Parents Repeat or Not Necessary?

[tumblingmama]

We just moved to a different state and my daughter (just finished Level 4 right before the move) has been trying a new gym this week. For some background info, her scores at states were: 9.6 beam (2nd), 9.5 bars (5th) 9.3 floor (8th), 9.425 vault (8th) and 37.825 AA (4th). Her old gym was not working new skills yet by the time we left. She has had two practices so far at the new gym and has gotten her cartwheel on high beam, back walkover on low beam, double back hand spring, and front handspring. So amazing! She does not have her kip or backward roll handstand (not sure what the term is for that, sorry!). But has also barely worked either so far. I can't think of anything else she is missing. The new gym does do a lot of TOP's type stuff, which her old gym did not. Her new coach had her in the group moving up at first and then moved her to the group staying back for the second practice, so my daughter was really upset and worried that they would want her to repeat (in the new level 3) which she does NOT want to do. In my opinion, she had a great year and did awesome at states and is clearly capable of being challenged since she has learned so many new skills in just two practices. I think the coach will make her recommendation today after her third practice. If she suggests her doing the new level 3, I feel like I would have to disagree... which would be hard for me because I am very non-confrontational. I think I'm just wondering if I'm justified in my thinking...

 

[GymGirl's Mom]

IMO at DD's gym- and all the gyms I am familiar with-- no kip- no L5 (or L4 now). Maybe they have her in that new L3 group until she gets her kip? Maybe that group is training the kip, back extention roll, and the other skills your DD needs, and the other group already has them? Just a guess. Certainly sounds like she did very well in L4 last season, my guess is they won't let her compete without ALL the skills for new L4 though.

When does competition season start in your state/region? If it's in the Fall/Winter I would expect she'd have her missing skills by then, if August that may be pushing it. The kip can be tricky for some while other kids get it fast and struggle with other skills. I am a mom with no coaching experience, so take my advice with a grain of salt

 

[gymboymom]

I too wonder if they have her in that group for now because those girls are just starting to work the new L4 skills too. If this gym does more uptraining than your old gym did, I can see her working out with this group for now, then switch. I think looking at the girls and which group has kips, is a great idea. We moved to a much more competitive gym from a different state, and some days I think ds (L5) should go back to working with the preteam boys to get his basics better Gyms are so different. It is definitely a hard question for you to ask though without sounding pushy. And the when the comp season starts is a good question too. Just another mom here though too.

 

[vagymmomma]

Will they do move ups during the year? Does your gym offer private lessons where she can focus on the kip? The kip is huge - in many cases a deal breaker. And unfortunately a good bar worker in level 4 does not necessarily translate to one in level 5 unless they have a decent tap swing and kip. Talk to the coaches. It seems sad with her mastery of level 4 to repeat, so be proactive to see what you can do to help your DD move the necessary skills forward. Uptraining in a repeat year is key though and as long as you see that happening a repeat won't be the deal breaker in her pursuit of a gymnastics life.

 

[iwannacoach]

I think you can count on something I'll call "coaches greed" to help you understand a level decision. Most coaches have a level they are priming every kid to get to, and do well in once they get there. So what level does it seem this gym team really hangs it hat on. My feeling is the coach will make the right decision in the sense that it will provide, eventually, a well prepared gymnast for their showcase level where they compete most favorably relative to their peer clubs in the larger local area.

So look into what it is this gym does well. Start with mymeetscores.com and search using the clubs name. That should get you a roster of former and current team members, and the results at their last recorded competition. There is a line of clickable heading at the top of of the roster list that allows you to sort the roster alphabetically, competitive levels, individual event scores, and all-around scores. You can also click on any child's name and get a history of their scores and the meets they've competed in. You can click on any meet to get results for the entire meet, and can get an entire team's results within that competition by clicking on the team's name that appears with each competitors results.

Mymeetscores has been criticized for being inaccurate by some people. I don't know if this is that big of an issue for your purposes, and it's the only resource I can think of that's going to give you a sneak peek into a team's "pedigree."

So get a sense of what the teams priorities are, and figure your dd is going to be groomed to fit that mold.... more or less.

 

[Deleted member D3987]

well, i think that all coaches should do what makes the parents and CHILD happy...(tongue in cheek with a long exasperated sigh...)

 

[sglemon]

I would wait for the recommendation, before worrying about it. Once the coach talks to you about her placement ( either way), it may all make sense. Stressing yourself out over "possibilities" at this time, will just make everything worst.

 

[tumblingmama]

I just wanted to be prepared, it's not that I'm worried. I'm just not the best at disagreeing with people... I tend to back down in situations like that. But I really want to advocate for my daughter, who has worked so hard and did extremely well. And like vagymmomma said, it seems sad to me for her to spend another year doing what she already does well. Her old gym does not work on any new skills at all until after states, which is when we left. They don't make decisions about placements until the summer. So she never had a chance to learn a kip because they never worked on them. But this gym seems to work on new skills throughout the year and they have already made their decisions about the next season. So I kind of feel like she is in an unfair position and then I feel guilty that we had to move . It seems like she will get her kip quickly seeing as she already picked up four new skills this week alone since she has had the opportunity to work on them. I did look up the girls she is grouped with right now who are repeating and they all had <34 AA's all season so I'm just not so sure my daughter fits in there. Oh well... I'll keep you updated. Maybe we need to try some other gyms, too.

 

[sglemon]

I just wanted to be prepared, it's not that I'm worried. I'm just not the best at disagreeing with people... I tend to back down in situations like that. But I really want to advocate for my daughter, who has worked so hard and did extremely well. And like vagymmomma said, it seems sad to me for her to spend another year doing what she already does well. Her old gym does not work on any new skills at all until after states, which is when we left. They don't make decisions about placements until the summer. So she never had a chance to learn a kip because they never worked on them. But this gym seems to work on new skills throughout the year and they have already made their decisions about the next season. So I kind of feel like she is in an unfair position and then I feel guilty that we had to move . It seems like she will get her kip quickly seeing as she already picked up four new skills this week alone since she has had the opportunity to work on them. I did look up the girls she is grouped with right now who are repeating and they all had <34 AA's all season so I'm just not so sure my daughter fits in there. Oh well... I'll keep you updated. Maybe we need to try some other gyms, too.

The best way to advocate, is to not let emotion guide your decision. Talk to them after the recommendation. You don't have to agree or disagree, but take what you heard and think about it for a few days. I can't imagine, they will want an instant decision. We usually get a few weeks after recommendations before contracts are do.

 

[gymgal]

If they put her in 3, it doesn't hurt to ask if they can continue to monitor her and move her up if she gets all her skills in the next couple of months. If this is a gym that uptrains year round then she will be working the 4 skills in 3 and if she catches on that quickly, she shouldn't have a problem. I can understand their position. But at the same time, your situation is a bit unique in that she had a great season but she had no uptraining. It calls for a little bit of leeway.

 

[Natasha]

At our gym, new gymnasts coming from another gym this time of year are placed in which ever group is the closest match for whatever skills the gymnast is currently working on. They won't place in the "level" groups until fall.

 

[tumblingmama]

At our gym, new gymnasts coming from another gym this time of year are placed in which ever group is the closest match for whatever skills the gymnast is currently working on. They won't place in the "level" groups until fall.

That is how our old gym was. They made their decisions in the summer. But this gym has already made their decisions and the girls are broken up accordingly.

 

[BlairBob]

Generally, no kip, no L5. Many gyms don't like kids scratching 1 event or bars. If this is a very competitive gym, they'll be following that policy. If not, they might allow her to skate on by.

 

[iwannacoach]

I just wanted to be prepared, it's not that I'm worried. I'm just not the best at disagreeing with people... I tend to back down in situations like that. But I really want to advocate for my daughter, who has worked so hard and did extremely well. And like vagymmomma said, it seems sad to me for her to spend another year doing what she already does well. Her old gym does not work on any new skills at all until after states, which is when we left. They don't make decisions about placements until the summer. So she never had a chance to learn a kip because they never worked on them. But this gym seems to work on new skills throughout the year and they have already made their decisions about the next season. So I kind of feel like she is in an unfair position and then I feel guilty that we had to move . It seems like she will get her kip quickly seeing as she already picked up four new skills this week alone since she has had the opportunity to work on them. I did look up the girls she is grouped with right now who are repeating and they all had <34 AA's all season so I'm just not so sure my daughter fits in there. Oh well... I'll keep you updated. Maybe we need to try some other gyms, too.

You have to look at the entire picture with respect to the other kids. If they were treated the way I'd treat them, not saying it's the best way, they wouldn't have had great scores as L4's, but would have a set of skills "in the bag" to help them a year or two down the road. So what is your preference? A mediocre "new L4" season while she works on new skills for the future, or a really easy season at new L3 with even more time set aside to work on new skills.

Allow me the luxury of assuming the club is progressive, and has a plan to get kids where they want to be at the end of their experience.......

The focus should be the program's ability to train kids to, and through, the level of gymnastics your child dreams about. If you spend too much energy focusing on "now" your dd is going to have a more difficult future ahead of her. Maybe she want's that future, maybe not, but in any case she's ill equipped at her age to understand those nuances, so that's were you have to step in and decide what's best.... and sell her on the whole idea.

 

[Seeker]

Generally, no kip, no L5. Many gyms don't like kids scratching 1 event or bars. If this is a very competitive gym, they'll be following that policy. If not, they might allow her to skate on by.

We go to a very competitive gym and it isn't expected that girls have a skill 6+ months before competition season. When do you compete? We don't do our first meet until very late Nov/early December, so there is plenty of time to get new skills, especially with the longer summer training hours. If I were a gymnast (even a young one), I'd be quite angry if I got my kip in June or July but I had to repeat L4 because I didn't have it in May. Seems unnecessarily limiting.

 

[SignHere]

But you don't know the kip will come in June or July... Being the devil's advocate.... And the voice of reason ?

1. How old is your DD? That should figure in your decision.
2. Do they change training groups during the year?

So, assuming your DD is young ( say less than 9?) , even if they don't change training groups during the year, if they do a significant amount of up training during the year, another year competing level 3 won't be the end of the world. Then perhaps at the end of the season, she could do a level 4 meet for experience ?

 

[wallflower]

To the original poster I feel like my DD was in this exact position last year. She had competed level 5 right before we moved. She had ended her season with a 38.700 including a 9.9 on bars and she had just turned 7 years old. With the season 8 months away I thought it was reasonable that she could be ready to compete level 6. She was coming from a gym that didn't uptrain so she had zero level 6 skills. So while she was great at level 5, she was not able to place into their level 6 group. It was disappointing to see her in a group where the kids were still mastering level 5 or preparing to compete it for the first time, but it's a gym with strong level 10's so I figured they know what they are doing. I left it alone. It seemed slightly unfair because it wasn't that she wasn't capable of learning level 6 skills, it was just that she wasn't given the chance because her gym didn't work that way. Like your DD she was placed with kids who had scored 33-34's in level 5 or were new level 5's.

After a few months she was able to pick up her skills and they did move her up to level 6 and then even to level 7. She was able to prove herself. I think even if your DD is placed in a lower group, if she proves she can do the skills she will be given a chance. If it's a program that you trust, then trust them to make the right decision. If DD's gym had decided she needed to do another year of level 5, I would have been okay with it. So pick a place you trust and then sit back and let them do things their way.

 

[iwannacoach]

After a few months she was able to pick up her skills and they did move her up to level 6 and then even to level 7. She was able to prove herself.

That's exactly what I think "coaches greed" is all about. It's great that you were able to offer up such a fine example of what I was trying to explain.

 

[flippingtogether]

Mymeetscores has been criticized for being inaccurate by some people.QUOTE]

What's the story on Mymeetscores alleged inaccuracies? I was not aware of this....and have found it to be a good resource. Would be great to know where the website's shortcomings are.....thank you!

 

[wallflower]

Mymeetscores has been criticized for being inaccurate by some people.QUOTE]

What's the story on Mymeetscores alleged inaccuracies? I was not aware of this....and have found it to be a good resource. Would be great to know where the website's shortcomings are.....thank you!

I know for my DD she is listed under like 5 different names because hers is frequently misspelled at meets. One of her meets has her listed as a 0.00 on a few events when she competed those events. I think there are problems like that, but it's a pretty good site for general information. Oh and my good friend was surprised to find out her DD competed in a meet in another state when in fact she did not! Haha. Somehow the entire teams scores are listed twice: once for the actual meet they were in and then another meet 1000 miles away with those scores. So weird!