WAG Twisting opinion nightmare

[GlobalNomad]

Dd had a half and was just getting a full when we had to switch gyms. She's a 10 year old level 7/8. We are on international assignment, and rotate between 3 gyms. She does a round off to the right, right hand down first. Here's the problem:

Gym A: Lets dd chose her own twist direction. She alternates between right and left, never perfecting either.

Gym B: Declares dd should twist left. Dd quits twisting for a while, then gets a left twist, not great.

Gym C: Declares dd is a right twister, and is twisting "the wrong way." Wants dd to relearn twist.

I know the general advice is to go with the coach. I know virtually nothing about gymnastics. I do know that this is unnecessarly frustrating. She's a good gymnast. At this rate, she'll land a double before her full.

My questions:
Is there a better twist direction for her? She seems equally good (or bad) at both now, and she's got a great case of the twisties as a result. She's worked more left.
How do I tactfully approach this situation, if at all? A, B, and C are convinced they are each correct in their approach; and the others are wrong.

 

[raenndrops]

All I know is that YG (10 years old) also puts the right hand down first on her round off.
When she does her front 1/2, she twists left.
That is the only twisting she does so far. Sorry I can't be of more help.

 

[duyetanh]

I would think you might want to email all 3 coaches together saying what is going on because they might not know? It has to be confusing being told first one way than the other. That would freak ME out, let alone a kid.

 

[GymCMLA]

I'm no help. I RO right (right hand down first) I twisted left. My DD RO right and twists right.

I agree with pp, that maybe getting all 3 to pick something so your poor DD has a chance...

 

[profmom]

This can't continue. From everything I've read on here about twisting, it's going to screw her up. I think if I have got this straight finally, that DD and DS both twist leading with their left shoulders, but DD for sure puts her right hand down first in her RO and DS leads with his left into RO. I'm pretty sure their gym is a "go with what feels most comfortable, but pick one direction and stick with it" philosophy.

I think it would be good to try communicating with all three coaches at once and let them duke it out and settle on something consistent.

 

[Deleted member 18037]

Yep I agree, all three coaches need to be on the same page on this one.

 

[ZJsMom]

My ds roundoffs left and twists left. Coaches have different schools of thought about which direction to twist. I'm sure all kids could learn either way, but they do need to pick one for her or she's going to be confused and continually set back.

 

[Hollowarchkick]

There are a couple of instances where twisting left for a right hand first round off would be preferred. If she's going to learn a back half step out or a 1 1/2 step out to round off would be an example. Another is a twisting tsuk vault.
The vault will probably not come into play since yurchenko is probably the route she'll eventually take. The tumbling out of the back half or one and a half would possibly have more of an impact.
So there are reasons for wanting the left twist but learning to go opposite of what comes natural is a pretty big challenge. It really depends on the skills the coaches have planned down the road.

 

[krc]

From Bill Sands (2000): "it appears that the majority of gymnasts who do a round off with a particular first-hand will twist in the same direction as that hand. However, the relationship is not strong enough to allow rule-like assessment [in how] the direction of the round off interacts with the backward twist direction."

In other words, go with the flow. If you have a righty round-off, start them with right twisting (and vice-versa). If that doesn't work - then try the other way My 2¢, stick with right twist and stay off floor. Drill it a million times on tramp. If you are not easily proceeding past fulls, then switch to left. Wrong-way or mixed twisting is not a major problem. It will only limit a few things that twist directly from a RO. Scherbo and Retton were wrong way twisters and it didn't seem to bother them too much.

BTW Hollowarchkick. I think you'll find stepouts from mixed twists are considerably harder than from "normal" twisting. (though not impossible, see Milosovici or Whitlock)

and one more thing - ft and bk twisting need to match. right or left both ways.

 

[Hollowarchkick]

You're absolutely right. I totally put down the exact opposite of what I meant. Thanks for pointing that out. My mistake.

 

[krc]

No prob Hollowarchkick (love the handle) I often argue twisting and end up confusing myself even more while trying to explain what I completely understood only 5 min previously

 

[Hollowarchkick]

Yeah I usually do better when I walk around in circles back and forth while visualizing doing it. I skipped the "walk around like a crazy person" step before answering.

 

[GlobalNomad]

She is competing a Tsuk for B, so maybe that's why they are so insistent on her twisting left.

Gym C tried to teach her front twisting and she instinctively went right. They then looked at her cartwheel and round off and determined that she had been twisting the "wrong way" in her back tumbling. They wrote a message to B telling them this. It was not well received.

If I knew the correct answer, I'd declare a direction and call it settled. She says she feels more in control going left, but she doesn't always make it around. She feels more powerful going right, but she has trouble controlling the twist.

 

[skschlag]

My ds has a mixed dominance issue that became a big problem when he started twisting. He could legitimately go either way when learning his bk full. Problem was, sometimes he woudl get confused and go one way to satrt and then twist back.

His coach spent an entire hour figuring out which way he twists. First, they looked at his tumbling. But he leads with his left foot for roundoff and right foot for front handspring. Then had him get on tramp and twists both ways. Coach then had him jump and twist both ways.

not sure what decided it, but coach and D decided that he needed to twist left. So coach put a huge block up abotu as tall as the coach and had D just fall as the coach twisted him both forward and backward. This allowed D to feel the way he was twisting and develop some idea that this was the way he was to go.

It has helped immensely on floor, although the discrepancies show up occassionally as he is trying dismounts. (full in on Rings is finally coming).

I think that someone needs to figure it out for her and she needs to just say "I twist this way"

just curious, why 3 gyms?

 

[GlobalNomad]

It's odd, but it's 3. We are on rotating international assignment.

Maybe some kids are good at both directions and it doesn't really matter what they pick? I hope that's the case.

I think dd may be the same way, doing some skills left and some skills right.

 

[gymjunkie]

Aside from the twisting direction, how are they going about teaching her to twist? If any one of them had taught her to twist well, I doubt the others would step in and mess with it.

 

[GlobalNomad]

I'm not sure how they are teaching her specifically. I know that, in general, A does more drills and B does more spotting. That could be because the facility is small and not well equipped at B. It could also be because dd doesn't exactly understand them sometimes and they have to show more than tell.

I think C was trying to teach her an Arabian, and they decided she was going the wrong way. I'm not sure what the teaching method was.

 

[gopuckgo]

Mine does round off right and twists left. She does do one and a half step out, but rounds off left when doing those. Now for the really messed up thing that happens down the road with mixed dominance, on beam she is working side aerial right into a back layout step out, but for that she switches her feet mid air and then does her second one leading right. It would have been so much easier if she had learned to aerial left in the first place. So when determining twisting direction, it is easiest if their round off and twisting goes the same direction as small problems can occur down the road.

 

[Geoffrey Taucer]

E-mail all three coaches. They all need to be on the same page with this.

 

[l.c.o]

My DD is a "rightie" and was originally taught to right RO and right twist. She switched gyms at the beginning of the year, and they have switched her to a right RO and left twist (counter-clockwise). They've even changed her L4 bars dismount direction after she'd been competing it for a year. DD said it's because it's more efficient, as after the right RO her left foot is slightly forward (on beam) and it helps a left twist along, and they want all events to be the same for muscle memory.

Granted, that's her understanding at age 11.

Thankfully she's really just starting to twist, so it hasn't been difficult to switch.