WAG Stacking teams

[munchkin3]

This made me laugh. I have kept track of the whole team's scores the past two meets.

Not because I give a rat's behind, but because it gives me something to do to keep my mind off my nerves. We have a mom who is "team photographer" for the same reason. I don't know what I would do with myself at meets if I didn't keep score.

LOL, I know how you feel....there once was a time when I made score booklets by hand, stapled and everything......to sell at our fundraiser.....
I used to go to meets with my snack, water, camera, advil, minimum of 3 pens and several sheets of paper.....The keeping of all scores was a major distraction.

But i put the pencil down in L6......sigh.

I saw some great gymnastics, and its really exciting.

plus, as tomtnt says, there is meetscores to ruin the suspense for everyone. LOL
(i confess, i doo look at this before awards, but NEVER show my DD)

 

[josie55]

Perhaps it will be helpful to look at this from a different perspective. Let’s assume that the gym in question is not having kids repeating levels, but instead has strict standards for making teams and moving up, talented kids who train a fair amount of hours, and of course strong coaches.

I’m sure it’s fun for those parents to watch their kids win team awards at meets, but there’s also a downside: When it comes to individual awards, those kids have to compete "against" these same kids (their teammates) at EVERY meet! When you feel frustrated about having to compete against them at States and maybe one other meet during the season, maybe you should look on the bright side and be glad that you don't have to experience it more often. And when you look on that podium and see those kids in places 1-5 all from the same gym, look at kid #5 and realize that she may never get above 4th place, even though she’s an excellent gymnast who works crazy hard gets pretty darn high scores.

 

[mom2newgymnast]

Perhaps it will be helpful to look at this from a different perspective. Let’s assume that the gym in question is not having kids repeating levels, but instead has strict standards for making teams and moving up, talented kids who train a fair amount of hours, and of course strong coaches.

I’m sure it’s fun for those parents to watch their kids win team awards at meets, but there’s also a downside: When it comes to individual awards, those kids have to compete "against" these same kids (their teammates) at EVERY meet! When you feel frustrated about having to compete against them at States and maybe one other meet during the season, maybe you should look on the bright side and be glad that you don't have to experience it more often. And when you look on that podium and see those kids in places 1-5 all from the same gym, look at kid #5 and realize that she may never get above 4th place, even though she’s an excellent gymnast who works crazy hard gets pretty darn high scores.

Except when your dd is still in compulsories and your team competes against these same girls at almost every meet in the season (there are a limited number of in state meets that most of the same teams go to) and your dd is the same age as half of them. Not so lucky feeling then, lol. Although my dd usually holds her own honestly. Seriously, I do know what you mean though, that would be hard.

 

[Deleted member 18037]

Perhaps it will be helpful to look at this from a different perspective. Let’s assume that the gym in question is not having kids repeating levels, but instead has strict standards for making teams and moving up, talented kids who train a fair amount of hours, and of course strong coaches.

I’m sure it’s fun for those parents to watch their kids win team awards at meets, but there’s also a downside: When it comes to individual awards, those kids have to compete "against" these same kids (their teammates) at EVERY meet! When you feel frustrated about having to compete against them at States and maybe one other meet during the season, maybe you should look on the bright side and be glad that you don't have to experience it more often. And when you look on that podium and see those kids in places 1-5 all from the same gym, look at kid #5 and realize that she may never get above 4th place, even though she’s an excellent gymnast who works crazy hard gets pretty darn high scores.

And this supposed to make the kids that came in less than 4th feel better how ?????

Really it comes down to little fish big pond. Big fish in a little pond.

Really that poor little kid in 4th could move to a place where she would be number one. Of course then the kid that used to be number one would be upset. And round and round you go.

Really we focus on skills and personal improvement. Along with balance of time for other things. As our coach says, we focus on gymnastics. And sure she/they would rather medal then not. So this works for us.

I don't begrudge anyone with talent, going crazy hours winning.................. I say mazel tov.

And if my girl seems disappointed because she went up against those kids and managed to be the one right under that 4th place finisher or squeak by one or 2 on an event or 2. I tell her any time she wants to up her hours I will move/drive to where ever. She is good with turtle mode.

And the gyms that clearly and repeatedly compete kids at a lower level to win do exist. . And it bugs from time to time ......... It would be nice to try to mitigate it. And at the end of the day we flip on.

 

[tpMom]

Beware of parents bemoaning 9.6 floor scores.

Right?! My daughter would be THRILLED with a 9.6 on floor

 

[Ali'sMom]

Right?! My daughter would be THRILLED with a 9.6 on floor

My daughter got one recently in Level 6, and you'd swear all us moms were cheering for a TEN!

 

[e'smum]

Right?! My daughter would be THRILLED with a 9.6 on floor

if mine could get more height in her tumbling, she could be a 9.3 -9.4 floor gymnast in level 6. i would be thrilled with that! lol. i think her highest this year was a 9.150. heck, i'd be happy with that again for states since that was only seen once. . bars and vault are her best events though, this year. last year vault was a struggle and she did well on floor. maybe next year she'll pick up the height on her tumbling. it's like she has a lead weight on her this year....

 

[CoachTodd]

Being in NC as well, I have personally seen these gyms that sandbag. They say it is "so the child can feel successful" The real reason is it makes the gym appear successful. Some gyms appear to have their kids progress and move a level per year. The part that no one sees, is that child was ready for level 7 before she started level 4. I've seen the 8 and 9 year old level 8's and 9's at states with almost every joint on their body wrapped. I've seen level 5's (back before the changes to the current levels) do kip, cast handstand in their routines which was technically not allowed. Different philosophies at different gyms, many of which are in place to make the gym look good and attract more customers.
I just get angry when the kid isn't actually being put first.

 

[flipster]

Whenever I saw sandbagging it was a matter of resources, i.e. no room on optional team or no experience to train higher levels. Sometimes they cannot accomidate all talent. I am not saying it is right. I noticed those dominating gyms have very large teams(the ones I can think of) and limited optionals staff.

 

[raenndrops]

what are you going to say/do when you get to level 10 and the girls are still scoring 38s/39s? are they sandbagging for repeating level 10? force them to go elite? make separate division for girls who repeat level 10s?

facts of life, unfortunately - some girls are just really really really good....

I have been following a gymnast on YouTube since she was little. She was level 10 in 5th grade. She has struggled through injuries for the past few years, but this year, as an 8th grader, she decided to compete a partial season. At her state meet, she earned a 38.55 AA. Shestill has 5 years left.

 

[Deleted member 18037]

I have been following a gymnast on YouTube since she was little. She was level 10 in 5th grade. She has struggled through injuries for the past few years, but this year, as an 8th grader, she decided to compete a partial season. At her state meet, she earned a 38.55 AA. Shestill has 5 years left.

Makes you wonder.......... If she had gone a little slower might she have had less injuries and gotten to the same place.............. or even injury free but a year later

 

[Deleted member 14190]

Being in NC as well, I have personally seen these gyms that sandbag. They say it is "so the child can feel successful" The real reason is it makes the gym appear successful. Some gyms appear to have their kids progress and move a level per year. The part that no one sees, is that child was ready for level 7 before she started level 4. I've seen the 8 and 9 year old level 8's and 9's at states with almost every joint on their body wrapped. I've seen level 5's (back before the changes to the current levels) do kip, cast handstand in their routines which was technically not allowed. Different philosophies at different gyms, many of which are in place to make the gym look good and attract more customers.
I just get angry when the kid isn't actually being put first.

it's a hard sport. yes you can always move kids up, however they could very likely end up injured doing so (as also stated in the above post). What if that was your kid? "Yea, my kid was forced into level 8 because she was so good in 7, but she ended up injured, and now has fear issues and won't do her BHS BHS, dismount on bars or RO entry vaults". It's impossible to judge another athlete folks... we just don't know the ins and outs.
Just this year an Elite moved back down to JO for her senior year. She won Level 10 state this weekend. Was this fair to the other kids? YES !!! This kid busted her butt for her whole life, she sacrificed everything in the Elite world. She was DONE with elite.... My hat is off to her coaches who enabled her to do this. So when people say "it's about the kids", don't forget that these successful athletes are kids as well.

 

[CanGymCoach]

I don't have a problem with mandatory move up scores, but I do have a kid killing it in level 3 (there are no placements in level 3 here, they just get ribbons and scores, but she is getting 9.5 on every event at every meet), she trains with a group of level 4/5s but cannot for the life of her get her kip. And we won't let kids compete without requirements/ won't let them scratch an event. She can already do all the skills for level 5 on beam, floor and vault. But its that damn kip.

 

[mobeans]

Hmmm. If I am right about the gym, I'm pretty sure the child to which you are referring began the season as a L4. I don't think she can move up any faster than she already is. Also, I'd take with a grain of salt what parents say about what levels their kids are "uptraining." Some of our L7 girls can do an individual pass that would work for L10 because they are really good at front tumbling.

I agree with the bolded statement. You also never know why a kid is "only" at such and such level. Were they competent in their gym's eyes to be successful at the next level? Every gym has different requirements and with that what would be a level or two higher at one gym would not be the case at another. Also, could an injury have held them back? Or a fear issue? We have several kids who could do very well at the next level on three events but due to an issue on one event it would be disastrous for them.

Meet scores do not tell the whole story.

 

[Deleted member 18037]

Those of talking about sandbagging are not talking about individual gymnasts and circumstances. I think we all get that there are many things and reasons for where a kid competes.

Really we all get it.

And it is also very very clear that there are gyms that clearly stack the deck with kids who should be competing up. Especially in the compulsory levels.

That there are gymnasts who have very valid reasons for competing where they do doesn't mean there aren't gyms that sandbag. These things are not mutually exclusive.

What boggles my mind are how many folks around here simply don't wish to acknowledge it happens.

 

[Aero]

Just this year an Elite moved back down to JO for her senior year. She won Level 10 state this weekend. Was this fair to the other kids? YES !!! This kid busted her butt for her whole life, she sacrificed everything in the Elite world. She was DONE with elite.... My hat is off to her coaches who enabled her to do this. So when people say "it's about the kids", don't forget that these successful athletes are kids as well.

Are you referring to Colby Flori of Texas Dreams?

 

[AmandaLynn]

And it is also very very clear that there are gyms that clearly stack the deck with kids who should be competing up. Especially in the compulsory levels.

However, this thread was started about an optional State meet. Not compulsory.

 

[amiandjim]

Are you referring to Colby Flori of Texas Dreams?

Could also be Nia Dennis?

 

[Deleted member 14190]

Are you referring to Colby Flori of Texas Dreams?

Navarro , region 1

 

[bookworm]

So my question is - is there a scoring difference between your state and mine or is the talent that much better. At our Optionals States this past weekend there were 11 38s and no 39s out of just shy of 1100 gymnasts. And, my understanding is that Ohio has some pretty good gymnasts. Is our talent pool that mich shallower or is there a difference in the scoring from state to state being shown here?

I think there are differences because we are in one of the "weaker" regions and my daughter always made it to JOs, never with a 39, twice with a 38, and a few 37s, and she always held her own and did well at JOs with all regions, placing top 10 in events and the AA.....