, and aalso like gymnastics kids who don't start until age 4, 5 or 6 can often catch up to kids who started at 2 or 3 without too much trouble. But by 7-8 serious dancers are also training many hours a week in many different subjects. If the gymnast has natural ability and drive in dance it can be done, but don't expect she will just be able to walk in at competitive standard.
 

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