Recruiting coaches-ethics?

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I am a gym owner and have had a problem with other area gyms recruiting my staff and eventually kids too.

My staff are well paid, have good schedules and seem happy until Gym X or Gym Y calls. They always offer just a bit more money and give them an incentive of $250 or $300 bonus for every kid they bring with them. Of course this starts all kinds of gym drama with who is leaving and who is staying since then the coaches go behind my back to call parents and tell them what a great gym X or Gym Y is. Ironically Gym X and Gym Y will lower tuition at this time as well so it is an easy sell to the parents. Then the new parents have to buy a new uniform....They jack up leotard and uniform fees like $250 for a team leotard and $300 for the warm up to make up the difference in the lesser tuition I think. (that is a different topic)

It is frustrating because I have NEVER done this. I do not believe in putting a price on a childs head nor have I ever actively sought out a coach. If they want to work for me great if not good luck elsewhere. I have an extensive recreation background, run a professional club which is rare in this business and have dozens of staff that have been with me for years.

It is getting hard to deal with this because it is our reputation on the line..... most of my staff most are loyal and have been with me for years and years.... and would not do this.... but it is getting frustrating for them as well when the kids they coached for years are being lured away simply for a bonus check for the coach at another gym. Most of these are younger coaches in their 20's so they seem to be easily swayed by $$ at times.

Would love to hear from other owners who have been a victim of this, actually done this, coaches who have done this and parents who have switched? What do you all think of a "sign on" bonus for the coach of your child?

Has anyone brought this up to USAG?
 
I've never heard of such aggressive recruiting of kids! It does sound fishy. I don't know if Usag will take an official stance on it, or if they already have though. Worth it to find out I think. The gym I work at now has a secretive stance on coaches quitting because of this. We aren't allowed to tell the kids until the last day of work, and are not to mention the gym we're switching to if that's the case. It's not a written policy, but leaving on good terms seems to matter as nobody has broken the rules so far. The gymnastics world is a small one, poaching kids and gym hopping doesn't do much for your reputation as a coach.
 
We had a recent gym owner/coach split in our area. It was to say the least unfriendly we all heard about it in the gym community.

What I wonder is when you as a parent follow a coach that ditched the last program with a short or no notice to club owner (not like Linsul said where owner knows but not kids this I understand ). Why do you think they won't do that to you again and how many times will you follow them??

No program is perfect and people leave all the time. I understand that BUT do it kindly and fairly for both the owners and kids. Otherwise what kind or reputation do you get. I know being a long time gym parent in the same area we al know coaches and kids who are labeled as gym jumpers.

I am proud of you for being a decent gym and following the rules. In the long run parents and coaches will appreciate this.
 
Where I work, when we are hired we sign something saying that if we leave, we agree not to work at any gyms in X amount of radius (maybe 30 miles?) for 6 months. As long as I've worked there, it hasn't been broken. Not sure if that's due to the fact of signing this agreement, having decent staff, or ethical gyms in the area
 
That's blatantly unethical, and may even be illegal.

Call a lawyer, see what they have to say. If they can't do anything, than report the gyms to USAG, and maybe they can do something.
 
Draw up a contract as a condition of employment they may not work within so many miles of your gym for a year after leaving. It is a no competition clause, and I think it's legal, as they are free to say no and choose not to be employed at your gym. I have had to sign one before both working for an embroidery company as they train you and you can take your skills and designs elsewhere and also as a dance teacher. That is my simple suggestion then you may have more recourse if it happens again.
 
I can't imagine another gym actually doing something like that. Talk about unethical. However, before getting a lawyer involved or making all these accusations to USAG, I hope you have proof of what they're doing. I would hate to see the reputation of another gym tarnished because of a false report. I'm not doubting what you're saying is happening, I totally agree that it's wrong on so many levels, just make sure you have all your facts straight before moving forward. I hope that something is done about it and it doesn't happen any more. Good luck and keep us posted!
 
Draw up a contract as a condition of employment they may not work within so many miles of your gym for a year after leaving. It is a no competition clause, and I think it's legal, as they are free to say no and choose not to be employed at your gym. I have had to sign one before both working for an embroidery company as they train you and you can take your skills and designs elsewhere and also as a dance teacher. That is my simple suggestion then you may have more recourse if it happens again.

These contracts are not enforceable. A gym (or any business) cannot prevent former employees from earning a living.
 
These contracts are not enforceable. A gym (or any business) cannot prevent former employees from earning a living.

Contact an attorney in your area about any contractual concerns because employment laws can vary greatly by state. Most states will protect an employees right to earn a living, but most states will allow you to contractually limit or restrict recruiting. Probably not a bad idea to review your contracts since people are your greatest assets (both your coaches and your gymnasts).
 
Oh yeah definitely check with an attorney before drawing up a contract, but honestly it is legal in most states and many people have sucessfully sued and won judgements over it. It is very common practice especailly in businesses where client nabbing may happen. You are not stating that the person cannot go on to make a living, you are stating it can't be at another gym within so many miles of yours and that under no circumstance are they allowed to persue clients to take with them. It is a free country and if they are not okay with the terms of employment they can choose not to work for you. Also the contract does not hold up if you fire them only if they quit. But yeah spend a little money to save a lot of heartache and go over it with an attorney.
 
Ethics and Gym hopping

Rather than address the ethical and legal issues here, I would address those parents who succumb to such recruiting practices. I would say to these parents that besides engaging in unethical behavior with the other gym and 'walking in the gutter(in my opinion)consider the negative effects that 'gym hopping' can have on your daughter. Yes, there are instances where it's necessary to do this. But the parent must take into account how the daugther will respond to a new environment, how it affects her psychologically, socially and ultimately physically. I know people whose kids have changed gyms four times and that was only through level eight. It didn't make much of a difference in my opinion.

Every time you move, your child has to endure an adjustment period.
This causes instability in their routine. It creates anxiety and worry. Gymnasts need stability, routine and security. Constant change and movement does not help them. I would wager that more girls are hurtby changing gyms than have benefited from an imagined "better coach" or promised lower tuition. I am not saying not to take into account those factors, just put more weight in your calculus to the importance of these intangible elements of routine, stability and familiarity which can affect your daughter as much or more than the imagined benefits from gym hopping.

Yes, I have been tempted at one time or another to gym hop. Our gym is not perfect but does have many good qualities. We have had issues with some coaches over the years, and have endured some coaching changes. But we feel really good about our situation now. We not only have, I think, some great coaches, but we live only minutes away from the gym and my daughter's schools. Our commute to school and the gym is only minutes. It allows my daughter maximum time to rest and do her school work. Now as my daughter enters level ten and her first year of high school, I can look back and be glad we have never switched gyms. My daughter had built wonderful friendships on her team and, yes, with even her coaches. She has developed a sense of pride not only in herself but for her team and our gym. Would this have happened if we had been gym hopping? Would she be a straight A student if she spent hours a day commuting to another gym in the area. Would she be as well grounded if she had to periodically abandon close friendships fostered in the gym?

So I say to all you parents: Think twice before you gym hop. Re-work your calculus. Think of your commute time, your daughter's friendships, her routine and stability as well as the tuition, quality of coaches and so on. What really is most important is your daughter's motivation and work ethic. Those qualities are assailed by change and chaos in your daughter's life. Gymnastics itself is hard enough. Keep it simple and stable for her. Moreover, you will feel better by taking the high ground.

Good luck with your decisions,

Julio Garcia,

Jamy Garica's dad!
 
The bottom line in all this is it's a business and the people at your gym are either satisfied with the product, or they are not. I have never really understood the "no compete clauses within a certain mile radius" because even if you open up a gym a mile from my house, if I am not happy with what's offered there, i will still be driving the hour to the gym with the product I like. So I guess my point in all this would be that I would really be looking at WHY are these coaches able to lure gymnasts away from your gym, besides a lower tuition? I know that I drive by many a cheaper gym because it is the quality of the coaching that I am seeking. At this point, someone could tell me that X gym's tuition is half of what you pay now and I'd stay put because I am happy with the coaching that my daughter gets so I would investigate the why of the whole situation....
 
If you read her first post she mentions that the other gyms are recruiting her coaches and also the kids. The no competiton contract would be for new coaches to sign, it has nothing to do with the customers, either they are going to be loyal or not all you can do to change that aspect is to make them so happy to be at your gym, that their coach leaving or another gym offering a discount won't sway them.
 
If you read her first post she mentions that the other gyms are recruiting her coaches and also the kids. The no competiton contract would be for new coaches to sign, it has nothing to do with the customers, either they are going to be loyal or not all you can do to change that aspect is to make them so happy to be at your gym, that their coach leaving or another gym offering a discount won't sway them.

It's kind of my point either way...what is it about the current gym that makes either the coaches or the gymnasts be able to be persuaded to leave...I would check into that and make it so no one would want to leave...
 
Rather than address the ethical and legal issues here, I would address those parents who succumb to such recruiting practices. I would say to these parents that besides engaging in unethical behavior with the other gym and 'walking in the gutter(in my opinion)consider the negative effects that 'gym hopping' can have on your daughter. Yes, there are instances where it's necessary to do this. But the parent must take into account how the daugther will respond to a new environment, how it affects her psychologically, socially and ultimately physically. I know people whose kids have changed gyms four times and that was only through level eight. It didn't make much of a difference in my opinion.

Every time you move, your child has to endure an adjustment period.
This causes instability in their routine. It creates anxiety and worry. Gymnasts need stability, routine and security. Constant change and movement does not help them. I would wager that more girls are hurtby changing gyms than have benefited from an imagined "better coach" or promised lower tuition. I am not saying not to take into account those factors, just put more weight in your calculus to the importance of these intangible elements of routine, stability and familiarity which can affect your daughter as much or more than the imagined benefits from gym hopping.

Yes, I have been tempted at one time or another to gym hop. Our gym is not perfect but does have many good qualities. We have had issues with some coaches over the years, and have endured some coaching changes. But we feel really good about our situation now. We not only have, I think, some great coaches, but we live only minutes away from the gym and my daughter's schools. Our commute to school and the gym is only minutes. It allows my daughter maximum time to rest and do her school work. Now as my daughter enters level ten and her first year of high school, I can look back and be glad we have never switched gyms. My daughter had built wonderful friendships on her team and, yes, with even her coaches. She has developed a sense of pride not only in herself but for her team and our gym. Would this have happened if we had been gym hopping? Would she be a straight A student if she spent hours a day commuting to another gym in the area. Would she be as well grounded if she had to periodically abandon close friendships fostered in the gym?

So I say to all you parents: Think twice before you gym hop. Re-work your calculus. Think of your commute time, your daughter's friendships, her routine and stability as well as the tuition, quality of coaches and so on. What really is most important is your daughter's motivation and work ethic. Those qualities are assailed by change and chaos in your daughter's life. Gymnastics itself is hard enough. Keep it simple and stable for her. Moreover, you will feel better by taking the high ground.

Good luck with your decisions,

Julio Garcia,

Jamy Garica's dad!

As a former gymnast who didn't gym hop when everyone else did, I have to respond to this from the flip side. I didn't gym hop because my coach never left. Had he left, I'd have gone to his gym in a second. Money and driving time are very valid concerns, but more on the parent side. From a gymnasts pov, I think switching equipment is a lot less rough than switching coaches, especially one that gets the best from you.

If a gym is losing coaches something needs to be looked at. If a gym is losing team coaches that walk away with athletes like the pied piper, something needs to be looked IMMEDIATELY. It's nice to think of 'the program' as a tangible thing attached to the gym, but that's just a location. Not power trip or anything, but the coaches are the program. Even leaving in secret, it's very easy for athletes and parents to find you if all they have to do is click the 'staff' link on a gyms website. There are a lot of obviously selfish or ludicrous reasons to gym hop; but I can't think of any gym associating the loyalty or stability of staying with a coach a gymnast is comfortable with as a negative.

If shady dealing is going on like this thread suggests, then that's a different story. As a parent, if some coach asked me to switch for a bonus, I'd give 'em a bonus reaming and dial tone!
 
Losing coaches to other gyms and losing clientèle in like manner has been a point of contention since day one. Its a dirty problem that gets swept under the rug and ignored by gymnastics authorities as if it will go away. Blame this complacency on selfishness and politics. The fact remains that this is an issue that needs to be admitted, addressed, and solved.

The time has come for the bodies that rule gymnastics to enforce systems and policies that would protect the management of gymnastics programs. All programs should be registered and all participants should be accounted for. After that should be a set of rules that protect our interests as entrepreneurs and program managers.

That the gymnasts and/or coaching staff of any one location should wish to relocate should raise the eyebrows of the governing authorities. Under proper guidelines and policies gymnasts and coaches should be required to apply for a transfer and should be channeled through a screening process for the sake of accountability and decorum. In other words there needs to be accountability for both the gym and the individuals.

Accountability to the gym that their program is in keeping with standards of practice. Accountability to the gymnast and coaches that their actions are not abusive or depreciates the good faith of the business.
 
Losing coaches to other gyms and losing clientèle in like manner has been a point of contention since day one. Its a dirty problem that gets swept under the rug and ignored by gymnastics authorities as if it will go away. Blame this complacency on selfishness and politics. The fact remains that this is an issue that needs to be admitted, addressed, and solved.

I think the biggest issue with the situation is the lot of people who leave gyms for legit reasons getting unfairly lumped into the 'drama monger' category with the rest. I think a good amount of the resulting drama is the angst of people getting caught up in it who frankly shouldn't be.

The time has come for the bodies that rule gymnastics to enforce systems and policies that would protect the management of gymnastics programs. All programs should be registered and all participants should be accounted for. After that should be a set of rules that protect our interests as entrepreneurs and program managers.

This is where I started getting nervous ^

That the gymnasts and/or coaching staff of any one location should wish to relocate should raise the eyebrows of the governing authorities. Under proper guidelines and policies gymnasts and coaches should be required to apply for a transfer and should be channeled through a screening process for the sake of accountability and decorum. In other words there needs to be accountability for both the gym and the individuals.

I would quit my job before I submitted to this big brother type of authority. Open up my rationale for where I choose to earn a living to some 'higher authority'? Nope! That's between me, my old employer, and my current one. A decision that will most be influenced by my family, my location, and my overall happiness. No approval process is going to dictate that for me. It's not perfect anyway, if you don't get approval, and move anyway, are you going to get pre judged and denied? Ridiculous! I'm not 'showing my papers' at a job interview like some coaching refugee for fear I may end up working in a sweatshop if I don't follow the rules like a good sheep.

What if this approval process takes forever and a move is involved? Any kind of hold up would force legit coaches/athletes to possibly have to further endure a truly bad environment due to need for 'approval' before action. Forget that!

Accountability to the gym that their program is in keeping with standards of practice. Accountability to the gymnast and coaches that their actions are not abusive or depreciates the good faith of the business.

If I was going to start anywhere with documented accountability, it would be requiring safety certifications and background checks. If the coaches all have it, the gym gets a USAG gold star of some sort.
 
This is all star cheerleading related, but still similar circumstances.

I recently closed my gym this past April, but I had issues every season with this. The gym in the next city used to recruit my students and allow them to cheer for FREE!!! They paid for the uniform and that was it. Free tuition and competition fees. I was livid.
 
If your employment status in gymnastics changes, or is about to change, or has already changed, then it needs to be recorded with the central agency. From there it is reviewed for proper forms that need to be filled out especially if you are seeking new employment. Your employment records and status needs to be tracked for as long as you are a member of the national governing body. Rules and policies need to be followed and obeyed that promote and uphold transparency, integrity, intent, and protect the private interests of teaching organizations.

If I am going to invest in you as a member of my staff at my gym then I want and need my investment in you to be productive, lucrative, and protected. I can't afford to have you go down the road to work at another gym without due process. If you move or have other issues that preclude further involvement under my auspices, then it needs to be recorded and made public field knowledge for the sake of transparency and honesty. A one year waiting period should then be instilled before you can sign back in to the sport under someone else's wing.

If you wish to transfer to another location with immediate recourse then all parties should be in accord. Otherwise you will have to wait a year. The coach in whom the club owner or organization has invested one year or less should have to pay one thousand dollars minimum to that gym in order to leave and subsequently work at another member gym. Each additional year of experience would add another thousand dollars fee. 10 year's investment in you as a coach would be worth 10,000 dollars to that gym that you have to pay if you left. Plus you have to wait a year before you start up at the new location unless all parties agree to the transfer and you want or need to start immediately. If you can't pay, then the member organization that is hiring you will need to pay your fee before you can work for them.

If a registered student who is not on staff goes down the road to take classes at another registered gym then the receiving gym should have to pay a fee to the gym that lost that student.

Gym hopping needs to be brought to a halt or slowed down to a crawl.

Lets arrest this dilemma and control it. Lets deal with it.
 

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