Does anyone know of new outbreaks at gyms?

[mommyof1]

Mitigation is going to be on going for a long time.

What mitigation? I don't see much of it. Inadequate testing, virtually no contact tracing, no isolation of suspected cases, people openly flouting mask mandates, the AAP and state guidelines suggesting "encouraging" rather than mandating masks in schools.

 

[mommyof1]

And the fact remains, if someone is a high risk they might need to make different choices on what they are going to do and where. That might mean giving up things, postponing things or even a career change.

Another example of American self-centeredness. If we all made a few relatively small sacrifices for a relatively period of time, we could tamp the virus down to a manageable level, and many fewer people would have to suffer. Universal mask-wearing, for example, could prevent the need for stay-home orders to be reimposed.

 

[mommyof1]

And where was it said he or she as they like.

It is said right here:

What you don’t do is tell say 85-90 people (of the 100 mentioned above) who are not at risk they too must limit their contact for 10-15 that need to.

 

[gymmomtotwo]

Most of us are making and have made "small sacrifices" such as loss of jobs, loss of a decent education, loss of important life events (graduations, proms, religious services, weddings, funerals) all to help save the vulnerable. We have been doing it since March. Maybe people are more civic minded here but I rarely see anyone in an indoor public place without a mask, and they are not mandated. In fact the people most likely to ignore the mask requirements are the elderly. It it not selfish to expect that at some point healthy people will be able to resume their lives if no vaccine becomes available. To expect healthy children to live isolated and uneducated with no activities indefinitely for a small minority who can isolate themselves seems an unreasonable expectation as well.

 

[TumbleTimes4]

What mitigation? I don't see much of it. Inadequate testing, virtually no contact tracing, no isolation of suspected cases, people openly flouting mask mandates, the AAP and state guidelines suggesting "encouraging" rather than mandating masks in schools.

It’s unrealistic to expect proper mask wearing from elementary school kids for several hours, especially kindergarteners and first graders. They will take them off or jerk them down below their noses, constantly touch them, etc. If my child’s health depended on proper mask wearing from classmates, I would not send them. and I don’t think it’s reasonable for a gymnast to wear one for a hour practice. IIRC, they are not recommended for strenuous exercise.

I’m very sorry that your family is at more risk. I’m trying to do my part by wearing a mask, social distance, etc. But I would like to see a little more acknowledgment from those at risk that staying shutdown is also detrimental to many as well. In my home county, social services received record calls. Children in that area are in more danger of abuse and neglect from staying home then they are of going to school and catching Covid. There were no deaths related to Covid in March, but there were two due to abuse. I know that it may not necessarily be fair for your family to have to stay home, but at least they are safe there. Many children are not safe at home. Both sides should be more considerate of the other. There is not a “right” here, both have valid concerns.

 

[kecks]

i think we are arguing with wrong alternatives here.

it is not "lock the at risk persons away" vs. "lock everyone away to protect at risk people".
it is more like as of our knowledge about sarscovII up to now that
1) everyone is at risk with this virus, since evenabout 50% of the 20% asymptomatic cases do have lung damage, heart damage and the like without even knowing about it, long term health consequences after "mild" infections are becoming more likely by the minute and about 10% of the infected are sick for more than 100 days. and all of this is not even mentioning the about 1 in 5 infected people who need to be gospitalized because of the virus. the symptoms are that of a systemtic infection not a lunge disease. f.e. people do experience brain fog for weeks after the coughing and fever have gone away. it is not "severe infection or something like the flu", it is much more complex and more like the lottery if you do manage to get infected.
2) if governments decide to suppress to virus back to a level lower than community transmission (this may mean to get back into lockdown for a few weeks if the pandemic is out of control) and invest in contact tracing and testing policies (f.e. the city of munich has of now over 350 people working fulltime in contact tracing and we are down to about 30 infections per day, 300 active cases and we are into the process of reopening for month now, it is going well so far) and mitigation infrastucture (like no indoor mass events for the forseeable future, mask mandate in public transport and shops...) the overall cost in lives and money alike will be much much lower than by going with the "everyone do as they please and need to do"-approach.

so it is "clever suppression or at least mitigation of the pandemic for a while till it is under control by reducing case numbers to a tracable level" vs. "oh well, everyone on their own, too bad you are a high risk-person, i want to do gymnastics/go to a restaurant without wearing a mask and seating as i please and regestering beforehand/insert personal pleasure activiy of choice here".

 

[mommyof1]

It’s unrealistic to expect proper mask wearing from elementary school kids for several hours, especially kindergarteners and first graders. They will take them off or jerk them down below their noses, constantly touch them, etc. If my child’s health depended on proper mask wearing from classmates, I would not send them. and I don’t think it’s reasonable for a gymnast to wear one for a hour practice. IIRC, they are not recommended for strenuous exercise.

I’m very sorry that your family is at more risk. I’m trying to do my part by wearing a mask, social distance, etc. But I would like to see a little more acknowledgment from those at risk that staying shutdown is also detrimental to many as well. In my home county, social services received record calls. Children in that area are in more danger of abuse and neglect from staying home then they are of going to school and catching Covid. There were no deaths related to Covid in March, but there were two due to abuse. I know that it may not necessarily be fair for your family to have to stay home, but at least they are safe there. Many children are not safe at home. Both sides should be more considerate of the other. There is not a “right” here, both have valid concerns.

My point is that we are being presented with a false dichotomy. It's not a choice between shutting everything down and opening everything up with no restrictions and all precautions being an individual choice. If we had testing, contact tracing, isolation, strictly enforced mask mandates, and restrictions on large gatherings and nonessential high-risk services such as bars and dine-in restaurants, we could open up schools and perhaps even gyms in a way that would be relatively safe for nearly everyone. But if we reopen in a haphazard and illogical way with more regard for powerful political constituencies and business lobbies than for the needs of ordinary citizens, and with an "every man for himself" attitude, we end up with the situation we're currently in--bars and restaurants are open, but most schools will be forced to resume on-line learning after a few weeks this fall. A considered approach to reopening benefits the kids who are at risk from being out of school, along with those for whom being in school poses a risk.

 

[NutterButter]

Most of us are making and have made "small sacrifices"

This is true. I'd even go as far to say that most have made "medium sacrifices". The problem as @mommyof1 mentions is the "dark side of American individualism" which has led to an entire movement of people refusing to wear masks and believing that any eventual vaccine will somehow implant a microchip. Besides not being based on any actual science, this preys upon those who suffer from mental illness. Staying healthy and receiving testing and treatment for COVID should NEVER, EVER be a political issue yet that is exactly where we find ourselves today. The #1 guy in the country refuses to wear a mask and is holding rallies in the midst of an almost nation-wide surge of COVID cases. This is the epitome of selfishness and is coming straight from the top.

A Florida mom lost her high-risk teen to COVID after bringing her to a mask-less church event then cared for her COVID-infected daughter at home by giving her antibiotics, hydroxychloroquine, and oxygen intended for an elderly family member. Parts of this treatment protocol have been touted by the leader of this country and have since been proven ineffective (and even harmful!) by scientists. The mom has since said her daughter died a Patriot. This is such an American tragedy.

 

[kecks]

also life under mitigation policies is not that bad. i went to a beergarden this week (had to register at the entrance by hand or a qr code and smartphone, wear a mask everywhere if not seated, no more than three households at one table, personel does have to wear masks and i choose to drink beer from a bottle i bought there instead a traditional glas of beer that someone else has touched before to fill it), i had three outdoor workouts last weeks with a bootcamp group that formed out of members of the gym i used to go to before march (socially distanced all the time, registering beforehand online, using public parks, shared equipment with gloves on only) and i taught monday to friday at the public school i work, 50% are in the classroom, 50% are at home using online schooling (which we do have to provide, teachers are working overtime big time here for months now) every other week. i teach on the track outside if weather permits without masks, indoors kids have to wear masks, even in the classroom if the teacher wants them to. there are disinfection stations at the entrances, cleaning is done once per day, that's it. in staff meetings i choose to wear a ffp2-masks, some colleagues decide not to wear a mask at all (the "bill gates wants to implant a chip"-crew, they to exist everywhere it seems...), but oh well, we manage so far. in munich only a single digit number of schools had to close again after reopening so far. i feel pretty safe and i am a rather careful person when it comes to this virus. it can be done if people decide to cooperate and work together.

 

[Deleted member 18037]

Another example of American self-centeredness. If we all made a few relatively small sacrifices for a relatively period of time, we could tamp the virus down to a manageable level, and many fewer people would have to suffer. Universal mask-wearing, for example, could prevent the need for stay-home orders to be reimposed.

You must of missed this part, wher I said mitigation is going to be around for a long time. It’s right below.

They world has changed. Mitigation is going to be on going for a long time..

Again you are making assumptions and judging.

I didn’t not say open things up and do whatever you want.

We are in NY. I haven’t seen my family on Long Island since January. We went months without haircuts. My kid went months not having her braces looked at. No church for months. My days out were spent going to work at a hospital full of Covid looking at the refrigerator truck they sent if we needed it for bodies. Thankfully our facility didn’t. Despite all these precautions my godmother in a nursing home died alone of Covid. No funreal, no mass, and from what I’m told the burial, was surreal to say the least.

We just last week had dinner out. We were the only party in a dining room set up for 4 parties where it used to accomodate 8-10. We wore masks unless seated. Ordered via a QR code, no menus. Waitress and bus boy masked and thrilled to be able to be working again.

Also finally back at church, every other pew. No missals. Holy water fonts replaced with hand sanitizer dispensers. 50% capacity. Masks required. 6ft markings all over.

Had my hair done a week ago.Waited in car, partitions set up all over. Temp checks. Masks for all.

And finally gym this week. They hire a Covid safety person. To do the health checks and make sure the SD rules are followed so the coaches can coach. This is not the gym experience precovid. And I won’t bore you with the detail but there is lots of mitigation Yet my kid is thrilled to be back. masking also a part

And if someone doesn’t feel safe, they should continue to stay home.

We have decided the risk to fly is too high for us. So we are not flying anytime soon. Doesn’t mean everyone should stop flying.

We have masks of many styles and colors....

This was never about 0 cases. That is simply not going to happen.

 

[Deleted member 18037]

Since the beginning of the pandemic, much of the media coverage and many statements by government officials have minimized the threat of the disease by declaring that "young, healthy" people are not at risk. There is an undeniable undercurrent of judgment in these statements against those who are not "young" and "healthy."

You are putting the judgement and also emotion into things.

First, you left out the part that everyone always does. The young and healthy have a low risk for severe complications and death. That is simply fact.

The attitude that at-risk people must lock themselves up indefinitely so that "young, healthy" people can congregate at bars, concerts, and shopping malls while the virus runs rampant is an example of the dark side of American individualism. As things stand today, my child and family will remain virtual prisoners in our home for the next year or two. If simple, low-cost, low-effort, common-sense safety measures such ask mandatory mask-wearing in public were implemented, my child could go to school and the gym. The prevailing attitude prioritizes the "right" to gallivant about without a mask above my child's right to an education.

Not one person here said masks optional and no mitigation.

And unfortunately if you are expecting a world of 0 cases that is simply not going to happen.

 

[txgymfan]

This thread has gone way too far. The topic is “does anyone know of new outbreaks at gyms”. The answer appears to be a resounding no. Gyms are taking a cautious approach and it seems to be working.

CB is NOT a political discussion board. I’m locking this thread and we will decide what to do with it later.

 

[bogwoppit]

This thread will stay locked. When things go political, or people cannot discuss difficult topics kindly, then we have no choice.