Parents What do you think of this fundraising?

[curlygirls]

Fundraising is for a time but tuition increases are forever. I would rather participate in fundraising for this reason.

 

[OzZee]

I'd rather do some fundraising to help keep training cost lower. But it would depend on what sort of fundraising - if it's just selling some chocolates then no, as I never sell them to anyone, just pay for them myself and half the time they get thrown away eventually.

 

[CreateMagic]

We did a cartwheel-a-thon once to raise money...fun and appropriate I thought!

 

[cbifoja]

We did a cartwheel-a-thon once to raise money...fun and appropriate I thought!

We made almost a thousand dollars with fewer than ten girls in a tumble-a-thon. If we had had more team participation (we have around 50 team girls) we would have done even better. But I still can't imagine what kind of fundraiser the gym is asking the parents to do in order to make the thousands of dollars it would take purchase equipment.

 

[CreateMagic]

We opened it up to the whole gym. It's a small gym, but we made over $5000.

 

[cbifoja]

We opened it up to the whole gym. It's a small gym, but we made over $5000.

Way to go!!!!!! That's amazing and a great idea to open it up to the rec side also. Good for you all!

 

[dani4]

I just wrote this huge response that got eaten by my computer. Let me see if I can give a quicker response here:

As an economist, this doesn't sit well with me. Gym equipment is a capital expense that is used by many gymnasts over a long period of time, not just the ones doing the fundraising now. Therefore it should be paid over time, with small tuition increases if necessary. But it is the kind of thing a company should be able to get a bank loan for. If they can't get a loan to do it, it's because either it's not a justified business expense, or the gym is not in good financial condition and the bank is betting they won't be able to pay back the loan or they will go under. In either case, I would not be comfortable fundraising for a major capital expense. Small tuition increases should lessen the load for everyone, over a long period of time, rather than make a small number of people pay for it NOW and people joining the gym a year from now don't have to pay at all.

My second problem with it is transparency. I would want to know the details of the proposed expenses, fundraising goals, and be updated on progress as well as exactly where the money is being spent. Basically, I'd want to see the gym's business plan and understand why it can't pay this capital expense.

Fundraising for comestibles, to be used by the people doing the fundraising, makes sense- uniforms, transportation to meets, meet entry fees, even special coaching clinics make sense for fundraising, by a for-profit or a non-profit. But capital expenditures? No Way.

Maybe in a few years if my kids are more involved in gymnastics I'll see it in a different light.

 

[RileyG]

Just out of curiosity, what kind of fundraising? It seems like you are trying to raise quite a bit of money. Surely you aren't trying to raise that much by selling candles and pizza kits!

Sent from my LGL55C using ChalkBucket mobile app

You would be surprised!
I dont want to out myself, so i am hesitant to say what it is exactly.

The poster who mentionedit being a capital expense is right on the mark.
this is something the gym will have for years to come for future students, not just the current ones.

I alsomhave to comment that a few years back they ran a fundraiser for equipment but did not use the money raised for equipment. So it all doesnt sit right with me.

 

[gymgal]

I also have to comment that a few years back they ran a fundraiser for equipment but did not use the money raised for equipment. So it all doesnt sit right with me.

This is exactly why I feel so uncomfortable with this. When a for-profit company does this, the money raised becomes part of their profits. And while the intent might be to use it for equipment, the reality is there is no obligation on the part of the owner to do this.

 

[JBS]

The gym gave out fundraising packets to everyone......not just team butvrec classes also, to participate in fundraising for new equipment. This is a gym club that is for profit, owned by a private person. It just seems wrong to ask your customers to fundraise for new equipment. Isnt that what we pay tuition for? The costs of the business should come from that right?

Only if you want to be at a junky gym. We do the same thing as above for rec...we actually charge a $120 equipment fee for all team gymnasts...it is built into their seasonal costs instead of tuition...but I could easily eliminate the fee and raise tuition by $15/month.

In the last 12 months we have purchased (with $120 equip fee and rec. fundraised money)...

• AAI TAC/10 LZT vault table for ~$3000
• AAI safety zone and hand mat for over ~$700
• Pit cubes ~$2000
• Two barely used Speith Crank beams for the bargain deal of $3400 total ($1700 each)
• Five 8" mats at ~$2500
• Strength equip ~$500

In the past 12 months the club has purchased (with tuition)...

• I am only listing extra/unexpected business costs
• Over 100 degrees last summer for several days...three AC units died in the same week...~$14,000
• Lobby remodel ~$10,000
• Pit cubes ~$2000 in addition to the pit cubes above
• Random parts for equipment ~$2000 (new bar cables...beam recovery...spin locks...floor boards...new foam for mats...tramp springs...vault board springs...etc.)
• New central vac. (cyclonic action) for bar area ~$1200
• Random stuff that I buy to create a better team program ~priceless (at least $2000/year)

Our next purchase will hopefully be a new $100,000 pit system.

 

[JBS]

As a parent and former gymnast...I know what my daughters like to do at the gym...flying...I also know what I used to like...flying.

I am also a coach...I teach kids to fly with trampolines...loose foam pits...resi pits...spotting rigs...this stuff is expensive.

I trust our owners...I believe in making them a profit so that I get a better training environment for my daughters. Higher paid coaches are happier...modern equipment is safer.

Any economist should be able to run the numbers and realize that there are many industries that are more profitable than gymnastics. 100% of the families on our optional team have a higher household income than my wife and I do...we are both coaches. Do you want your kids to have a lesser training facility simply because your gym cannot afford a better one? Not me...I want the best...I want to be at the gym with six in ground trampolines where the owner drives up in a Lamborghini and complains that the parking lot stripes need to be repainted so nobody will park too close to his car...the gym that has several $50,000+ coaches...that's a real training environment.

My business model is to provide the BEST...people will pay more for that. If people believe and will help out by selling cookies...so be it.

Sorry for the rant...but I want it all for my kids and for my wife and I...gymnastics is a hard industry...realize that.

 

[txgymfan]

jbs, Thank you for the honest response. I want to fly at your gym!

 

[JBS]

It's something I believe in...it's not for everyone...but someday it will happen for me.

Transparency is key...people have to know the truth...and still believe in it.

 

[JBS]

A non profit booster can't buy equipment but a for profit booster can. Any money raised for the gym would be off set by the cost of the equipment, presumably, so there should not be any tax burden unless there was a significant amount left over. And yes, you are right that the donations are not tax deductible for the donors, though if done correctly, they can be tax deductible for businesses through advertisement expenses. For profit gyms and for profit boosters can require participation, though that would not sit well with many families. Personally, I would much prefer the gym find its own way to raise revenues for equipment costs, including raising tuition if need be, rather than force participation in fundraising. (I realize forced participation was not part of the Ops comments. I am just throwing that out there based on above comments)

501(j)???

Internal Revenue Manual - 7.25.26 Amateur Sports Organizations

http://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-tege/eotopica93.pdf

 

[gymgal]

501(j)???

Internal Revenue Manual - 7.25.26 Amateur Sports Organizations

http://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-tege/eotopica93.pdf

given the link you referenced, it appears there are loopholes for some gyms. However, from reading the document, i would say that most booster clubs would not qualify under 501j, since the vast majority of gyms do not have evidence of training future elites/collegiates. And I am guessing the IRS takes a very narrow view when it comes to this evidence. But for the boosters who would qualify, if a non profit booster buys equipment, it belongs to the booster, not the gym. I suppose it's possible that a qualifying booster could just retain ownership of the equipment, but that opens another set of legal ramifications in terms of liability, maintenance, equity in the company, etc. certainly not a good position to have long term. I don't know if the equipment can be gifted to a For-profit gym, but if it can, the gym would have to count it as income and pay taxes on it.

Edit: after I looked more into the documents, I'm really confused because the article clearly says the booster cannot buy equipment that would provide obvious benefit to the for profit gym (because the equipment would be used to bolster the entire gym's program, not just the team) but then the IRS docs appear to say that there may be times when purchasing equipment would be qualified. Honestly, I think this has more to do with non-profit organizations developing sports programs and the legality of purchasing equipment for that program, not for non-profit boosters paying for equipment for for-profit gyms.

 

[JMD]

Only if you want to be at a junky gym. We do the same thing as above for rec...we actually charge a $120 equipment fee for all team gymnasts...it is built into their seasonal costs instead of tuition...but I could easily eliminate the fee and raise tuition by $15/month.

• New central vac. (cyclonic action) for bar area ~$1200

That sounds neat. How has it been working? Better than a standard Dyson?

 

[RileyG]

So I also want my doctor dentist etc to have the best new equipment, so the next time I go for a cleaning and they hand me a fundraising package because they need new equipment I should be ok with that?
"Mrs. Riley please help us raise money to buy new drills and dental cleaners, this is an expensive practice and our income doesn't cover it"

maybe it isn't comparing apples to apples but you get my point.
I honestly think our tuition should be raised, we pay well below what other gyms in the area pay, and it has barely been raised during the years we have been there.
I think that is partly where the problem lays.

 

[bogwoppit]

I know at our gym you could do the fundraising or you could pay a certain amount instead. I am sure you could offer to do that. It is not different to paying more tuition. AT that end of the day the equipment will be paid for somehow and you will be paying, it is just the how that is the issue.

 

[Kimbo7]

How funny that you posted this because I just joined CB to post about something similar. Our gym has a "parent booster club" that forces to do fundraising but the parents NEVER get any money to help with our expenses. This has been going on for years. They say they use some money for coaches fees at meets, but it's unclear how much. There is also one level 10 in our gym that usually goes to Nationals, and we've been told that they need "a lot" of money for that. I don't know if they mean it's to send the gymnast or the coach, but isn't that the family's responsibility? Why are the rest of us paying for that? Our most recent fundraiser is to buy new equipment for the gym, which I don't agree with. That is the owner's job to figure that out - that's why I pay a monthy tuiition.

I feel if it's a "parents club" then they should have meetings where the parents decide where "our" money will go. And I think they need to open their books and show us exactly what is going on. Right now the head coach dictates what we will do and where the money will go. Does anyone else have this type of set up in their gym? I think it's crazy, but maybe it's common?

 

[JBS]

That sounds neat. How has it been working? Better than a standard Dyson?

It works great...it's a Hayden...

Hayden

We have 50' of hose to do the whole bar area.