Round off backflip help

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Hey, I would like some help with drills for coaching round offs. I have several girls that can round off backflip but are struggling with the second backflip. I suspect that the problem lies in the round off as they are landing their round offs too low and killing much of the power. i have tried to explain the hollow body position and trying the land with their feet infront of them which they understand but when it comes to performing the round off they cant put it into practice. also they have a problem keeping tight throughout the series even though they all have excellent handstands and we work on conditioning every session. i have tried the drill where they try to miss their feet and roll onto their back but they couldnt get that into their head at all. Im hoping for some drills that i can use to teach them to land in a tight hollow position and to drive their feet over faster. also if you have any drills or ideas as to how i can get them to stay tight throughout a move (this includes handspring vaults and other skills as well) i would be really grateful.
For a direct answer - a good drill would be to use a folded up pannel mat, long ways, leading to a small gap between it and a porta pit.

Have them do a roundoff from the panel mat to the floor, and snap down hard to the floor trying to get their toes as close to the pannel mat as they can without hitting it, hands up to their ears. They should rebound backwards hard, landing on the porta pit.

However, I would work on their lunging instead. Using that same folded up pannel mat, have them do roundoffs where they have to step up onto the mat to do their roundoff. Let them feel the push required to move their body up. Then, they have to transfer that lunge and strong push to their roundoffs, and it should help with them standing taller and more hollow on the tail end.

From what you describe, you are spot on in your break down of the problem. Good eyes! It's usually the most simple thing that is making the complex skill problematic.

Good luck!

In addition to the advice of the first response I'd do hollow body position reinforcement every chance I got for tighter bodies. Like a theme of sorts, work out skills that require a hollow on (or have a hollow body drill / conditioning station) at every event. When that position becomes second nature to them and they work out their lunges they may find it easier to do the 'miss your feet' drills you tried.

If they already have amazing hollow bodies when they're not in motion, then the only way I'm familiar with to get them to stay tight is to make it an expectation 100% of the time. I do that with looser kids by having them do the skill, then making it a requirement to 'finish' it by actively putting themselves into a hollow immediately. At first they do it after the skill, but with repetition they will get a feel for doing it during the skill.

*EDIT* I thought I saw a problem about the round off lunge specifically. I just re-read the OP and have come to the conclusion that I'm crazy or confused. I'd go ahead and look at the lunge though, because if their alignment is off that could affect the rest of the skill. Have them do a round off with chalk on the palms of their hands and soles of their feet to see if it's all aligned as it should be. It's a good way to give them a visual of their hurdle and the kind of sequential order + placement that should be happening. The lightbulb tends to go off when they see the proof of what their hands and feet were doing in the prints the chalk leaves behind.
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Thanks so much guys. Unfortunately we are not lucky enough to have porta pits or things like that but im good at improvising!
Ill let you know how we get on.
There are lots of drills you can do to make the ROs better, to stretch them out and land them upright and with tighter legs. I am too tired to write them all out but if you really want some info just ask.
One drill we do for our roundoffs is to do them over something. The simplest is to use a panel mat, as it's the most universal mat to have on hand. Fold the panel mat so 2 of the panels form an upside down V, place the hands in front of the V and land with the feet behind without knocking the mat over. We also do it over octagons etc.

Also try having contests to see who can do the longest roundoff- it's rather hard to make your roundoff long if your chest stays down too long.

In general, my coach always tells us that our hurdles should be long and low, rather than upright, for the best power from our roundoffs. Working on the hurdles can anly help, as well :)

You could also put an 8 incher up against the wall horizontally. Have the girls do a round off towards the mat trying to have their feet land and back hit the wall simultaneously. This will teach them to snap up quick and be in a tight position. A way of making it fun is putting a stuffed animal on top of the mat, and seeing who can knock it down from having the most power.
A decent drill for RO turnover is the cartwheel step-in/together to 3 steps running back.

They should turn over their CW fast enough with a step-in action that they must take 3 steps back because they over rotate their feet under in front of them so they don't fall on their butt.

Work the RO turnover drills down a wedge so they get the feel of how it is to have the turnover to cause them to over-rotate it.

If they can't over-rotate their CW, they are not going to be able to over-rotate their RO.

Other drills are mainly set up to make sure they are dropping their arms from the ears as they reach down to the ground after they step through the lunge and weight transfer. Their lunge should be of an appropriate distance because if it is too short it will cause them to do all sorts of funny things like kick around the side or arch excessively, etc or step across their midline.
I concur with blairbob and ryantroop...

To train the snap down portion of the RO or handspring, I like to set up a stack of mats or a block to about waist height and have the gymnast do snap down drills. Hands on the mats, jump from the floor until in a handstand, once in hand stand snap feet down and rebound. You've probably done these before.

Some of the drills I use:
- Lunge, RO over a panel mat (hands on the mat), rebound, or slammer. Slammer = small cheese mat against the wall, land in the shape you would start your BHS in, arms slam up against the wall by your ears.
- Kneeling, RO, rebound
- Kneeling, RO, BHS, rebound
- Snap down, rebound
- Snap down, BHS, rebound
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