Coaches Teaching flyaways without a pit

[Scott W.]

Hey everyone!

I've begun teaching tucked flyaways to our prospective level 5s but am running into a little problem. We've been doing "dead cow" drills and they've been going okay, but when it's time to start flipping them it's obvious they get scared and are pulling in on the bar. I've tried holding them in the air after they let go and then trying to flip them but they aren't all small enough for that, haha.

Should I just keep working the "dead cow" until they are confident? Is this just going to take me a lot longer since we don't have a foam pit for them to throw them into without being too afraid? Should I be working out more so I can hold everyone up without any problems?

Any tips are appreciated!

 

[fuzi]

Have you tried setting up a stack of mats on a wedge so they release in a candle, land, and then back roll down the mat? My kids love that drill and gets the feel of let go, release, flip.

I assume no spotting belt?

Are they doing back tucks on floor? On tramp? I would want to make sure they already are comfortable flipping backwards.

At some point they have to go for it. If you aren't comfortable flipping them alone and don't trust the kid to rotate themselves, get a double spot for those first few goes. I taught at a no pit gym for a few years and the flyaway were tricky at first, but we worked though.

 

[fuzi]

Do you have rings? They can practice tucked "flyaway" off rings. It is sometimes more of a fast skin the cat, but it gets them to let go and flip.

 

[Scott W.]

Have you tried setting up a stack of mats on a wedge so they release in a candle, land, and then back roll down the mat? My kids love that drill and gets the feel of let go, release, flip.

I assume no spotting belt?

Are they doing back tucks on floor? On tramp? I would want to make sure they already are comfortable flipping backwards.

At some point they have to go for it. If you aren't comfortable flipping them alone and don't trust the kid to rotate themselves, get a double spot for those first few goes. I taught at a no pit gym for a few years and the flyaway were tricky at first, but we worked though.

Yep! That's the "dead cow" drill I've been doing. They really like that one.

No spotting belt yet, but it is in the works.

Yes, the ones that are learning flyaways already have back tucks on floor/tramp/etc. I think they're worried they're going to kick the bar, which ironically is making them hold onto the bar longer so they kick the bar? The tricky part I'm having is making them release sooner.

 

[Scott W.]

Do you have rings? They can practice tucked "flyaway" off rings. It is sometimes more of a fast skin the cat, but it gets them to let go and flip.

We do have rings, and I have never thought of using them to teach UB flyways! I guess I could probably use the p-bars too! Thanks, I'll give that a try!

 

[fuzi]

We do have rings, and I have never thought of using them to teach UB flyways! I guess I could probably use the p-bars too! Thanks, I'll give that a try!

Yes, p bars too!

 

[gymisforeveryone]

We don't have a pit either and I have a group of 11-14 year old gymnasts learning this skill right now. We have taken it really slow because I wanted them to learn the layout shape from the beginning, not the tuck because I think that the tuck one makes them close the shoulders more easily and learning a layout after learning that bad habit is harder.

This is how our progression has gone so far:
Week one six months ago: lay out shape on rings upside down and then letting go and landing on soft mats. The same drill as a side station on boys parallel bars
Week two: Tap swings counting to three, then letting go and landing on back (very soft mats and spotting/slowing down the fall at first). Also wiggle swings on rings, then immediately after arch a layout flyaway landing on soft mats. Also lay out shaping on floor bar.
Week two: Lay out shaping on floor bar. Then swings and double spotted slow motion flyaways on low bar (spotting the gymnast on our shoulders for more control and to save our backs and arms)
Week three-five: As they got better on those slow motion flyaways, we started to spot them with one arm under the back and one arm on their stomach. Still a double spot and low bar, so tucked tap swings and then straightening the legs on the front swing
Week six: On regular bar setting swings on the high bar, then letting go and landing on back on a up hill in front of the bar, then immediately a backwards roll down the hill. Also at the same time flyaways on a single rail that they can just barely swing with straight legs. Double spot us standing on 40cm high spotting blocks... This is where we are now. Some have shown consistency and good shapes and nice open shoulders so they have moved on to lighter spotting by just one coach

We have done the flyaways approximately once a week (it's not out number one priority skill right now) and kept it new and exciting that way... The girls are always asking if we are doing flyaways today. I think they have not hit their toes on the bar enough yet It really helps if you can have two spotters. It gives the girls (and you!) more confidence and saves your back... It's not easy to spot a 14 year old on a skill like this. All the spotting videos out there are about muscular grown man spotting 6-9 year olds....

 

[JManning86]

it may sound crazy, but I've had the best luck teaching flyaway without "drills" or a pit. I start with bent knee swings on a low bar and go through them in slow motion emphasizing arm position and release and then steadily speed it up until they are ready for the high bar. "When you want to start climbing mountains, you don't start with Everest." This has worked well enough for me that I've had boys and girls doing doubles and full ins that started this way.

 

[eucoach]

it may sound crazy, but I've had the best luck teaching flyaway without "drills" or a pit. I start with bent knee swings on a low bar and go through them in slow motion emphasizing arm position and release and then steadily speed it up until they are ready for the high bar. "When you want to start climbing mountains, you don't start with Everest." This has worked well enough for me that I've had boys and girls doing doubles and full ins that started this way.

I never use a pit to teach flyaways either and I feel it is not only unnecessary but might also teach some bad habits.

Prerequesite is of course a nice swinging shape. The gymnasts must be able to keep a hollow shape (chest in, shoulders open) on the upswing. Once they can do that, I also start doing bent-leg swings on low bar. Stop them in the right position, hold them in a candle when they let go and flip them over. First slow, then faster. The same process can be repeated on the high bar, with a couple of drills in between where they let go but you don't flip them and let them drop to their backs onto a soft mat.

If the gymnasts understand how to hold the shapes and can be trusted in doing so, you can use the same method for slightly older and heavier gymnasts. You might skip holding them in a candle position though. ;-) If you are unsure spotting by yourself, get a second spotter for the first couple of tries.

There are so many ways to teach flyaways - but you need to find a way that works for you. Equipment wise, size of the gymnasts, talent of the gymnasts, etc.

 

[Deleted member 14190]

hand spot them, up on a block until they have them. We really don't use the pit to teach them, although they do them over there just because it's there.

 

[Scott W.]

I never use a pit to teach flyaways either and I feel it is not only unnecessary but might also teach some bad habits.

Prerequesite is of course a nice swinging shape. The gymnasts must be able to keep a hollow shape (chest in, shoulders open) on the upswing. Once they can do that, I also start doing bent-leg swings on low bar. Stop them in the right position, hold them in a candle when they let go and flip them over. First slow, then faster. The same process can be repeated on the high bar, with a couple of drills in between where they let go but you don't flip them and let them drop to their backs onto a soft mat.

If the gymnasts understand how to hold the shapes and can be trusted in doing so, you can use the same method for slightly older and heavier gymnasts. You might skip holding them in a candle position though. ;-) If you are unsure spotting by yourself, get a second spotter for the first couple of tries.

There are so many ways to teach flyaways - but you need to find a way that works for you. Equipment wise, size of the gymnasts, talent of the gymnasts, etc.

See we've been doing that in the past (we kinda have to), but we've started having an issue with kids initiating the tuck/flip while still holding onto the bar. I thought this was because they learned to flyaway with bent knees on the low bar, but I suppose it is more likely that they are just afraid of kicking the bar.

And unfortunately a lot of our girls learning this skill are older and bigger, so I just can't hold them up. I'll just keep plugging away at them! Persistence!

 

[coach4life]

Sorry, late to the game here, but have you tried spotting them from your shoulder? One technique that has worked wonders for my girls is this: Have them tap swing on the high bar while you stand next to them, then step in underneath them as they swing forward and have them “land” on your shoulder (you have to get in close) in a candlestick position (still holding onto the bar), with their lower back on your shoulder, nestled in against your neck. Then grab their hips with both hands and tell them to let go. The moment they tuck their knees in and/or you lean forward at all, they’ll “roll” right off and land the flyaway (provided you’re holding their hips on the way down). This can be repeated with less and less time between you stopping them and them letting go of the bar until they’re doing it without any pause and practically by themselves.

I love this spotting method because you can do it with kids that still have NO idea about flyaway timing (I’ve done it with level 3’s) and you can keep spotting them this way until they’re pretty much ready to do it by themselves. They feel incredibly safe at the beginning learning stages because there’s no in-the-air “flip” involved (more like a backward roll from a stand-still off your shoulder). Definitely should still be working other drills, but this is a great one for introducing the flip itself off the high bar.

The other nice thing is that unless you’re very small, you can do it with a pretty wide range of kids, not just the littles (because the weight is supported by your own body weight, not an outstretched arm), and the risk of accident is minimal to nonexistent. I’ve actually had kids doing solid flyaways by themselves in 2-3 practices spotting like this. Just be careful not to shoot yourself in the foot…I'm now constantly having to fend off level 3’s begging to “do flyaways!” during bar rotation instead of mill circles now that we’ve introduced them. :-/

 

[Jard.the.gymnast]

My coach always makes sure when spotting he isn't the only one spotting. I am one of the stronger gymnast of the team, so I do spit my teammates a lot. That works great for us!