2010 TOPs results

[gymcoach34]

The gyms get paid 200.00 to host the testing...but that is supposed to cover the costs of having to pay staff to be there, ac, wear & tear on equipment, etc.

 

[Tumblequeensmom]

Gymcoach... we left that gym about a year ago. If the parents tried to "talk" to other parents in the lobby (and I DO mean just to socialize!) one of the owners would come running over and just "hang out." She repeatedly spoke about "not liking it when parents talk!" Most of the "TOPs" parents were newbies... had no idea that how the program was supposed to run or what is was intended to accomplish. The owners EVEN TOLD THEM that if they participated in this program (and paid the extra $$), then it was a possibility that their DD's would eventually go to the Olympics! Can you believe it??? I know, it sounds like I am making this stuff up... I am not.

 

[bookworm]

Gymcoach... we left that gym about a year ago. If the parents tried to "talk" to other parents in the lobby (and I DO mean just to socialize!) one of the owners would come running over and just "hang out." She repeatedly spoke about "not liking it when parents talk!" Most of the "TOPs" parents were newbies... had no idea that how the program was supposed to run or what is was intended to accomplish. The owners EVEN TOLD THEM that if they participated in this program (and paid the extra $$), then it was a possibility that their DD's would eventually go to the Olympics! Can you believe it??? I know, it sounds like I am making this stuff up... I am not.

This is an example of the message and the way it is conveyed that I am concerned about...

 

[Tumblequeensmom]

I don't mean to be offensive in my post. I am just quoting exactly what we, as parents, were told.

 

[bookworm]

I don't mean to be offensive in my post. I am just quoting exactly what we, as parents, were told.

I didn't find your post offensive at all; I just quoted what you were told as an example of how parents can be misled on the TOPS program.

 

[Tumblequeensmom]

Oh I'm sorry, I misinterpreted your response! I agree w/you 100%!!!

 

[dancengym]

Gyms may have their own agenda . . . or not?

It is interesting to read all the posts on the TOPS testing process or program. Here is my two cents: I think maybe some gyms don't intentionally mislead its gymnasts and parents about the TOPS training. Having looked around at different gyms because we are unhappy with our current gym, I've found that many gyms sponsor or encourage some kind of TOPS training. But they do not necessarily send their kids to the TOPS testing iteself. I think they just feel utilizing the TOPS skills and abilities training method benefits their gymnasts (can't argue with that). And as such, provide the training to for their gymnasts to improve their routines. I think the parents should confront their coaches and find out what their true goals are. Is it just for strenght training or do they actually want their gymnasts to participate in the TOPS camp.

Our gym is a little different in that they jus started training the girls they picked out about a month or two before testing. Fortunately, my daughter qualified for national testing. But now we only have one month for the national testing and they have not even started training her for the gymnastics part of the testing. In addition, they have ceased to have her practice the skills part of the test. It is frustrating and I worry if they are just setting her up for disappointment. I wonder if it is even worth the trouble to worry about trying to get her qualified to participate in the camp.

 

[gymnut1]

Our gym is a little different in that they jus started training the girls they picked out about a month or two before testing. Fortunately, my daughter qualified for national testing. But now we only have one month for the national testing and they have not even started training her for the gymnastics part of the testing. In addition, they have ceased to have her practice the skills part of the test. It is frustrating and I worry if they are just setting her up for disappointment. I wonder if it is even worth the trouble to worry about trying to get her qualified to participate in the camp.

I have heard this before being a problem. Training concentrates on the conditioning tests and then those girls who do make it to national testing suddenly only have weeks to prepare for the gymnastics skills needed. Often they don't even have some of the moves. I think it is more a problem when girls still at the compulsory level are going for TOPs. That is a lot of uptraining of skills. If they have those skills already they would most likely be optional gymnasts even at aged 8 and 9.

But I agree the TOPs training is beneficial to improving strength and flexibility and therefore should improve basics so even if girls have no intention of testing locally or even have a chance of making it to national testing. I think it can be worthwhile. I would want my dd to do it if we had it in the UK.

 

[bookworm]

My daughter was a Level 9 (as a 10 yr old) the first year she qualified to the TOPS team and a Level 10 (11 yr old) the second year she qualified to the TOPS team and had made it to JO Nationals so I agree that it is VERY difficult for a truly compulsory level gymnast to get the skills they will need to make a camp after the results come out.

I had a friend whose daughter maxed out on all of the skills in the testings but was only training level 5 ( with no uptraining) and she qualified for National Testing but did not go because when told the skills she would need, it didn't seem feasible. The physical abilities is a fraction of the overall score at National Testing ( and it makes up more of the composite the younger they are) but they still have to have those upper level skills to make a team unforunately...

 

[dancengym]

Still hopeful

Thanks to the last two posts. Unfortunately, my daughter falls in the category of being a compulsory level gymnast (she just finished level 5 and is training for level 6 this year) who qualified for national testing. Her coach thinks the gymnastics part is the "easy" part for my daughter. I don't know. The coach also has every intention of getting her to national testing. I guess she started too late (at six and a half). She did level half a year, level 5 one year and now level six. Her coaches seem to believe that between level 4 and 5something clicked. I guess at this stage, we'll just have to wait and see. It is distressing to hear that most of those that make it to the TOPS camp are 2 to 3 levels above my daughter and already have the skills. Does anybody know if current Level 5/6 gymnast ever make it to the TOPS camp? My daughter has not even started competing Level 6. :-( Is it unwise for the coaches to put her through this?

 

[bookworm]

Dancengym- some compulsory kids do make a TOPS team but they have generally been uptrained on the skills they will need for testing... things likes giants on bars, fulls on the floor, yurchenko timers (at least) for vault, BHS/BHS on beam...this was a few years ago so the requirements might have changed but you get the gist.

I don't think that the skills part of it is easy at all, especially if it is something new to be learned in the next month or so. That said, if she doesn't have the skills but maxes out on the physical abilities (and THAT is almost a given for any kid to make a camp) , she probably will not make a camp but you never know...the experience on the Ranch is fun and she can see what's needed for the next time she tries. I would still let her go if you have the money to do so.

The distribution of the weight of the physical abilities versus the skills makes it almost impossible without the skills. I remember when my daughter made it the ratio was something like 20% of her score was for physical abilities but the other 80% was for skills...so even if you max the skills there is still a big hole to overcome.

 

[gymnut1]

Excellent post bookworm. I totally agree with every thing you said.

Dancengym do you know the skills she will have to do? They are quite a way above level 5.

 

[dancengym]

Bookworm and gymnust1-I went over the TOPS skills required for the national testing with my daughter. Looks like she has been "introduced" to some skills, can actually some skills and have never heard of some skills. She learned the beam and floor "dance" routine a week ago. Did her first giant two weeks ago. She says she can do all the beam skills routine. The yurchenko timer is something she has never done and a toe circles on bars. We are not allowed to watch practice. So, only have what my daughter tells me. I've seen her do "giants" but she needs a little tap once in a while.

As far as getting information from her coach, as I indicated on a previous post, her coach believes or is convinced, the skills part of the TOPS testing will be easier for my daughter than the abilities part. They don't do a lot of strenght training per se at their gym. In fact, they started training my daughter and four other girls a few weeks after Level 5 states. They tested for the first time two months later (mid July) and a second one two weeks later (July 31st). I guess only time will tell. I think I'll let her go to national testing since as you've indicated the experience alone should be fun. Also, are parents allowed to go at the national testing? If not, how do you guys feel about sending your 9 year old alone with her coach. Unfortunately, my daughter was the only one who qualified. And as such, will be the only one travelling from their gym with her coach. Any thoughts, suggestions? Thanks.

 

[bookworm]

As far as going to National Testing, you ( the parent) can go onto the Ranch but not watch the actual testing. The gymnasts can stay at the Ranch if they are accompaniede by a female coach or designated chaperone. When my daughter made it , she had a male coach so i went and stayed in a Houston suburb and ferried her to the Ranch every day...when she made the TOPS team and went to the camps, she went alone with the coach and did fine. I guess it depends on how comfortable you are letting her go with the coach.

 

[gymnut1]

I think you are right it will be a great experience for her and she will enjoy it. It sounds like she has enough of the skills to have a go without feeling silly and she has another month to make good.

She absolutely must have that vault timer as it is worth most of the marks on vault. She doesn't have to do 2 toe circles on bars she can do 2 clear hips instead. She needs 3 giants into flyaway on bars. It is great that she has her giant already.
The beam acro is not too difficult and you say she has that and is learning the beam and floor dance so that is good news.
Does she have the floor skills? I think the handspring, handspring front tuck is quite hard for a nine year old. Standing front tuck is tricky too.
Good Luck it sounds like she is well on her way! She has done very very well even to qualify for national testing.

 

[dancengym]

Thank you so much gymnut2 and bookworm for all your insight and for sharing your experiences. One last question, how much should I expect to spend to send my girl to national testing?

 

[bookworm]

flights to Houston are never cheap so if you are planning for you, your daughter and a coach, figure at least $300 each (X 3 = 900) ; hotels for 3 nights for you and your daughter and the coach (2 rooms at 100 per nite X 3 nites = 600); car rental (roughly 200) ; food (around 150 ) ...it was always around 1500-2000 bucks per trip to Houston....

 

[gymcoach34]

I agree with bookworm- its a very expensive trip & it matters what you plan to get out of it. You can always show a progression of a skill at testing- or be spotted, but the score will reflect it. For example, If you show 1/2 of the floor skills and they are done perfectly-the score will be a 5.0. My athletes have been working on the handstand pirouetting line all year and my 9 year olds still have trouble with it, especially the back extension to the blind change section. Kids that score in the high 8's and in the 9.0 range make the b camp, you must have all 9.2-9.3's and up (hard to get) to get into the A camp.

I would sit down with the coach and have her go through the skills list and find out what skills she can do alone right now. In my opinion, the skills should have been uptrained for the last 1-2 years and the next 4- 5 weeks will be about polishing and putting the finishing touches on the skills-not really learning them. I think the gym owes you that before you shell out all that $-esp since you cant split the coaches expenses with anyone. I would also be sure the coach (if its a female) is willing to stay w your daughter in the cabin or hotel. If not, or its a male, you must attend.

I personally would not take an athlete that does not have 80% of the skills that are done well, just bc of the expense and putting the kid through going to something they were not ready for. I agree the ranch is a fun experience, but not if you are going to struggle. You have quite a decision on your hands!

PS- The yurchenko timer takes alot of time and you do not want her to learn it poorly or be unsafe. I would definitely ask the coach if they have been working this and what the progress was-they must do it minimally up to a resi mat and one 8 incher....thats pretty tall for some 9 year olds!!

I dont want to sound negative, but if its your gym's first time, I think its important to know what to expect.

 

[gymcoach34]

Hi dancengym-Not implying your daughter will struggle, she is obviously talented if she qualified after only afew months training! Im just talking in general about the kids I see who attend & do not have the skills.

 

[bookworm]

I agree with bookworm- its a very expensive trip & it matters what you plan to get out of it. You can always show a progression of a skill at testing- or be spotted, but the score will reflect it. For example, If you show 1/2 of the floor skills and they are done perfectly-the score will be a 5.0. My athletes have been working on the handstand pirouetting line all year and my 9 year olds still have trouble with it, especially the back extension to the blind change section. Kids that score in the high 8's and in the 9.0 range make the b camp, you must have all 9.2-9.3's and up (hard to get) to get into the A camp.

I would sit down with the coach and have her go through the skills list and find out what skills she can do alone right now. In my opinion, the skills should have been uptrained for the last 1-2 years and the next 4- 5 weeks will be about polishing and putting the finishing touches on the skills-not really learning them. I think the gym owes you that before you shell out all that $-esp since you cant split the coaches expenses with anyone. I would also be sure the coach (if its a female) is willing to stay w your daughter in the cabin or hotel. If not, or its a male, you must attend.

I personally would not take an athlete that does not have 80% of the skills that are done well, just bc of the expense and putting the kid through going to something they were not ready for. I agree the ranch is a fun experience, but not if you are going to struggle. You have quite a decision on your hands!

PS- The yurchenko timer takes alot of time and you do not want her to learn it poorly or be unsafe. I would definitely ask the coach if they have been working this and what the progress was-they must do it minimally up to a resi mat and one 8 incher....thats pretty tall for some 9 year olds!!

I dont want to sound negative, but if its your gym's first time, I think its important to know what to expect.

Hi dancengym-Not implying your daughter will struggle, she is obviously talented if she qualified after only afew months training! Im just talking in general about the kids I see who attend & do not have the skills.

I totally agree with all that Gymcoach has said...even though the gym she qualified at doesn't think the skills are a big deal to get, as you can see from a different coach's perspective, the skills are a big deal...and as Gymcoach says , you don't want her to to be trained poorly ...it's a lot to think about before you open your wallet.