Parents Injury Update

[RAMS]

Thanks! We did buy stress balls as recommended by one of the coaches. The ortho had a daughter who was a gymnast level 10 I believe. She is familiar with the type of training in optionals. We have a PT at our gym that works with our gymnasts once a week on strength and conditioning. She was surprised no PT was ordered. I'll look into the TheraPutty and ask again about what is ok. My dd said yesterday she practiced some switch leaps etc on floor. But I'm sure it's hard when her arm doesn't move much past 90 degrees.

 

[gymdog]

Only as common as a bone not set properly (according to Ortho #2). I still don't understand how you thought she could have been exaggerating that? Both PT's we went to were concerned and said it wasn't normal.

I'll PM you later (sorry, super busy at work today)

Edited to add that I'm obviously not a doctor and not giving medical advice. I'm just passing a long the info that my Ortho gave me which makes much more sense that what I was originally told.


View attachment 6668(this is not my dd, just an illustration I found online)
The side she fractured goes about 10% further than the other side. I would say a little more than it picture I found.
I would love to have it evaluated. What kind of doctor is that and where can I find them and when can we see them?

10%? (usually measured in degrees not sure if you mean 10 degrees) wouldn't be too bad. When it isn't bilateral that can be a concern for shoulder stability or overuse on one side. Just something to be aware of if it isn't very significant now. Hyperextension on one side can also be a traumatic injury risk.

 

[NY Dad]

We have a PT at our gym that works with our gymnasts once a week on strength and conditioning. She was surprised no PT was ordered.

Again, I insisted. He had said all along that she wouldn't need PT... Until her cast was removed and she could barely move her elbow. Then he said something implying that he had said all along that she would need PT (which was not what he had said before). I had already made the PT appointment and just needed him to hand me a prescription and we went directly from there to her first PT appointment.

When she had limited mobility after 2 months he said "I did tell you it could take up to 6 months" when it hadn't improved much in 3 months he said "I told you it could take up to a year". I had already made an appointment for a second opinion at that point.

My point is that if you think she should get PT, tell your Ortho to write a perception even if he doesn't think it's necessary. Trust your gut. Other than cost/time/resources (which is something to consider) the only possible down side I've read about is when someone feels like they are limited by what the PT says they can and can't do whereas the ortho often has a more laid-back approach.

My dd used stress balls and puddy at the appointments. I had asked between balls and puddy and PT seemed to say they were both good. We got puddy because she thought it was more fun (she's 7) so I assumed she would use it more. I was right, she still plays with it.

Also, repeating that anything that my dd did I specifically made sure my dd's ortho approved. I feel like it was at least 5 weeks before she was allowed to jump. His opinion was fall --> re-break --> much more significant than original injury. He was conservative in that area.

 

[NY Dad]

10%? (usually measured in degrees not sure if you mean 10 degrees) wouldn't be too bad. When it isn't bilateral that can be a concern for shoulder stability or overuse on one side. Just something to be aware of if it isn't very significant now. Hyperextension on one side can also be a traumatic injury risk.

That's what I get for not bringing my notes to work with me . Pretty sure you're right b/c he was talking about degrees during our conversation. That was my specific concern but I didn't want to get too into it with my dd listening. Believe it or not she's risk adverse. I could see her overthink that every time she did a handstand if I expressed all my concerns and thoughts after he explained it to me and at the same time told me not to worry about it.

Do you think 10 degree difference enough to worry about? I didn't feel like he addressed the difference in hyperextension limit but more that the extension range on both sides was within the normal range and therefore nothing to worry about.

 

[Kristie]

Ugh. Breaks stink. Mine has a broken forearm so this is way different so I'm not offering advice... Just a little support!

 

[pinklemonadeliz]

Elbows are crazy! Mine had a dislocation/surgery about 19 mos ago & is still having issues even though all xrays show everything is perfect. I would definitely get a couple of other opinions before leaving it as issues can arise later on (my kiddos did & now we're going to specialists to see if anything can be done). Fingers crossed for you guys!!!

 

[NY Dad]

Hopefully it goes without saying that I'm sorry that we're all dealing with these issues. I with everyone the best that we all heal correctly and quickly. (And that we all get great medical information/advice.)

all xrays show everything is perfect

We had 6 appointments with the same ortho who told us every time the same thing. Every time he told us everything looked perfect. Even with presented with questions/comments which should have raised a flag had he been willing to admit he was wrong. Have you had different doctors examine the X-rays? You're planning to see a specialist or you have seen a specialist? What type of doctor?

Sorry if I'm sounding cynical.

 

[RAMS]

Again, I insisted. He had said all along that she wouldn't need PT... Until her cast was removed and she could barely move her elbow. Then he said something implying that he had said all along that she would need PT (which was not what he had said before). I had already made the PT appointment and just needed him to hand me a prescription and we went directly from there to her first PT appointment.

When she had limited mobility after 2 months he said "I did tell you it could take up to 6 months" when it hadn't improved much in 3 months he said "I told you it could take up to a year". I had already made an appointment for a second opinion at that point.

My point is that if you think she should get PT, tell your Ortho to write a perception even if he doesn't think it's necessary. Trust your gut. Other than cost/time/resources (which is something to consider) the only possible down side I've read about is when someone feels like they are limited by what the PT says they can and can't do whereas the ortho often has a more laid-back approach.

My dd used stress balls and puddy at the appointments. I had asked between balls and puddy and PT seemed to say they were both good. We got puddy because she thought it was more fun (she's 7) so I assumed she would use it more. I was right, she still plays with it.

Also, repeating that anything that my dd did I specifically made sure my dd's ortho approved. I feel like it was at least 5 weeks before she was allowed to jump. His opinion was fall --> re-break --> much more significant than original injury. He was conservative in that area.

Thanks, I emailed the dr. about all of this. We will see what she says.

 

[rsm]

This is all very interesting. My dd 11 years old level 8 fell off bars doing a half piroette 6 weeks ago. She had a full dislocation and fracture of her elbow. She had surgery with a pin and an anchor put in elbow. She got the cast off and pin removed 4 weeks after surgery. She has 6 more weeks of no weight bearing due to the tearing of all ligaments. Surgeon said it was a severe injury. She can't straighten her arm at all. They said start mobility at her own pace. In 6 weeks we go back test mobility. Surgeon feels she will be cleared to start training. Will order PT then if needed. What exercises can she do for her elbow to help straighten if she still can't do any weight bearing on it? She does go to gym for conditioning and lower body stretching. She's determined to make level 9 just not sure it's realistic.

For straightening, the best thing we heard is for her to relax her arm and let it "dangle". Her arm provides a little weight. I can't tell you how long it took for my DD to stop holding her arm with her other arm. But it gradually happened. She can also lie flat on the bed or floor, and let her arm relax by her side, palm up. Put a cushion under if needed to make it more comfortable. When she can bear weight, she can use a small weight to help it as well.

 

[NY Dad]

or straightening, the best thing we heard is for her to relax her arm and let it "dangle". Her arm provides a little weight. I can't tell you how long it took for my DD to stop holding her arm with her other arm

Yes, same here. Also when the arm is just dangling don't turn the arm in towards the body. He wanted it to hang straight down.

 

[gymdog]

That's what I get for not bringing my notes to work with me . Pretty sure you're right b/c he was talking about degrees during our conversation. That was my specific concern but I didn't want to get too into it with my dd listening. Believe it or not she's risk adverse. I could see her overthink that every time she did a handstand if I expressed all my concerns and thoughts after he explained it to me and at the same time told me not to worry about it.

Do you think 10 degree difference enough to worry about? I didn't feel like he addressed the difference in hyperextension limit but more that the extension range on both sides was within the normal range and therefore nothing to worry about.

It doesn't seem too bad. I would just keep it in the back of your mind for now.

 

[NY Dad]

Thanks, easier said than done but I really do think that's good advice.

 

[RAMS]

So I emailed my dd orthopedic surgeon to ask abut therapy and exercises for her arm to help get it to straighten and this is what she said.
"For the first 6 weeks after cast removal I prefer not do do therapy as aggressive therapy can pull the bone apart when it is not completely healed. If she is still stiff when you come in for follow-up, we can start therapy then. Swimming is a good way to get the arm moving gently, or carrying something like a gallon of mild (no heavier) in that hand and letting the arm swing as she walks. I just dont want anyone else pushing on it yet. Getting the elbow straight is the usually the most difficult after this type of injury, but she will get there."

I guess we will start with some swimming and maybe a lighter object like a half gallon of milk. I think they are being very conservative because she tore all the ligaments and tendons as well as the fracture in her elbow. Initially out the gate after surgery she said it was bad and no gymnastics for 3 months. She was optimistic she the cast was off that she could be cleared for weight bearing in 6 weeks and back trying to do some gymnastics.

 

[NY Dad]

10%? (usually measured in degrees not sure if you mean 10 degrees) wouldn't be too bad.

According to the Ortho it's 35 degrees difference on flexion. Noted that she can extend further on the injured elbow but didn't measure it.

gallon of mild (no heavier)

When my dd started with weights first it was a 1 pound weight, then 2, 3, 4. I had the 5 pound weight ready to go but by then she was done with PT. A gallon seems very heavy.

 

[RAMS]

I agree about the gallon. I filled a half gallon about 1/4 full yesterday. She said that seemed to work. Going to take her swimming next week. Thxnks for sharing your experience.

 

[gymdog]

According to the Ortho it's 35 degrees difference on flexion. Noted that she can extend further on the injured elbow but didn't measure it.

When my dd started with weights first it was a 1 pound weight, then 2, 3, 4. I had the 5 pound weight ready to go but by then she was done with PT. A gallon seems very heavy.

35 seems pretty significant? Do they think it will improve over time?

 

[gymdog]

If you're anywhere near Boston, you could contact here and see if this needs to be evaluated at her age

https://championptandperformance.com/about-us/

Dr Tilley is the gymnastics expert. If not maybe that will help you search for something closer.

 

[NY Dad]

35 seems pretty significant? Do they think it will improve over time?

No, the ortho said it won't get better. He said elbow bones don't remodel.

 

[gymdog]

I wasn't sure the extent of the ligament involvement and if they thought muscular strength might compensate for it over time. I personally would try to see if you could find someone familiar with gymnastics that has a medical background as well (like Dr Tilley) and get it evaluated. It just seems like having a significant difference like that could be an issue with back handsprings and so on.