Parents Competition Fees

[e'smum]

I never heard of paying for meets you aren't going to! Across both of our gyms, we only paid for the meets you sign up for. Of course, once you say you are going, you have to pay regardless if you go or not. The bigger issue I am hearing from what you are saying is that they weren't up front about what you were being charged. When we sign up for our chosen meets, we know the exact charge for each meet, including the coach's fees. It is just a flat fee, but the gym is able to give an estimate of the cost even before we go to the meet. For example, if we sign up for Chicago Style, it is $110 for the meet fee and $40 for our portion of the coach's fee (which I believe covers their time, expenses). I would never ask for a break-down of that $40 (which is just illustrative), but because it was clearly laid out before I signed up, I am comfortable with it. For an out-of-state meet, the meet fee may be $110, but the coach's fee is probably $100 per gymnast, because there are hotel and flight costs.

On our monthly invoices, each line item is clearly laid out: Meet Fee, Chicago Style $100. Coach's Fee $40. Are you looking for a more specific breakdown of the coach's fee (that seems difficult), or just a breakdown of how much for each meet (that seems more than reasonable)?

we, and by we i mean other parents in the gym too, want a breakdown. meet fees, coaches fees, coaches travel expenses. how much per meet, per kid.
and our gym's philosophy is that you pay for a meet even though you don't go. you just don't pay entry fees if you say you aren't going or can cancel before the deadline, you don't have to pay that fee.

 

[jenjean70]

they charge. no booster club allowed......

Our gym allowed a booster club to be started last year. The owner fought it in the beginning and didn't want any fundraising but some parents wore him down and showed him the benefit to the parents and therefore the gym that he finally gave in. There are still some questions about the amount of money charged for meets but the booster club limits spending and gives the coaches a per diem, tells them where they are staying and books affordable flights. We saved a couple hundred dollars this year because of the booster club. Hopefully as it grows we'll be able to save more!

 

[e'smum]

especially when you have no idea what is making up those fees.

i think that is what is the issue at hand.
there needs to be an accountability on what the money is being spent on.
i go to the store they can't just look at my grocery cart and say you owe $150.

 

[duyetanh]

We get an itemized statement monthly of where the money goes. It’s awesome. And fair. And I am so sorry you don’t! I couldn’t imagine being at a gym where we didn’t know where/what our money was going towards. That would really freak me out.

 

[auscoachgymmum]

Forgive me for the potentially naive question - but what is a Booster club? I have never heard that term used here in Australia.

In terms of fees, do most gyms add a levy at the beginning of the season that covers the coaching costs etc? or is it added to each competition? We are currently in the process of re designing the way we structure our competition fees as we are potentially losing money each time we send gymnasts to compete. (Mind you there has been no change to the fee structure in the last 10 years... yet of course entry fees have significantly increased.

Thanks in advance.

 

[2gymkids]

i think that is what is the issue at hand.
there needs to be an accountability on what the money is being spent on.
i go to the store they can't just look at my grocery cart and say you owe $150.

Totally agree.
At our old gym we got an itemized list at the end of the season, along with a +/- account balance (it was always pretty close either way). If we had overpaid, they credited the next month's tuition. If we had underpaid, we had a certain amount of time to make it up (never happened to us but happened to optionals sometimes).

 

[jillc]

In terms of fees, do most gyms add a levy at the beginning of the season that covers the coaching costs etc? or is it added to each competition?

We get a fee at beginning of the season. The fee varies by level. We are allowed to spread the payment over the season rather than paying all at once.

It is communicated very clearly to us what this doesn’t cover (mainly uniform stuff and the actual meet fees). This is one place where this gym has good communication. People new to team were given an estimate of the cost with the invites our daughters got to team. And that estimate was very close to the actual cost.

Based on this thread, I am very glad it is this way because I know exactly upfront what the cost is and I can either chose to pay or choose to not have my DD compete on the team.

And then I don’t feel like I need itemized receipts or worry about exactly how it is split.

We do not have a booster club.

 

[auscoachgymmum]

We get a fee at beginning of the season. The fee varies by level. We are allowed to spread the payment over the season rather than paying all at once.

It is communicated very clearly to us what this doesn’t cover (mainly uniform stuff and the actual meet fees). This is one place where this gym has good communication. People new to team were given an estimate of the cost with the invites our daughters got to team. And that estimate was very close to the actual cost.

Based on this thread, I am very glad it is this way because I know exactly upfront what the cost is and I can either chose to pay or choose to not have my DD compete on the team.

And then I don’t feel like I need itemized receipts or worry about exactly how it is split.

We do not have a booster club.

Thanks jillc. I appreciate your response. This sounds similar to the proposal I have just written for our club. That there is a program competition fee that all gymnasts in the program pay at the beginning of the year that is then used to cover coaches costs. Event entry fees will then be invoiced on an individual basis.

Do any clubs have a policy on minimum number of entrants per event? this is also something we are looking at, especially for the compulsory levels, as we are a regionally based club that needs to travel to access higher standard competitions.

 

[Rose7777]

Forgive me for the potentially naive question - but what is a Booster club? I have never heard that term used here in Australia.

In terms of fees, do most gyms add a levy at the beginning of the season that covers the coaching costs etc? or is it added to each competition? We are currently in the process of re designing the way we structure our competition fees as we are potentially losing money each time we send gymnasts to compete. (Mind you there has been no change to the fee structure in the last 10 years... yet of course entry fees have significantly increased.

Thanks in advance.

Our gym is Xcel only and includes set meet fees at the start of the year. These fees include states, but say that $x will be credited back if a gymnast does not qualify. It does not include regionals and gymnasts who qualify pay the entry fee for that separately (we have a single state qualifying meet and a small percentage of gymnast at states qualify for regionals).

 

[Madden3]

Forgive me for the potentially naive question - but what is a Booster club? I have never heard that term used here in Australia.

In terms of fees, do most gyms add a levy at the beginning of the season that covers the coaching costs etc? or is it added to each competition? We are currently in the process of re designing the way we structure our competition fees as we are potentially losing money each time we send gymnasts to compete. (Mind you there has been no change to the fee structure in the last 10 years... yet of course entry fees have significantly increased.

Thanks in advance.

Here is my probably imperfect understanding about booster clubs - It is a fairly loose term to mean entities in the amateur sports world (including high school and college sports) to fundraise or otherwise "support" a sports team and the athletes on a sports team. In gymnastics, I think the typical booster club (but not all) maintain non-profit status so that they can legally raise funds without paying taxes on earnings. To do this, the US tax collection agency (the IRS) has specific rules those clubs must follow that are different from what a for profit entity (such as a gym) must follow when dealing with customers or clients.

Some US gymnastics gyms have boosters and some do not, and there are many threads here debating the pros and cons.

My personal experience is that a poorly run, illegal practices booster is a nightmare, and a properly run, legal practices booster can work well and be very helpful to offset competition costs, but in either case, parents will be expected (although legally they cannot be required if the booster is non profit) to participate in fundraising endeavors and/or pay a (typically annual) assessment to the booster, because the cost of meet participation has to be paid somehow. So parents who would rather not volunteer (and it can be a lot) and would prefer to pay for all things meet related directly to the gym are less likely to appreciate even well run boosters.

At our gym, which (imo) currently has a properly run, legal practices booster, parents are asked to participate in various fundraising efforts throughout the year, and every gymnast pays an annual assessment to cover that part of the expenses that are not met by fundraising. Some question the idea of assessments AND fundraising, but I prefer things this way because this practice keeps the per-family volunteering commitment manageable. We pay that assessment before the season begins and it is based on an estimate of what the seasons costs will be (minus what is sitting in the account from fundraising efforts.) I believe that the goal is to always have money left over rather than to run at a deficit, and any remaining funds roll over to the next year or are used for non-meet related expenses the booster may incur in the off season.

 

[gymgal]

Forgive me for the potentially naive question - but what is a Booster club? I have never heard that term used here in Australia.

In terms of fees, do most gyms add a levy at the beginning of the season that covers the coaching costs etc? or is it added to each competition? We are currently in the process of re designing the way we structure our competition fees as we are potentially losing money each time we send gymnasts to compete. (Mind you there has been no change to the fee structure in the last 10 years... yet of course entry fees have significantly increased.

Thanks in advance.

A booster club is typically a parent run organization used for fundraising to offset the extra costs associated with competing. The fundraising can be small, like selling a variety of different items, do car washes, get corporate sponsors, or be very large like running multiple meets a year.

Is the way your gym handles their fees comparable to other gyms in Australia? That seems odd that the gym wouldn't adjust this fee yearly based on meet plans. Even with this, you are still taking a chance as travel may be more expensive than anticipated but at least it will be a closer approximations. Ours varies based on how close/distant the meets are for that year - whether air travel is needed, etc.

 

[gymgal]

At our gym, which (imo) currently has a properly run, legal practices booster, parents are asked to participate in various fundraising efforts throughout the year, and every gymnast pays an annual assessment to cover that part of the expenses that are not met by fundraising. Some question the idea of assessments AND fundraising, but I prefer things this way because this practice keeps the per-family volunteering commitment manageable. We pay that assessment before the season begins and it is based on an estimate of what the seasons costs will be (minus what is sitting in the account from fundraising efforts.) I believe that the goal is to always have money left over rather than to run at a deficit, and any remaining funds roll over to the next year or are used for non-meet related expenses the booster may incur in the off season.

Out of curiosity, what do you do in the event that a parent refuses to pay the fee?

 

[skschlag]

At our gym, which (imo) currently has a properly run, legal practices booster, parents are asked to participate in various fundraising efforts throughout the year, and every gymnast pays an annual assessment to cover that part of the expenses that are not met by fundraising. Some question the idea of assessments AND fundraising, but I prefer things this way because this practice keeps the per-family volunteering commitment manageable. We pay that assessment before the season begins and it is based on an estimate of what the seasons costs will be (minus what is sitting in the account from fundraising efforts.) I believe that the goal is to always have money left over rather than to run at a deficit, and any remaining funds roll over to the next year or are used for non-meet related expenses the booster may incur in the off season.

Having fundraisng money in individual accounts based on what is raised is not legal in a non-profit. However, if everyone gets the same/fair amount regardless of work, then it is.

 

[Madden3]

Out of curiosity, what do you do in the event that a parent refuses to pay the fee?

Hah ha! I have wondered that myself. I am not involved in the organization of the booster but I can try to find out.

 

[Madden3]

Having fundraisng money in individual accounts based on what is raised is not legal in a non-profit. However, if everyone gets the same/fair amount regardless of work, then it is.

There are no separate accounts. Assessments are based on the level the kid is competing, all the same level pay the same and it all goes into the same pot.

 

[auscoachgymmum]

Thanks Madden3 and gymgal, I think that makes sense. There's really nothing like that system here that I know of. Basically our clubs are either non-for profit or privately owned, and fundraising is still a part of both, depending on how the gym decides to work. We are a not for profit gym, so often our fundraising efforts go towards extra equipment, building works etc, rather than competition costs. For things like nationals and state events the club will often "sponsor" the athlete that qualified to assist with costs, and our athletes also often seek out independent sponsorship for these types of events. I know that I have with my daughter.

In terms of competitions, we did have a fee added on to each entry fee to "cover" coaches costs, and this is the fee that has been previously forgotten about, and thus not increased. The other flaw in this set fee added on to the entry fee is that it doesn't come anywhere near covering the coach cost if there is only a small number competing. Thus, we are looking at building this into the program cost for squads (or team as I think you guys might call it). That would be a non refundable program fee - families will then pay the event entry fee based on what the gymnast competes.

I must say - Cb has been a wealth of information on so many things thus far... I really appreciate everyone's willingness to answer questions. Thanks.

 

[raenndrops]

Out of curiosity, what do you do in the event that a parent refuses to pay the fee?

I would think that one of 2 things would happen:
1 - they would not register the gymnast for meets (since the assessment covers meet fees)
2 - The gymnast would have to pay for the meets (including any coaches fees etc) to the GYM before the registration date or not be registered. The gym would then pass the money on to the Booster Club.

 

[gymgal]

I would think that one of 2 things would happen:
1 - they would not register the gymnast for meets (since the assessment covers meet fees)
2 - The gymnast would have to pay for the meets (including any coaches fees etc) to the GYM before the registration date or not be registered. The gym would then pass the money on to the Booster Club.

If they are running as a non-profit, like Madden3 stated, and the bylaws say that the meet fees are paid for through the BC, as it appears they are, then they legally cannot refuse to pay for a gymnast's meet fees b/c the family refused to contribute to the BC. Same for apparel and coach/travel fees. Now, there are a lot of BC that are running as non-profit but are not following the IRS rules, so I am sure there are many BCs who would do what you state. I have heard of some that refuse to let the gymnast compete without the fees paid. Not a problem if you are for profit but a huge NO for nonprofits that are set up to pay meet fees directly.

I was just curious about what happens if several parents just refuse. I mean, the BC probably could cover one child but if several did it, it could be thousands of dollars and they wouldn't have enough funds to cover all the fees.

 

[Dahlia]

If they are running as a non-profit, like Madden3 stated, and the bylaws say that the meet fees are paid for through the BC, as it appears they are, then they legally cannot refuse to pay for a gymnast's meet fees b/c the family refused to contribute to the BC. Same for apparel and coach/travel fees. Now, there are a lot of BC that are running as non-profit but are not following the IRS rules, so I am sure there are many BCs who would do what you state. I have heard of some that refuse to let the gymnast compete without the fees paid. Not a problem if you are for profit but a huge NO for nonprofits that are set up to pay meet fees directly.

I was just curious about what happens if several parents just refuse. I mean, the BC probably could cover one child but if several did it, it could be thousands of dollars and they wouldn't have enough funds to cover all the fees.

Most gyms with boosters require gymnasts to be in "good standing" with the BC as a condition of being on team. A family that refuses to "volunteer" or pay the penalty could find their child asked to leave the team. Since the team is under the gym and the BC is a separate entity, it's legal.

 

[sevenatenine2]

Our gym does not provide an itemized breakdown, but we tell the parents that competition fees include meet entry, team entry, coaches gas and time, hotels if necessary, and per diem for meals.

The gym estimates these expenses, comes up with a number, and divides it into 12 equal payments that are added to tuition I think it’s about $700 per year. Honestly, I’m sure the gym estimates high (why wouldn’t they?) and they don’t provide any money back if expenses are lower, but I don’t think they’re turning a huge profit, either.

The gym is reasonable about providing a hotel if the sessions are randomly spread throughout the weekend, are early or late, etc., but the coaches also often choose not to spend the night and drive home to get back with their families.

In two other gyms I’ve been a part of, it was very clear that the lower levels paid for the higher levels. For example, I think they probably took a team of Level 2-10, estimated expenses for the year, and then divided yearly expenses equally among all team members. So, competition fees were about $1100 for levels 2-10. The 20 Level 2s that competed 5 meets all within an hour and a half of our gym were paying way more than their expenses were, and the 2 Level 10s that went to 2 flyaway meets plus regionals/nationals were paying way less. This was never explained to us. I was a little annoyed by this, but realized if my kid ever made it to a top level, it would be nice. I’m not sure it’s fair for the two level 10s to have to foot their bill entirely by themselves either, so....not sure what the best answer is for that.