WAG New Move Up Criteria

[GymGirl's Mom]

sorry. IMO not every kid, especially older ones, can do all the TOPS physical abilities- like 10 presses, but that doesn't mean they won't be a successful gymnast.

 

[iwannacoach]

sorry. IMO not every kid, especially older ones, can do all the TOPS physical abilities- like 10 presses, but that doesn't mean they won't be a successful gymnast.

You can say that again! Sure, they gotta have the ability to work through all of the tops stuff in the context they are able to do a bit of each discipline and are making progress on getting there. I think issues surrounding flexibility should be considered because kids can become more flexible over time and then be able to do exercises where flexibility is a companion to strength.

I'll go along with the notion that the coaches are either thinning out the herd or are relying on their reputations as strict disciplinarians to eliminate slackard conditioning. Well, either those two, or they just want to bolster their ability to say, "Shut up, I'll decide what to do, I can change my mind anytime I please."

 

[Flossyduck]

It seems really tough to introduce those suddenly, if they are not the sort of skills the kids normally train. However I have to say that every one of the kids in our gym from equivalent US level 6 and up can do those. They practice straddle sit press to hand stand every session from a young age. They have to press up to handstand and lower back to straddle sit five times without their bum touching the floor. Our kids have to compete 'range and conditioning' as part of their level and it's a required move, along with handstand hold etc. The only one they don't need until later is the cast to handstand, which they don't need to compete until aged 9/10/level 3. They are good skills to have if the gym is trying to thin the programme, but they cannot be learnt overnight, that's crazy tough.

 

[Empowered]

Just to be clear, the only thing I take real issue with is the press handstands.

I am not sure what they do in these places where everyone can do them, but here many optional gymnasts cannot do a TOPs press to handstand much less 10. Furthermore I've seen TOPs kids that can crank out a bajillion presses who aren't strong on bars because they muscle everything.

I am not trying to justify my child, anyone who knows me knows I have no delusions about where she stands as an athlete, but bars is her best event. It's the only place she's ever had true success and she's done it using her swing and her brain to compensate for what she lacks. She can kip cast handstand straddle and straight despite having no press.

I don't question having her TRY to learn a press, but giving her 6 months to learn to do ten in a row seems brutal. Especially when less than 20% of the team can even do 1.

If it is a thinning, it will be a very small herd when finished... Lol

 

[JBS]

I am not sure what they do in these places where everyone can do them, but here many optional gymnasts cannot do a TOPs press to handstand much less 10.

They just work them. If a press from straddle "L" is not worked...you will not get it. It is not a skill that will necessarily go in a routine in women's gymnastics...so it is sometimes overlooked. In men's gymnastics...you have to have it...you will see this skill developed right in the men's compulsory routines..."endo roll press handstands" in the floor routines.

Not sure why you need 10...but one is very useful...and if you can do one...you can do more. We allow them on p-bars or beam so inflexible gymnasts can do them to.

 

[ZZMom]

My older daughter was a level 10 gymnast and could never master a press to handstand. Maybe it was because she started gymnastics when she was close to ten and the other kids who had been through all the levels of preteam where these are worked daily. She could also never do the middle splits. No amount of stretching ever changed that. But, she had nice dynamic flexibility with great straddle jumps, etc.

I think these requirements would be okay as long as the kids have been working on all of these things for a while and exceptions can be made in the cases where it makes sense. But, I don't think they need all of them (particularly the press handstands) to be a good optional gymnnast.

 

[Gymmom495]

I agree that you cannot just change the game on girls who have been training a certain way their whole lives. I have a 7 year old who can do every TOPS skill listed except she is a bit shy of the complete handstand hold, can only climb the rope half way in the pike position and can only get 3-4 press handstands out. But this is the difference in training someone to do it and telling someone they are expected to just have these skills. It's not right for the older girls and does not measure how talented of a gymnast they are.

 

[Jenny]

I agree that you cannot just change the game on girls who have been training a certain way their whole lives. I have a 7 year old who can do every TOPS skill listed except she is a bit shy of the complete handstand hold, can only climb the rope half way in the pike position and can only get 3-4 press handstands out. But this is the difference in training someone to do it and telling someone they are expected to just have these skills. It's not right for the older girls and does not measure how talented of a gymnast they are.

The "skills" you list are actually termed "physical abilities" for TOPs. TOPs "skills" are actually different and are listed here http://usagym.org/docs/Women/TOPs/10skills.pdf

It is a little confusing but we know what you mean! Your little 7 year old is doing fabulous.

 

[3rd_time_around]

I am surprised that most level 10's could not do this. In my area most optionals could quite easily fulfil this criteria and the coaches would expect a lot more to move up.

They ALL can easily fulfill this? Our optional program of 37 or so has 1 girl that can do 10 phs, and she has qualified pre-elite. Our other elite trainer can do maybe 3, last I heard. Great gymnastics doesn't rest on mastering these strength and conditioning skills. And it took our 1 gymnast years to accomplish this phs ability even though she trained it for years. In our TOPS group only one girl is close to 10. We have so many state and regional champions, and most of them can't do ALL those things listed. I think requiring them as a move-up criteria is not right. Add them as part of conditioning and working toward those goals is a great thing, but not fair to expect everyone to suddenly do them in order to move up. My dd would still be a level 4, since she never could do more than 1 phs.

 

[Deleted member 14190]

To the OP,
Clearly they want to improve the conditioning and strength by giving the kids goals. I seriously wouldnt worry about it, because when season rolls around they will have to make adjustments with the presses, but in the end the kids will be stronger. I am a coach and some of my top kids cannot press, one just won level 9 bars at regionals.

 

[shelovestoflip]

DD's coaches handed out "must haves" for new level 7 and 8 last week as well. I appreciate them setting some standards, but man is it a tough jump from current 7 to new 8. No press-up requirements, but they have to have C tumbling on beam and floor, as well as a C on bars (not sure if a FH to HS will count -- they're working double backs into the pit at the moment). Makes it just a little tougher than current level 8 requirements. A decent number of the current 8s don't meet these requirements. Are these rules really going to help girls get to 9 or just keep more girls from level 8? DD has 5 months to get the skills before moveups. I'm not really worried about bars or beam, but floor is going to be interesting.

Could someone clarify two things for me...
1st: are these new TOPS requirements for all gyms (as in USAG directive) or just the OP's gym? I hadn't heard about this nor, I think, has my daughter.

2nd: you mnetion jump from current 7 to new 8. I guess I sort of missed something...I didn't think there was a 'new 8'...I thought the changes just went to 7?

My daughter just had Level 8 States last weekend. This was her first year Level 8. She had a nice season overall and scored in the low 35s AA at States.

Also, my daughter def cannot do 10 press handstands. I'm not sure she can even do 1.

Not sure what the other TOPS requirements are. Rope climb and I know she cannot climb the rope in the sitting position that I think is required.

Thanks for any insight!

 

[Deleted member 14190]

Could someone clarify two things for me...
1st: are these new TOPS requirements for all gyms (as in USAG directive) or just the OP's gym? I hadn't heard about this nor, I think, has my daughter.

2nd: you mnetion jump from current 7 to new 8. I guess I sort of missed something...I didn't think there was a 'new 8'...I thought the changes just went to 7?

My daughter just had Level 8 States last weekend. This was her first year Level 8. She had a nice season overall and scored in the low 35s AA at States.

Also, my daughter def cannot do 10 press handstands. I'm not sure she can even do 1.

Not sure what the other TOPS requirements are. Rope climb and I know she cannot climb the rope in the sitting position that I think is required.

Thanks for any insight!

==
this is only a gym requirement from the OP gym.
If your daughter competed level 8 this year, she can either move to 9, move to 8, or stay where she is, which will be 7 next year. next years level 8 will be a small step up from this years in skills allowed, 1 C. ask your coach to clarify.