Parents Advice, gym fit, level 4

[NutterButter]

Something that has not been addressed but could be relevant....you mention your DD is an older starter? Sounds like she briefly did rec then started team. Was there pre-team at her gym or did she simply start and compete L3 less than a year later? If the answers to these questions is yes, this here could be the reason why you are seeing what you consider a 'decline' in potential. Most of the gyms in my area will spend 1-2 years in pre-team before competing (and starting with L4). The time is pre-team is spent on foundational skills and shaping that will lead to safer and easier progression across levels. How much uptraining did she do in L3? You mention it was a reason for changing gyms so perhaps she didn't receive much? Could she do a kip when she started at her new gym? How long was she at the new gym before the L4 season started? It's entirely possible that she simply hasn't had enough time to perfect skills to 36+ just yet. And this in no way means that the potential is not there, just that she needs more time with the jump to L4.

 

[34gymcoach]

It sounds as if you have made your decision already. You say you have an idea of what you are looking for- # of routines, amount of time upgrading, etc. Is your background in gymnastics as an experienced coach? If you have that little faith in a successful program, then it is time to move on or open your own program. There is some good advice from experienced gym parents on here. Best of luck!

 

[HannahBanana]

It sounds as if you have made your decision already. You say you have an idea of what you are looking for- # of routines, amount of time upgrading, etc. Is your background in gymnastics as an experienced coach? If you have that little faith in a successful program, then it is time to move on or open your own program. There is some good advice from experienced gym parents on here. Best of luck!

I never said anything on this: “# of routines, amount of time upgrading, etc.” and no I am not “an experienced coach” lol - if you read the post that much would be clear and I wouldn’t be posting here asking for insight. But I’m fairly certain that was meant more as a dig at me than anything.

True, I have lost faith in our program and have found helpful responses from many here. A gym being “a successful program” does not mean it is successful for everyone, per my original post and whether this is a good fit (see title, “good fit”). Since you speculated on my background I’ll speculate on yours - are u a gym owner or coach feeling raw about parents questioning best place for their kids, even tho that is our own job to be doing? Best of luck to you.

 

[HannahBanana]

Something that has not been addressed but could be relevant....you mention your DD is an older starter? Sounds like she briefly did rec then started team. Was there pre-team at her gym or did she simply start and compete L3 less than a year later? If the answers to these questions is yes, this here could be the reason why you are seeing what you consider a 'decline' in potential. Most of the gyms in my area will spend 1-2 years in pre-team before competing (and starting with L4). The time is pre-team is spent on foundational skills and shaping that will lead to safer and easier progression across levels. How much uptraining did she do in L3? You mention it was a reason for changing gyms so perhaps she didn't receive much? Could she do a kip when she started at her new gym? How long was she at the new gym before the L4 season started? It's entirely possible that she simply hasn't had enough time to perfect skills to 36+ just yet. And this in no way means that the potential is not there, just that she needs more time with the jump to L4.

This is very on point, thank you. Yes, she did like two months of rec then straight to team. No pre team. This makes a lot of sense about the long term work needed on fundamentals and which is not always apparent to a new parent (or any parent!). Not much uptraining at all L3, hardly any. Yes early kip.

 

[HannahBanana]

Again, I am not sure you are listening to what several of us have tried to impart. I certainly understand the desire to understand and be able to directly correlate a cause and effect. But what we are all saying is that looking at data of outcomes at L3 and 4 has no validity in this analysis. Those scores are in no way a predictor or explanatory variable regarding coaching or gymnast progress at this level. Trying to use them to justify your hypothesis is a faulty analysis. It is not until upper level optionals, like L8 or above, that I would start to even consider looking at scores as an explanatory variable for progression and performance. It is not unusual for a gymnast to have a dip in results at this and other levels. That is really the normal process. At this stage the best explanatory variable would be coaching experience and past coaching results. And of course if your DD is in a safe and positive environment.

Or another way, if you are an investor, you do not make significant moves at the first blip of a market drop. You might take notice, you might start watching things closer, but you wait for a trend line to develop. Trying to time the market and make changes to your portfolio based on one change just introduces more volatility and risk to your portfolio. Consistent and steady reduces risk and maximizes potential returns. And yes I did make are children a stock LOL.

So take a step back, be the cheerleader mom, help her through struggles and be patient. The time to be more pro-active will come later if you need to.

Great analogies, thank u

 

[NutterButter]

This is very on point, thank you. Yes, she did like two months of rec then straight to team. No pre team. This makes a lot of sense about the long term work needed on fundamentals and which is not always apparent to a new parent (or any parent!). Not much uptraining at all L3, hardly any. Yes early kip.

My kiddo had a similar trajectory with being a late start and no preteam. She started Xcel Silver (kinda like L4-lite) with very little time in rec. The following season she moved to L4. I just looked at her scores on mymeetscores and her highest Silver scores were 37s. But in L4 she never broke 35. She didn't even get above a 36 until L7. It sounds like your kid may just need more time in L4.

 

[User5309]

Some gyms say this to keep a kid in their program, it’s actually said a lot. I’m not trying to be rude, but I’ve been in the sport a very long time. I’ve seen many a talented compulsory gymnast flame out by level 7. I’ve seen gymnasts who didn’t even qualify to state meets in lower levels 2 years in a row become amazing optional gymnasts. I’ve seen talent that would blow you away just up and quit. I’ve seen gymnasts earn full rides on D1 college teams suddenly retire from the sport.

You cannot base future outcomes on compulsory performance. Level 3 is relatively easy compared to level 4 and 5. This often is a problem with kids used to being at the top of the list in level 3 suddenly struggling in level 4. Your child at 8 years old doesn’t need the stress from the pressure to be the same as she was last season. She can feel it even if you’ve avoided voicing it to her. But I have a feeling, because I’ve been in the sport a long time, that you have spoken it in front of her or to her. You have to understand that each level is different, and each kid is different and progresses and regresses at their own pace. (Yes, they do regress, even with the best coaching and environment).

Don't base your expectations on level 3, because its just doesn't matter when it comes to future ability and success. If she's happy there, give it another year, yes, even if she has to repeat level 4. But seriously, you do not want your daughter to go to level 6 if she's struggling to get a 36 AA in level 4. Trust the process, because there are factors that you don't understand about the sport. (I thought I understood it pretty good after 11 years of my kids competing, but when I started studying for my first judging test, I realized that I knew nothing.) Take a deep breath and enjoy watching her, because even the worst kid in the gym is better than the average kid on the street. Enjoy this time with her at this young age. You can worry later when she's a little older and has time to figure out what she wants from the sport and where she's going.

Hard disagree with the struggling to get a 36. Lack of minor corrections in compulsory will crush a score. My daughter had a 36 and a 36.1 in level 4. In level 6 she’s mid to high 37 and beats most of the 37-38 l4 scorers from last year.

I was worried because of scores skipping. OP Use the eye test.

Bars never got a 9 in l4 but could tell kipping and connecting cast was easy. 9.4 is lowest in l6 with a giant.

Beam was best for her in l4 but never over low 9s. Again handstands and jumps were good.

Vault. Barely got 9s. Some gyms that score high in compulsory train a high scoring front hand spring vault that does not translate to anything. For my kid she just blocks significantly better with a yurchenko entry

Floor. Idk she was low 9s in 3 and 4 with this but always seemed to have no issues with the tumbling.

 

[Chamomile]

It seems like you’ve got a lot of great advice and maybe I am repeating some but multiple perspectives can help.

No one can tell you if you made a mistake because there are too many factors. It’s hard because not every gym is right for every gymnast. You may be feeling that right now.

In my experience the kids that burnout the fastest or quiet quit the sport have the parents the worry the most about scoring and placement. It’s hard not to right? I want my kid to be happy and feel confident in her progress. Unfortunately it just doesn’t always translate.

The question I’ve had to ask is why? Is it her skill, focus or commitment? Is it lack of coaching? Is it something else? Realistically at different points we have encountered all 3. Honestly it could be as silly as bedtime is 7:30 and your gymnast is competing until 9. At 8 she could have grown and be readjusting to her new size.

In the lower levels everything feels like a big deal and a rush. There is a lot of misguided advice and comparisons. Like one person conveyed before you’d be surprised who stays in the sport and who quits. My dd is a much better optional than she was a compulsory, I’m sure people thought she wouldn’t make it to optionals.

I would tread lightly with gym changes. I have noticed that gym change usually(not always) impacts scores (progress) negatively. If you do it too much it becomes a downward cycle.

From what I have read from your responses I’d stay another year and see what happens. Take it as an opportunity to encourage you DD on improving on soft skills she has control over. (Grit, perseverance, respect, discipline). My caveat to this is I would change gyms if the coaches are abusive or ignoring her. As you navigate the next year I’d really assess what drives her and what her goals are. If at that time you choose to change gyms you have a solid base of what you are looking for.

This is a tough sport and a long journey. I will add that less than stellar seasons are not always a bad thing. My DD less than stellar compulsory years taught her hard work and resilience. I hope she carries those traits through life.