Women Dead Cows??

[GymSurvivor]

So I've always done dead cows as a preset to flyaways. But my coach all of the sudden at practice today tells me that I'm not allowed to do them as they will encourage bad technique during flyaways (mind you, I apparently did not have an issue, she just learned this and therefore banned them)

Is this true? Something like, if you are really letting go at the correct time your body should automatically flip in the lay out position.

Will it really hurt that much if I continue dead cows (I'm learning tuck flyaways by the way) They really seem to help if I do at least one before I work on flyaways for the day.

 

[AmandaLynn]

So I've always done dead cows as a preset to flyaways. But my coach all of the sudden at practice today tells me that I'm not allowed to do them as they will encourage bad technique during flyaways (mind you, I apparently did not have an issue, she just learned this and therefore banned them)

Is this true? Something like, if you are really letting go at the correct time your body should automatically flip in the lay out position.

Will it really hurt that much if I continue dead cows (I'm learning tuck flyaways by the way) They really seem to help if I do at least one before I work on flyaways for the day.

Well... my opinion is that this can be seen two ways. I learned flyaways via the "Dead cow into a pit, then flip it" method. However, I do agree with your coach that if a gymnast actually releases the bar at the correct time, and in the correct position, this is simply not possible. the gymnast would land on their head if they failed to rotate, as you SHOULD be letting go in a candlestick position, not in a horizontal position.

However, I do believe that with larger kids that you can not physically hand-spot through the correct body positions, there may be something to be said for the "dead cow" drill in order to remove some of the fear of letting go of the bar. So... In short... I'm undecided. As a coach, this would definitely be on a case-by-case basis. I probably would not teach them this way for tiny kids and/or kids that had potential to be upper level gymnasts. But for older/bigger kids that most likely would not be learning more advanced dismounts, it would be a drill that I may use, depending on some other factors.

 

[Faith]

I have no idea what a dead cow is . I do know that my dd was learning cast underswing from the high bar, she was automatically flipping when she let go, so between her body flipping and her trying to land on her feet, she was coming down on the back of her neck (into a pit!). So she was taught flyaways pretty sharpish as it was the safest option...

 

[coachmolly]

I have never heard that terminology, but assume you are referring to tap swing-release-flat back into the pit or squishy mat? If I'm correct in that assumption, I don't think it's the ideal for teaching flyaways correctly, but I've seen a lot worse (I learned by just chucking them off a pit bar unattended). It's also a reasonable substitution if you have bigger kids or limited other options to teach flyaways.
I coach high schoolers and we don't have a pit, so it's a challenging process. They are too big to really heavily spot through the skill or to introduce the skill and correct body positions on the low bar. So beyond working tap swings and an occasional flat back, our only other option is double spotting straight off the high bar which is a scary process for a kid who has never really released the bar out of a tap swing before! So flat backs at least encourage them to let go, once they get that we can rework the timing later.
Again, this would not be the ideal process for smaller kiddos or in a better equipped gym, but it's what has to work out of necessity and we have some pretty decent flyaways.

 

[AlexsGymmyMom]

My DD first intro to flyaways was doing the tap swing-release-flat back into the pit. She got very comfortable doing this so when her coach asked her to try to bring her knees in ( I guess to actually do the flyaway) she ended up kneeing herself in the chest. She bruised her chest and couldn't even hang from the bar for about 2 weeks. Even jumping on the tramp was painful. She finally "got" the skill by being spotted over and over until she knew when to let go on her own.

 

[GymSurvivor]

Yes, a dead cow is tap swings and then landing on your back in the pit.

I guess I understand the thought behind it not being a good teaching method. But I'm not an itty bitty that can be tossed through it (19 years old) And the main reason is when I started doing them without doing a dead cow first I started throwing my head back without letting go which resulted in closing my shoulders.

So I was just curious what others/other coaches thought.

 

[coachmolly]

Yes, a dead cow is tap swings and then landing on your back in the pit.

I guess I understand the thought behind it not being a good teaching method. But I'm not an itty bitty that can be tossed through it (19 years old) And the main reason is when I started doing them without doing a dead cow first I started throwing my head back without letting go which resulted in closing my shoulders.

So I was just curious what others/other coaches thought.

Did your coach suggest any alternatives? It seems kind of silly that she would say not to do it anymore and then not provide any other options. Perhaps ask her what you can do instead?

 

[gymdog]

It's a fine drill to learn to let go. It's not 100% technically accurate for a layout flyaway, but sheesh, people aren't going to learn anything at the rate some coaches want to go. You need to teach the kids "let go of the bar, go forwards" somehow. If you have to do it every time you do a flyaway and you have your flyaway, then I guess your coach doesn't want you to do that anymore, which I can understand. This is a very beginning drill, not something done every practice. Tap swing single flyaway doesn't need a "timer" unless you have a severe fear. Also this can be dangerous if it's done unspotted or onto an improper surface, so I could see banning it for those reasons if it's being done in an adult class with no spotting and possibly improper set up. This drill should NEVER be done by inexperienced gymnasts without spotting and supervision onto a resi surface. But then the instructor failed to explain the real reasons behind it.

 

[gymnastics1200]

dead cows do not create bad technique in flyaways...i used to be TERRIFIED to do layout flyaways but doing dead cows really helped alot...and if your coach isnt willing to spot you on them do them by yourself just landing on your back into the pit (I have)