Women Hypermobility

[Iwannabemargo]

I have been reading up on hypermobility as P&F has it (but not in extremis).

I was wondering - research has estimated that 5% of the general population is hypermobile, what, in your experience is the percentage in your gym ?

Seems that it is a helpful factor in gym.

Thoughts ?

 

[Deleted member D3987]

and mostly females in my experience. hence, boys just die doing flexibility.

 

[Faith]

I don't know if it is that helpful, especially higher up the skill ladder.

The one girl in DD's old club who was truly hypermobile left fairly quickly. She just couldn't keep up with the conditioning.

The other girl who is very flexible and really, really talented also hates conditioning and has chosen not to go elite path as the strength work is too hard for her. Very mobile kids need to work that much harder on it to keep their joints strong.

So I'd say less than 5% generally on team.

I was once told by a very wise coach that when he talent-spotted he wanted girls who were strong and adventurous, as flexibility could be taught more easily to girls than strength (and vice versa for boys). DD was the least flexible in her group but ended up overtaking them all level wise as flexibility trained easier for her than strength did for the others.

Looking at current GB juniors/seniors I do find it interesting that despite the emphasis we have on R+C in the early levels there's only one or two I think are properly, obviously hypermobile. Laura Edwards is one, Catherine Lyons the other. So say 75 girls at elite espoir/junior/senior level, 5% average should be 4 girls, and if it truly is an advantage there should be more. That of course is only my observation

 

[Ex member]

My Oldest dd who is in a disability development group has hypermobility of the hips. she naturally sits in a squat without her backside touching the floor/chair or she will be curled up with her legs tucked up under her armpits if she is reading in an arm chair. Dd cannot do the splits in either direction yet despite having hypermobility of the hips (she has been in gym since end of July), dd has also got low muscle tone and her core muscles are weak but they are improving since starting gym.

 

[Flossyduck]

There aren't any hyper-mobile girls in dd's squad, that I can think of.
DD isn't, but she has no problem doing good oversplits, needlescales and so on and looks quite flexible when she's doing the dancy bits.

On our journey so far we've come across two kids who I know for sure were/are. One was a boy who was in her rec class and his dr had recommended gymnastics to help increase the strength in his joints. He had amazing splits and shoulder angles and in my limited experience I thought he'd go far. But he really struggled with the control work and keeping good shapes when they started drills for bigger skills and just kept going to try and gain more muscle control, but didn't progress far.

The other was a girl who was in her squad for a while. I always remember her mum saying she had an increased risk of injuries and she had already had a hip/groin issue and a nasty elbow injury (hyper-extension doing a flic) before we got there. She left a few months back.

So from my very limited experience I'd say it's neither an obvious advantage or disadvantage and it can be mild or extreme. If anything it's just another consideration in the whole bag of parts which affect how someone might train and which skills they find easier and harder to work towards.

 

[vbbf]

My dd is a 7 yr old uk elite track gymnast. When she holds her arms out straight they bend past straight so i think she might have hypermobility of her elbows. When she does her bridge she can stretch her shoulders over her hands and she is also very flexible in her splits and her back. She gets in oversplits in her split jumps and split handstands. She can lie on her stomach and get her feet over her head on the floor. She is also very strong as well so i think its not a problem for her to be very flexible. She got her standing back tuck, aerial cartwheel, free walkover on floor and her kip when she was 6. She has never had any injuries yet and the hypermobility in her elbows has never been a problem when tumbling. She has been doing roundoff flicks since she was 5 and has her straight back. She has never struggled with conditioning. I dont know of any other gymnasts in her group that have hypermobility and im not even sure she has it, i just thought she was naturally flexible.

 

[gymnasticswim4]

I'm the same as vbbf's daughter in everything except for skill level and leg flexibility (meaning, while very flexible in my upper body, I'm still strong)

 

[Learning Parent GB]

My little 5 yr old DS has some level of hypermobility. The physio has advised that gym will help his strength and control of his muscles which could help him limit the higher risk of injury associated with the condition.

His condition is not severe and we only noticed as he suffered from leg and foot pain when he was younger. He has been slower to develop running etc but is pretty much up with his peers now.

This made me interested in the subject, and I noticed immediately that 2 of our squad girls are hypermobile. For us that is 2 out of 10. We also have another girl who is exceedingly flexible, but her joints seem normal. I can't explain as I don't know her medical history, but she has far less trouble standing straight etc than the girls who naturally overextend.

 

[Faith]

I think it depends on the definition of hypermobility though. During my life nearly all medical professionals have said I'm hypermobile. I'm not, any flexibility I have is through hard work when I was a gymnast. I am just lucky to have ligaments that a) can be trained to stretch and b) have stayed pretty stretched compared to your average person.

I consider someone who is hypermobile to have a huge range of movement without training- so beyond even what is normal for gymnastics, and/or with obvious joint hypermobility- elbows and knees going "backwards" for example.

I met a hypermobile girl in an adult gym class- In her 30's, never done any sport or dance ever, but had all three splits (and oversplits) without pain. We struggled to find the complete range of her movement.

There is a medical criteria:

• Placing flat hands on the floor with straight legs
• Left knee bending backward
• Right knee bending backward
• Left elbow bending backward
• Right elbow bending backward
• Left thumb touching the forearm
• Right thumb touching the forearm
• Left little finger bending backward past 90 degrees
• Right little finger bending backward past 90 degrees

I think you need a score of 4 or more to be classed as HM. I had a private physio test me once, the only one I can do it the hands flat on the floor thing.

 

[Flossyduck]

I think i's easy to confuse hyper-mobility with someone who is 'just' very flexible.

My family are all flexible. My older son, who never did any kind of dance or gym training, could get both his feet behind his head until he was about 14. My daughter is also flexible and has also worked on it at gym, so doesn't struggle with splits and good shoulders and so on
but our joints are all normal and none of us have ever had any of that thumb bending, finger bending, backwards elbows business, which is actual hyper-mobility.

I would have thought that, as long as someone is flexible enough for the demands of gymnastics, there's no great advantage to actual hyper-mobility with the additional risk of injury it carries?

As Faith said earlier, you'd expect to see more hyper-mobile gymnasts if that were the case. Maybe in rhythmic you see it more?

 

[vbbf]

My dd has both the elbows bending back and she can do the flat hands on the floor with straight legs. She doesnt have any of the other things on the list. She only scored 3 so she must just be naturally flexible

 

[Iwannabemargo]

P&F can do all of these and does have knee issues.

I was called "double jointed" when I was little could do backbends and splits without any real training, and even now in my crumbliehood, its my fat that prevents some moves not the flexibility.

I would think that Rythmic would benefit more form increased flexiblilty thinking about things more.

As with all these things we are all on the scale somewhere.

 

[Jenny]

P&F can do all of these and does have knee issues.

I was called "double jointed" when I was little could do backbends and splits without any real training, and even now in my crumbliehood, its my fat that prevents some moves not the flexibility.

Haha. Me too!

 

[Susan]

Dr. Larry Nassar says that hypermobility (ie: connective tissue disorders) are much more prevalent in the gymnastic and dance community than in the general public, but did not offer any specific percentages. It can be an advantage or not depending on how strong the gymnast also is -- and how knowledgeable the coach is about different body types and how to train them.

 

[Invisible Duck]

I am not super flexible (I have left and right splits flat and am about 10 cm or so off on middle and nothing crazy with shoulders) but on the criteria listed above the only one I have trouble on is my right thumb to forearm and my little fingers probably get to 90 degrees not much more.

But my physio was saying (and I hope I understood this correctly) that hyper mobile people are not always flexible and will feel that their muscles are stiff or tight because their muscles have to work extra hard to hold everything in place.

I had a hamstring issue (lost all flexibility) and we fixed it completely with core strength and glute strength exercises - no stretching! You need good posture and the correct muscles need to be strong so that things can move freely and other muscles are not trying to take over (like my poor hamstrings and lower back were tryinging to do) and therefore reducing flexibility.

It's all super interesting!

 

[Seeker]

I had a hamstring issue (lost all flexibility) and we fixed it completely with core strength and glute strength exercises - no stretching! You need good posture and the correct muscles need to be strong so that things can move freely and other muscles are not trying to take over (like my poor hamstrings and lower back were tryinging to do) and therefore reducing flexibility.

It's all super interesting!

I had the same issue about 10 years ago. Took a solid year of PT and strength work to recover a normal balance. It is very interesting to me though how to body works, how it will compensate and make itself continue to 'work' even if that eventually catches up to you.