Parents Question about Prep Op vs JO and advice needed

[IreneKa]

Hi all,

I'm new here, and after reading some of the posts I'm relieved to know that I'm not the only one confused by this whole getting on a team procedure.

Anyway, my daughter started on rec classes when she was 5. When she was 6.5 I realized that one hour class a week is not enough for her anymore. So we started doing two classes a week, and I started asking around for the next step to get on a team. I talked to coaches and gym administrator, and they said they'll be testing them at the end of the year to see who is ready for a pre-team. So, we've patiently waited all year. Finally, last June my daughter was asked to join a "prep op rookie" team. They said they'll be practicing 5 hours a week, and will start competing next February. No one explained to us what "prep op" meant, or gave us any other options. Me, having no prior experience with gymnastics, I though "prep" is short for "preparation" or something, so I thought that was a pre-team they were talking about. We were very excited about having so much more practice time, and about a prospect of competing so soon.
Later in the year, I was talking to the parents of one of DD's friends. They've been in the same rec class together, and she was also invited to be on the team. But they had 8 hours of practice, and they were not going to compete this year. I was very confused, why would they have more practice time, but not competing yet? The girls were about the same skill level before they started.
I talked to the gym administrator, and all he kept saying was that that's just a different program. I tried to understand if it's a better program, worse program, can we switch, but he was like, it's a different program, coaches decide who gets into which program.
I was still curious, so I started searching on the internet, and read all about "prep op" program. And I didn't like what I found. Apparently, it's a less strict program, for those who want to compete, but don't want to invest too much time into gymnastics, and they are not eligible for Junior Olympics, etc.
So, now I don't know what to do. DD is happy with her team, she loves her coaches, her teammates, loves to compete (we've been to 2 meets so far). But what if later on she'll want more, but will be unable to achieve more with the limitations of this program, and it will be too late to switch?
Obviously, we are not going to do anything until the end of the season. We have one more invitational meet coming up, and then state champ.
But should I talk to the coaches after that, and see if she can be moved to level 4 next year? Is it even possible to switch?
I just don't understand this whole process. The coaches look at the girls and decide whom they want on their teams? And if she hasn't been invited to pre-team, that's it? She is stuck in prep-op? And if that's the case, should we look around for other gyms? What would you do?
It's just so frustrating that they don't talk to you, and don't explain things to you, and you have to figure all this out on your own.

 

[JBS]

"Prep-opt." is now "Xcel".

Here is a link:

:: USA Gymnastics :: Xcel Programs ::

If you are looking for JO (Junior Olympic)...usually a more driven program...more hours...more cost...and tops out at a higher skill level...then you should try and switch as soon as possible.

If they are not interested in your daughter for their JO team...then you will have to try another gym.

Does your gym have high level optional gymnasts (Level 10)?

 

[JBS]

USA Gymnastics is the National Governing Body for our sport. There are three tracks...

Elite: :: USA Gymnastics :: Women's Program Overview ::
Junior Olympic (JO): :: USA Gymnastics :: Junior Olympic Program Overview ::
Xcel: :: USA Gymnastics :: Xcel Programs ::

AAU and YMCA gymnastics would be similar to Xcel in many parts of the country.

 

[nameless]

my lil one is only L3, so i can't offer much help or advice, but i so agree with you,

It's just so frustrating that they don't talk to you, and don't explain things to you, and you have to figure all this out on your own.

it is very difficult to navigate this sport and hard to make the right decisions, especially with the secretive nature of who moves up when and why, etc.. hang in there!!

 

[IreneKa]

Yes, they have teams all the way up to level 10.
I'm not 100% sure we want to go all the way. I mean, I looked at their schedule, and the girls at level 7-10 train up to 24 hours a week!
But I don't want to deny my dauther the oportunity to try. She can always switch back to prep-op (Xcel) if it get too much. But if she stays with this program, it will be impossible to switch to JO later on, and then she'll blame us that we didn't do anything sooner.
Is there any age limitations in JO program? I mean she is 8 now. If she is not ready for level 4 now, but will be ready next year when she is 9, will it be too late?

 

[IreneKa]

my lil one is only L3, so i can't offer much help or advice, but i so agree with you, it is very difficult to navigate this sport and hard to make the right decisions, especially with the secretive nature of who moves up when and why, etc.. hang in there!!

Thanks! I appreciate the support. Why didn't I find this site sooner?

 

[JBS]

Is there any age limitations in JO program? I mean she is 8 now.

L2 = 5 years & up
L3 = 6 years & up
L4/5 = 7 years & up

Many clubs impose there own age limitations. Clubs are very different in the way that they pick their teams. Kids that we put on the JO team at our club would never make it at some clubs...kids that we deny for our team easily make it at other clubs.

 

[JBS]

Thanks! I appreciate the support. Why didn't I find this site sooner?

Tell everyone you know!

 

[AlexsGymmyMom]

Yes, they have teams all the way up to level 10.
I'm not 100% sure we want to go all the way. I mean, I looked at their schedule, and the girls at level 7-10 train up to 24 hours a week!
But I don't want to deny my dauther the oportunity to try. She can always switch back to prep-op (Xcel) if it get too much. But if she stays with this program, it will be impossible to switch to JO later on, and then she'll blame us that we didn't do anything sooner.
Is there any age limitations in JO program? I mean she is 8 now. If she is not ready for level 4 now, but will be ready next year when she is 9, will it be too late?

My DD did level 3 when she was 9. She is now 13. I would say it is not too late but you are behind the 8 ball so to speak.

My DD has competed in X-Cel Platinum for the last 2 years. Different gyms utilize this program differently. Our gym uses it as a stepping stone between Level 6 and 7. They don't like to have the girls compete an entire season of Level 6 (really tought level) so xcel provides a way to have optional routines while being able to add skills in as they are gained. This also makes the transition into Level 7 easier IMO.

You can leave the xcel program and go into the JO program (unless your gym does not offer the option) however you still have to compete and gain the mobility score at each of the JO levels in order to move to higher JO levels. (I hope I made sense).

I agree that trying to navigate this gymnastics world is kind of crazy, but in the end it is totally worth it!!

 

[EastCoastGymMom]

You can switch back to the JO program if your gym allows it and invites her to their JO team program. They may require she starts with pre-team though, if she doesn't have all the Level 4 skills and/or doesn't know the routines. Every gym runs their team programs in their own way and has their own requirements for skills/ages/etc..., so you won't know until you ask them!

I don't understand why gyms have to make getting on team and moving up levels so confusing!

 

[lhmom]

From what you've told us, it sounds like your gym keeps their Prep-op and JO programs separate. The big question would be if they allow movement between the 2. Are there any parents who have been there a while there that you could speak to? Personally, I would not feel comfortable with the evasive answers you are getting. Just from that, it makes me suspect that they might not allow her to move to JO but that's just my opinion. Every gym is different with how they form teams. DD's gym does mainly a JO program, but has used the Prep-op Platinum level to ease the transition between compulsory and optional for the past few years (the groups test out of level 6 after prep-op and move to optionals). But unlike alot of prep-op programs I have read about, her gym has the prep-op girls go the same amount of hours as JO. Hope that you can get some answers!

 

[suebee]

I wonder if part of the gym's reason to put your dd in Xcel is related to her age. All gyms are different, but at dd's gym, it seems that the younger (preschool) girls who show potential in rec are put into preteam which leads to the JO track. The older girls (elementary school age) who show potential in rec are put into Xcel track. There seem to be very few older (if any) girls in the lower level JO teams, and I think that is just what her gym does.

I agree it's confusing though!

 

[MaryA]

Level 5 (just to confuse you even further, next year the current level 5 will be called "level 4") is the first year where you are required to "score out" before moving up to the next level, so by competing prep op this year, it doesn't prohibit your daughter from switching over into the beginning levels of the JO program. We had two tween/teen girls at our gym this year who competed Intermediate Prep Op (and yes, next year it will be called Xcell, and in some states already is) but they also did one meet at level 5 and one at level 6 to "score out" of these levels (get at least a 31) and they both plan to compete level 7 next year. So it's not impossible to switch over to JO, now or later, if that is what your daughter wants. However, it sounds like our gym treats the prep op program differently.

We have prep ops who go that route because they want to have time to do other things. We have prep ops whose parents choose this route because they want to keep costs down a bit. We have prep ops who are still struggling with a skill (kips, fly-aways, etc.) who don't want to be held back at a lower level JO till they get it, so they move over to prep op (sometimes temporarily, sometimes permanently). We have prep ops who started the sport later and don't want to be 12 years old and in a level with a bunch of 7-year-olds. At our gym, a young girl who shows interest/promise would not be "tracked" into prep op from the very beginning. If you want your DD to have the option of doing JO, I would talk to her current coaches about what her options are. If this gym doesn't see her as "JO material", then you have to decide if you want to look at other gym options or not. I'm sure there are plenty of gyms out there (though I don't know how many choices you have in your area) who would be more than happy to give her a spot in their JO program. But maybe if she's happy and thriving, that's enough for now.

The prep op/xcel programs may give less attention to detail (the pointed toes, straight legs, etc.) and less attention to conditioning than the JO programs (which is probably why your DD is competing now while her friend is not yet competing) and practicing fewer hours may also mean that she progresses at a slower pace. But my DD started out in a YMCA program (fewer hours, no springfloor, etc.) and transitioned fairly seamlessly to a private gym program when she was 10. Yes, she may be ahead of where she is now (in terms of level/skills/etc.) had she started at a private gym (she's a 12-year-old level 7) but it did give us a chance to see that she was really passionate and motivated about the sport BEFORE we started investing vast amounts of money and time into it, and she's been high scorer for her level both of the years we've been at that gym.

It is a shame that the gym wasn't more transparent about it's different tracks. I guess they were trying to avoid lots of parent conflict over who is in what track, but it's not like the parents aren't going to figure it out eventually.

 

[Krystan]

I am not a fan of this practice by gyms. You are put in "team", but not told until it is too late which "team" you are on. Often people don't "get" that there are two tracks until they sooner or later realize that there is another team at the same gym that practices more hours and goes to different meets. I understand that JO is not for everyone, and that gyms that have two options need to separate the kids out, but the secretive nature is what bothers me. For me, I realized it when my dd was in a "pre-team" and was clearly the same skill level as the level 4s, though they were there more hours, clearly getting better quality coaching, and were (on average) younger. It was after first visiting this site that I realized "what was up". I even checked out another gym that was completely willing to take my "old" 10 yo daughter into their L4/L5 group, when our gym decided to move her and a few others from the prep-op stream to L5 JO. It was the best move for her! More/better practice hours made a huge difference for her and she has really blossomed. And we're so glad we were able to stay at the same gym, because (other than the secretive prep-op shunting) we really love them there. They now have three options: JO, Xcel, Rec PrepOp (local/casual league). Often now, kids are given 2 choices when moved into team (pick either JO or Xcel OR pick either Rec or Xcel).

That being said, you could ask *why* they've chosen that track for your dd. Maybe there are valid reasons why this is a better fit for her. And maybe there ARE mobility options down the road. JO competition is not required until L5 (next year L4), so it seems there is still a chance she could be moved. Before you change gyms, I would definitely ask. As I said above, I was almost about to switch (literally had the check ready), when I decided to have a talk with her current coach, just to check what their plans were. I'm glad I did!

On the other hand, if they say they will not consider her for JO, and you would like her to have that option, switch as soon as you can to a place that will consider her. It is much easier to switch from JO to Xcel than from Xcel to JO, once you are a few years into it.

 

[JBS]

Read this thread...

http://www.chalkbucket.com/forums/parent-forum/39917-xcel-vs-jo.html

 

[gymmomtotwo]

If you think you want a JO option for your daughter, right now it's not going to happen at your current gym. They either feel she doesn't have the potential they are looking for or the JO spots are full. You'll have to move and the sooner the better. I hate to be so blunt about it, but it is very difficult (at our gym) to switch over to the JO program at a later date. You have the disadvantage of less training hours and less qualified coaches. It will be harder and harder as time goes by. I'd have her evaluated elsewhere. It's hard. They may tell you the same thing. I had one daughter stuck in Xcel and have one thriving in JO preteam. The other one was heartbroken when she was turned down for JO and has moved on. It's a tough sport.

 

[IreneKa]

If you think you want a JO option for your daughter, right now it's not going to happen at your current gym. They either feel she doesn't have the potential they are looking for or the JO spots are full. You'll have to move and the sooner the better. I hate to be so blunt about it, but it is very difficult (at our gym) to switch over to the JO program at a later date.

Thanks for your honesty! That's what I'm here for.
I've just looked and found 3 other gyms within 15 minutes drive from us. So, if our gym refuses I'll start looking into the other ones.

 

[IreneKa]

I wonder if part of the gym's reason to put your dd in Xcel is related to her age. All gyms are different, but at dd's gym, it seems that the younger (preschool) girls who show potential in rec are put into preteam which leads to the JO track. The older girls (elementary school age) who show potential in rec are put into Xcel track. There seem to be very few older (if any) girls in the lower level JO teams, and I think that is just what her gym does.

That could be the case. It's just that other girl I was talking about, who is on pre-team now, she is the same age as my DD, even 1 month older. However, my DD is quite tall for her age, she is one of the tallest on her team now, although she is the youngest. So, it might be the coaches didn't check her records, but thought she was older, and that's why she was put in Xcel.

 

[IreneKa]

From what you've told us, it sounds like your gym keeps their Prep-op and JO programs separate. The big question would be if they allow movement between the 2. Are there any parents who have been there a while there that you could speak to?

I talked to one mom of an older girl. She is on Gold level now, but she started in prep-op when she was 12. I asked her about the possibility of moving to JO. She said they had couple girls who were exceptional, and they were moved to level 4 or 5, don't remember exactly. My DD is probably not exceptional now, but with a little more practice maybe she could be. As I said pre-team practices 8 hrs/week, compared to our 5 hours.

 

[2G1B]

That could be the case. It's just that other girl I was talking about, who is on pre-team now, she is the same age as my DD, even 1 month older. However, my DD is quite tall for her age, she is one of the tallest on her team now, although she is the youngest. So, it might be the coaches didn't check her records, but thought she was older, and that's why she was put in Xcel.

It could also be that they are a gym that bases a lot of their decisions on body type.