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Tammie

Member
Jul 22, 2022
90
44
I'm just concerned about the "you are representing your gym at all times in your life even outside of the gym" statement. Umm, yes be a good person, no you are not defined by the gym you go to.
I am sorry if I offended anyone by stating our gym hours and what we were told about minimum hours.

Someone asked about typical hours and I honestly assumed it was similar to the "how much do you pay for how many hours" thread-everyone wondered how things were done elsewhere. So I shared how we did things-and what we were told. I often wonder how other gyms do things in many different ways, it's just good natured general curiosity. None of us know what we don't know, we only know how things are in our gymnastics bubble(I recently read about a gym that did the split hours/before&after school starting in L6, never knew such a thing existed so young/early)

CB will likely be great resource for many things-including supporting & getting support from parents who understand the craziness of this sport, however as far as my initial hope(to understand things better when gymnastics began moving so quickly about 6-8mos ago, hoping another kid/parent had a similar experience(the closest I've seen is Ty's dad who seems to have done the opposite of my kiddo-tested out of compulsory(4lvls in one season if I remember right), where we will be testing out of optionals, just different coaching philosophy)-and we signed a coaching contract that stated & were told not to discuss plans with other parents in our gym-so no help there!), it seems our gym, and specifically for my kid-its different, so I'm on my own-and that's ok. I will navigate & figure it out as I go along...although our gym is notoriously horrible with communication ;-)
 

JPC13

Proud Parent
Mar 25, 2022
342
We had a girl last year in L5 doing 4hrs without Sat, she was asked to do better, they did not, so they were asked to leave and that was that. Her mother was told that it wasn't safe for her to remain, she was a liability, so that was that.

“Train a lot or get lost” isn’t a safety issue, that’s just an excuse to get rid of people — which is fine. Not everyone can be an elite path super special 12 year old level 5 Mckayla Maroney, future Olympian.

Ultimately, nobody on here really cares either way, and we’re all just trying to avoid the avalanche of… whatever these posts are in hopes of someone posting something interesting, helpful, or relevant. So, I will go back to trying my best to not engage, which I probably shouldn’t have ever deviated from in the first place.

OP — I’m sorry for my small contribution towards the derailment of your thread.
 

ReluctantGymMom

Proud Parent
May 11, 2020
326
32
I am sorry if I offended anyone by stating our gym hours and what we were told about minimum hours.

Someone asked about typical hours and I honestly assumed it was similar to the "how much do you pay for how many hours" thread-everyone wondered how things were done elsewhere. So I shared how we did things-and what we were told. I often wonder how other gyms do things in many different ways, it's just good natured general curiosity. None of us know what we don't know, we only know how things are in our gymnastics bubble(I recently read about a gym that did the split hours/before&after school starting in L6, never knew such a thing existed so young/early)

CB will likely be great resource for many things-including supporting & getting support from parents who understand the craziness of this sport, however as far as my initial hope(to understand things better when gymnastics began moving so quickly about 6-8mos ago, hoping another kid/parent had a similar experience(the closest I've seen is Ty's dad who seems to have done the opposite of my kiddo-tested out of compulsory(4lvls in one season if I remember right), where we will be testing out of optionals, just different coaching philosophy)-and we signed a coaching contract that stated & were told not to discuss plans with other parents in our gym-so no help there!), it seems our gym, and specifically for my kid-its different, so I'm on my own-and that's ok. I will navigate & figure it out as I go along...although our gym is notoriously horrible with communication ;-)
Which gym are you at?
 

katrid11

Proud Parent
Sep 1, 2020
81
47
Yep, we are on vacation now :).

I agree that 20 hrs is a lot - I think the extra vacay actually helps offset that since she’s only training 5 of 9 weeks.

The high performer program is the name the school calls it (not gymnastics specific, for all different sports). we could switch back if we wanted, but this program gives her the same curriculum and actually a better school-life balance. She is still able to do other school activities as well, and she takes swimming on the weekend. I figure the new school is worth trying this year (she is really keen and has never wavered so we’re following her lead) and worse case scenario she can return to her home school.

I’ve no idea where this gymnastics thing will go for her - we fell into comp gymnastics accidentally (invited in after doing rec gymnastics for a few yrs, never on preterm etc).
How was the vacation?

family time is totally worth it. No one knows what path their child is really on - one that leads to high level Optionals, elite, college, retiring in a year. But family memories - even small ones stick with all of us for the long term.
 
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NutterButter

Gold Membership
Proud Parent
Jan 24, 2013
884
Let's see...elite gym, California and based on the unnecessary and excessive training hours likely foreign born owners/coaches. That narrows it down considerably.

@Tammie - please be careful what you share here. It won't be hard for someone to figure out your gym and then who you are. I suggest you remove the page you posted from the handbook, especially with that crazy line about representing the gym at all times which will apply to anything you share here. Your gym seems to have no problem kicking kids out and you should do everything you can to remain anonymous. And this should be obvious - but if your real name IRL is Tammie, change your profile.
 

Kara

New Member
Jul 16, 2013
28
Let's see...elite gym, California and based on the unnecessary and excessive training hours likely foreign born owners/coaches. That narrows it down considerably.

@Tammie - please be careful what you share here. It won't be hard for someone to figure out your gym and then who you are. I suggest you remove the page you posted from the handbook, especially with that crazy line about representing the gym at all times which will apply to anything you share here. Your gym seems to have no problem kicking kids out and you should do everything you can to remain anonymous. And this should be obvious - but if your real name IRL is Tammie, change your profile.
I'd suggest removing almost everything posted, because if it's true that gym sounds insane, Tammie's daughter would be super easy to identify, and I'm sure they'd have no problem kicking out someone who posted all of this about them.
 

Tammie

Member
Jul 22, 2022
90
44
Let's see...elite gym, California and based on the unnecessary and excessive training hours likely foreign born owners/coaches. That narrows it down considerably.

@Tammie - please be careful what you share here. It won't be hard for someone to figure out your gym and then who you are. I suggest you remove the page you posted from the handbook, especially with that crazy line about representing the gym at all times which will apply to anything you share here. Your gym seems to have no problem kicking kids out and you should do everything you can to remain anonymous. And this should be obvious - but if your real name IRL is Tammie, change your profile.
You are likely right, I guess I am too trusting & never think the worst could happen-lol. Like who would track down someone else's kid or club??? Why??

I finally realized what someone else meant when they referenced that line about representation(I thought they were talking about me, like I should be more than my club-lol-i was like, well, my club is all i know). It's really a nothing burger, they simply talk to the girls about keeping social media classy, about keeping behaviors positive, always being happy for teammates, neighbors, never resentful or envious. My kiddo tells me EVERYTHING(oversharing must run in the family-lol), I agree with everything they're told.

They also always reinforce how the girls are part of a family, neighborhood, a school, a community, and a gym club, etc and the interconnectedness of it all and how they impact and represent each of these things.

That's likely where that line came from, so it doesnt bother me, to me they are teaching good things. I obviously skimmed right past it(we got a 30pg book, I skimmed past alot, Im sure)

As for training hours, I don't really find them excessive-but then again I don't know anything different(our club in another state had similar hours for optionals). My kiddo is treated different with hours, most L4s have 16hrs(one girl is also in competetive dance & some art or chess or something, shes busy!!), but we came in with a different situation. My kiddo does 28 w/no Sat & 32-34 w/sat with the expectation to test out of optional levels. Which seems to make sense-to me...I mean, if you want her to be a L7/8 this year, then her hours should be that of L7/8, right? But again, I don't know if that's too much, I know my kid looks forward to gym, is happy when she leaves/gets home, talks gymnastics with friends on days off, talks excitedly about & willingly does extra on days off, so I figure that means she's happy & the hours work for her.

Trust me, I will go toe to toe with anyone for my kid, we take an extra day at every out of town competition, that gives my kid 5-6days wherever we are(3-5 beyond competition day) to have a mini-vacation-why not, were already there! So I'm all about taking time off & will always fight for what I think is in the best interest of my kiddo-&what makes her happy!
 

Tammie

Member
Jul 22, 2022
90
44
Oh, there are 4 high level gyms in our immediate area(within 60min), 3 with foreign born owners, btw. One is known for making team girls cry regularly(but they have great LOOKING gymnasts, plus more hours than our gym too), we wouldn't go there, not a good fit!

Hence, how easy would it be to figure out? But I guess maybe if someone was determined enough(but again, why would they want to? lol...I guess my problem is that I assume everyone is like me...I wouldn't care what club someone else goes to, my gym is perfect for my kid-we picked it for a reason...so I figure the same would be true of other people & their gyms, so why waste the time? But I forget somwtimes people are weird)
 

ldw4mlo

Proud Parent
Feb 13, 2015
6,442
62
Your posts honestly confuse me. First of all, I would like to know the reasoning behind having a minimum of 22 hours for safety. For level 5/6, 22 hours seems a little excessive, how is that for safety? How do more hours correlate to safety?! Am I missing something because your entire post confuses me.
There no 22 hour minimum for safety
 
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Tammie

Member
Jul 22, 2022
90
44
I'd suggest removing almost everything posted, because if it's true that gym sounds insane, Tammie's daughter would be super easy to identify, and I'm sure they'd have no problem kicking out someone who posted all of this about them.
I don't even know how to edit a post, let alone delete ;-) if I want to edit to add or correct something, I just post again.

I love our gym, I don't think it's insane at all!! It's a great place, coaches & teammates are like 2nd family to my kiddo and she can't wait for gym(the other day she wanted to go 2hrs early-girl, are you insane?!?)

None of us could imagine being anywhere else!! I think what fits the needs of one gymnast/family doesn't fit the needs of all, that's why there are so many types of gyms & how they all stay open :)
 

ldw4mlo

Proud Parent
Feb 13, 2015
6,442
62
, then her hours should be that of L7/8, right?
What are L7/8 hours, very different at different gyms

At our gym optionals top out at 12 hours during the year. Summer camps can be more. Max technically 30 hours but really 24 as there is lunch and and hour of play/downtime in the 6 hour day.

My level 8/working some 9 skills did 9-18 hours this summer depending on the week. And was off for our vacation, and a week for her other sport camp.
 
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NutterButter

Gold Membership
Proud Parent
Jan 24, 2013
884
It's really a nothing burger, they simply talk to the girls about keeping social media classy, about keeping behaviors positive, always being happy for teammates, neighbors, never resentful or envious. My kiddo tells me EVERYTHING(oversharing must run in the family-lol), I agree with everything they're told.

They also always reinforce how the girls are part of a family, neighborhood, a school, a community, and a gym club, etc and the interconnectedness of it all and how they impact and represent each of these things.

Until the day comes where someone with influence at your gym catches wind of YOUR posts here and suddenly the spotlight is on YOU. Think of it this way - YOU may be happy with the 'nothing burger' but through your posts, your gym is receiving a ton of negative feedback that YOU are the source of. It doesn't matter that you speak positively of it, your gym is being dissed online.

Oh, there are 4 high level gyms in our immediate area(within 60min), 3 with foreign born owners, btw. One is known for making team girls cry regularly(but they have great LOOKING gymnasts, plus more hours than our gym too), we wouldn't go there, not a good fit!

And I can probably correctly guess the 4 gyms you speak of. You don't realize you gave another 'hint' when you said within 60 min. 4 elite level gyms in California within 60 min (not 60 miles) limits the possibilities even more!

Hence, how easy would it be to figure out? But I guess maybe if someone was determined enough(but again, why would they want to? lol...I guess my problem is that I assume everyone is like me...I wouldn't care what club someone else goes to, my gym is perfect for my kid-we picked it for a reason...so I figure the same would be true of other people & their gyms, so why waste the time? But I forget somwtimes people are weird)

Very easy, actually. The gymnastics community is very small. You've already given enough information for someone in your own gym to figure out who you are. It's cool that you are happy there, but your gym has received negative attention because of you.

There's a saying with 'ASSuming'...all I'm saying is be careful what you post. Stop giving identifying details about your kid. Don't post pages from the team handbook. And most importantly - change your username!

I've been on this board for over 9 years and have seen a ton of crazy stuff both IRL and on this board. Trust me when I say it's a small world.
 

Aussie_coach

Staff member
Gold Membership
Coach
Proud Parent
Gymnast
Club Owner / Manager
Jan 4, 2008
3,953
It’s very interesting that gyms would say that xxx hours are required for safety and success.

As a gym owner myself, I can tell you “safety” is a powerful word. Quite often all you have to do is tell parents that something is a safety issue and most won’t question it.

Saying it to justify a training schedule would convince many parents.

But I have attended conferences where research has been conducted in our country and it was found that once gymnasts up their training above 20 hours a week, the injury rate becomes significantly higher.

I suspect there is a little more to it than that, obviously once they jump past 20 hours they are also training harder skills and often in puberty. So it may not just be a result of physical fatigue.

The research also showed that once training sessions are longer than 3 1/2 hours the injury rate jumps. A lot more injuries occurred after the 3.5 hours mark in training than before.
 

coach1234

Coach
Jan 14, 2014
351
Wow that's crazy amount of hours!! My gymnasts who are equivalent to level 8/9 USA are training 15 hours a week. My gymnasts who are equivalent to level 4/5 USA are training 6 hours a week (soon to be going up to 8 hours). IMHO if a gym cannot get kids to level 4/5 "safely" under that amount of hours I would be looking for another gym
 

ReluctantGymMom

Proud Parent
May 11, 2020
326
32
It’s very interesting that gyms would say that xxx hours are required for safety and success.

As a gym owner myself, I can tell you “safety” is a powerful word. Quite often all you have to do is tell parents that something is a safety issue and most won’t question it.

Saying it to justify a training schedule would convince many parents.

But I have attended conferences where research has been conducted in our country and it was found that once gymnasts up their training above 20 hours a week, the injury rate becomes significantly higher.

I suspect there is a little more to it than that, obviously once they jump past 20 hours they are also training harder skills and often in puberty. So it may not just be a result of physical fatigue.

The research also showed that once training sessions are longer than 3 1/2 hours the injury rate jumps. A lot more injuries occurred after the 3.5 hours mark in training than before.
Safety also depends on the individual child. My child is reckless, regardless of hours, safety depends on the set up of the gym and how the coaches are interacting with the kids. We have a girl in level 8 who misses every Tuesday and usually Thursday because she can’t get a ride, first place at states and regionals. The shorter hours didn’t harm her at all and she stayed injury free
 
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Livelovegymnastics

Gymnast
Fan
Mar 20, 2022
57
Oh, there are 4 high level gyms in our immediate area(within 60min), 3 with foreign born owners, btw. One is known for making team girls cry regularly(but they have great LOOKING gymnasts, plus more hours than our gym too), we wouldn't go there, not a good fit!

Hence, how easy would it be to figure out? But I guess maybe if someone was determined enough(but again, why would they want to? lol...I guess my problem is that I assume everyone is like me...I wouldn't care what club someone else goes to, my gym is perfect for my kid-we picked it for a reason...so I figure the same would be true of other people & their gyms, so why waste the time? But I forget somwtimes people are weird)
Very oblivious post, most people don't have any bad intentions but there is still plenty out there and possibly lurking on this site. I'm honestly so confused with everything you post on here but I guess I will just give up on trying to understand lol.
 

JPC13

Proud Parent
Mar 25, 2022
342
Very oblivious post, most people don't have any bad intentions but there is still plenty out there and possibly lurking on this site. I'm honestly so confused with everything you post on here but I guess I will just give up on trying to understand lol.
Her posting on here how she parked in front of the gym so she could warn the coaches when public health inspectors where coming to check that everyone was masking during covid was one of the lamest things I’ve ever seen on a forum.

She’s exactly who “don’t make the gym look bad” was aimed at. All it takes is one gym parent who’s tired of having to deal with Tammie (because obviously there’s at least one) showing the gym that post plus the handbook image…
 

PeanutsMom

Proud Parent
Jun 14, 2019
203
I keep reading these posts that this gym requires 22 hours (5.5 hours per day) for level 6.. my daughter was a level 7 and doing 16 hours a week. 4 days times 4 hours. She has switched to Xcel Diamond and is still doing 16 hours a week training level 8 skills.

She started at level 3, 12 hours (3 hours x 4 days per week). She didn't go to 16 hours until level 5. Hours stayed the SAME during the summer just shifted to earlier in the day to give them more time to play. The level 9-10 girls did 5 days at 4 hours each (20 hours) and those on the elite path (yes, one just competed in the National Championships) were doing 30 plus hours a week (2 a day practices). This was a very small group.

Her current gym caps all kids at 16 hours during the school year regardless of level so they can balance academics, gym and sleep!
 
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