Parents Question About Private Lessons

[profmom]

Some of the skills a child needs for team are gymnastics skills, like handstands and roundoffs and back hip circles. Some of them, however, are skills like listening, focusing, watching the corrections that other kids are getting while they are taking their turns, and absorbing and applying your own corrections. To be on team, a child needs to be able to develop those skills and use them in the team environment. Gyms don't train team gymnasts through individual tutorials; they do it through team workouts. I would be very hesitant to set up a situation in which your daughter comes to count on private lessons to learn skills. What she needs is experience in operating in a team-like environment, which will be key to her success on team.

I've seen some young children with very good gymnastics skill sets who weren't ready for team yet because they didn't have those other skills. We held back DS a year and didn't have him start pre-team until age six because he wasn't ready -- not skillwise, but socially.

I would advise talking to the coaches about pre-team, but if she's not ready, give it a little time until she can learn effectively in a group coaching environment and then go for it! Save the privates for when she needs to improve her form on her giants or when she just needs more time with the equipment to work through some fear issues as a L6. It sounds like she has the enthusiasm and drive, and if she's doing a lot of classes, she is likely building the gymnastics skills as well. Encourage her to build the focusing skills and patience she will need to be successful in a group training situation -- which is probably best done in a group situation. Trust us; she is not behind at all.

 

[LJL07]

I've seen some young children with very good gymnastics skill sets who weren't ready for team yet because they didn't have those other skills. We held back DS a year and didn't have him start pre-team until age six because he wasn't ready -- not skillwise, but socially.

My DD just turned 7 and has ADHD. Even though skill wise she was in great shape, her old gym wouldn't put her on team until she was 6 bc of the ADHD (she was unmedicated at the time). Team was longer hours and required much more focus.

I agree that rather than privates talking to the coach would be most helpful. She is definitely definitely not too old. They key is letting them know your interest so she doesn't get lost in the shuffle if they move her to the larger developmental rec class with older kids.

By the way, I started a thread about being on team with ADHD and got tons of awesome responses. You might find it helpful. It wasn't that long ago so should be easy to find in parenting forum.

 

[IreneKa]

Well, when she started in the preschool group at 4 1/2 she was with a bunch of 3 year olds. And I'm constantly reading about 4 year olds already in a pre-team group so it makes me feel like she started late.

She did not start late, BUT some gyms are like that - handpicking their gymnasts for pre-team at a very young age. In a gym like this it is easy to get overlooked and be left behind, and then a year later they'll tell you she is too old. Our old gym was like this.
So, I think your concerns are valid, but I don't think privates is the answer here. I would talk to the coaches, make sure they know that she is interested in joining the team, ask what needs to be done to get her there. But, if by the mid summer she is still not invited to the pre-team, I would take her for evaluation somewhere else.

 

[LJL07]

http://www.chalkbucket.com/forums/threads/advice-for-adhd-child-on-team-maybe-too-immature.44842/

See above. Medication and therapy are the MOST successful approach to treating ADHD. I'm not sure what your pedi neurologist means.

 

[Midwestmommy]

I agree with the other poster. If they keep overlooking her for preteam, and she really wants to compete, don't wait too long before you check with another gym.

 

[3rd_time_around]

Well, when she started in the preschool group at 4 1/2 she was with a bunch of 3 year olds. And I'm constantly reading about 4 year olds already in a pre-team group so it makes me feel like she started late.

As a seasoned mom of 1 level 10 that started at age 6, made team at age 8, has been level 10 for 3 years and has suffered many serious injuries; another dd that started team at age 9, tried Gym Stars, Level 4, Prep OP, Level 5 and now is a cheerleader; and a just-turned-4-yr-old that has been invited to preschool pre-team: You need to relax!!! Please! your daughter is right on track. I've seen many ADHD girls make the team and do great without private lessons. Our owner's philosophy is that you don't need private lessons if you are working during practice (they allow privates, but don't believe they are necessary to succeed). You don't want to push your daughter at this age. Let her progress naturally, and she will be fine. She's not too old, she's the perfect age. Carly Patterson didn't even begin taking gymnastics until she was 6 years old.

Just a side note, as I read through this thread, your responses seem to be always defending doing the private lessons. It seems you have made up your mind and are looking for validation, and sort of arguing with the posts that say she doesn't need them. But, read the advice carefully and take it to heart. Most of us at Chalk Bucket have lots of experience in the gym world, and have seen and experienced a lot, and we really do have some great advice.

 

[3rd_time_around]

Some of the skills a child needs for team are gymnastics skills, like handstands and roundoffs and back hip circles. Some of them, however, are skills like listening, focusing, watching the corrections that other kids are getting while they are taking their turns, and absorbing and applying your own corrections. To be on team, a child needs to be able to develop those skills and use them in the team environment. Gyms don't train team gymnasts through individual tutorials; they do it through team workouts. I would be very hesitant to set up a situation in which your daughter comes to count on private lessons to learn skills. What she needs is experience in operating in a team-like environment, which will be key to her success on team.

I've seen some young children with very good gymnastics skill sets who weren't ready for team yet because they didn't have those other skills. We held back DS a year and didn't have him start pre-team until age six because he wasn't ready -- not skillwise, but socially.

I would advise talking to the coaches about pre-team, but if she's not ready, give it a little time until she can learn effectively in a group coaching environment and then go for it! Save the privates for when she needs to improve her form on her giants or when she just needs more time with the equipment to work through some fear issues as a L6. It sounds like she has the enthusiasm and drive, and if she's doing a lot of classes, she is likely building the gymnastics skills as well. Encourage her to build the focusing skills and patience she will need to be successful in a group training situation -- which is probably best done in a group situation. Trust us; she is not behind at all.

This is EXCELLENT! Exactly what I was trying to put into words.

 

[sce]

And I'm talking about the same skills. When she's by herself the handstand is kind of meh, but when the coach is giving her personal attention (not even necessarily helping, just there with her) it's so much better. Does that make any sense?

Most kids are like this. If they know the coach is watching they do it better. If she's really interested in per-team and team talk to her teacher. Express an interest and find out if it's a possibility.

 

[Azgymmiemom]

Well, when she started in the preschool group at 4 1/2 she was with a bunch of 3 year olds. And I'm constantly reading about 4 year olds already in a pre-team group so it makes me feel like she started late.

Pre team is kind of a loosely used term. Our gym would not have 4 year olds on pre team because we do not compete the lower compulsory levels, and a 4 year old is nowhere near old enough to compete Level 4 (you must be 7, I think?) Other gyms may start competing at Level 1, so they may have a preteam full of 4 year olds.
My dd took her first gym class at the ancient age of 6. She's currently training Level 9 & 10 skills, had a successful Level 8 season and she is 11. 500 plus level 8 gymmies qualified to regionals in Region 1, and she is actually in the youngest aged session for regionals!

 

[gracyomalley]

I agree that you really need to find out what the coaches are thinking before you make changes/investments. It varies quite a bit gym to gym, and for most gyms I would guess there are 2 roads to team - the "hot shot" preschool kiddo classes hand picked by age 4-5, and the kids who come through rec classes. Both of my kids' teams (boys are at different gym than DD) have a mix of these kids. In general, of course, those who come up through the hand picked group are younger - but we have Level 8 and up girls from both groups. Our one elite came through rec, not the preschool group - until she quit (obviously she was unique in how fast she learned things).

It is completely normal for ALL 6 year olds to not focus well when not the center of attention. I am sure that it is harder with ADHD - and OF COURSE it can effect her at gym, in order to be the correct diagnosis it is REQUIRED to effect all aspects of a kids life...not just grades. (sorry - I'm a pediatrician and deal with a lot of this....) Medication, when necessary, will also help in after school activities - so I would expect you to see some improvement at gym - but keep in mind what is developmentally normal too. The idea of therapy is controversial - but it is true that behavior management is key to ADHD (not therapy per say, but structure, diet, exercise, etc....and consistency) - not just meds.

The one thing in your post that would have me concerned is that you mentioned the 6 and up classes were huge? I don't think a good gym would ever have a ratio of more than 8-12 kids per coach, even at that age/rec level....so if you are correct that its a free for all you may want to look at other gyms on that basis alone - doesn't even sound safe!

I have always found it most helpful to simply ask the coach what they thought about these questions - politely. Letting them know what my kid wanted and that we were interested has led to good communication over the years. DD was "targeted" as a preschool hot shot at age 2....but her HC still waited until age 5 to put her in that group, and until age 7 for team (and 12 hour a week old L5). She did no more than 1-2 hours a week until almost 6 then only 4.5 hours until team. I knew all along what she thought, and she was open with what she wanted to see before DD moved up. With the boys its been similar - "this is what so and so needs to do before xyz can happen..." Sometimes it happened fast, sometimes slow....Some kids moved faster, some slower...some of her friends were on team a year earlier, some a year later - some never made it....some are ahead of her now, some 3 levels behind....each kid has their own path to follow.

Privates have been very helpful for DD when she wanted to move up quick (L5-L6) and with fear issues (don't want to add the money up for this last season but it was slightly cheaper than the sports counseling)...when she (or the boys) have just needed to work on strength and form, then time and adding classes/days if coach allowed has been the trick - and lots of patience and realizing that its up to the kid to do it!

A good gym/coach for 99.999% of kids is one that will sit with a parent and make a plan for all the kids - the rec kid doing foward rolls to the L10....ASK!

 

[Malenkaya]

I want to start by saying I am at the gym now, on my ipad so answers will be shorter, and please excuse any typos!

She did not start late, BUT some gyms are like that - handpicking their gymnasts for pre-team at a very young age. In a gym like this it is easy to get overlooked and be left behind, and then a year later they'll tell you she is too old. Our old gym was like this.
So, I think your concerns are valid, but I don't think privates is the answer here. I would talk to the coaches, make sure they know that she is interested in joining the team, ask what needs to be done to get her there. But, if by the mid summer she is still not invited to the pre-team, I would take her for evaluation somewhere else.

Because it's all so secretive, this is what I fear.

http://www.chalkbucket.com/forums/threads/advice-for-adhd-child-on-team-maybe-too-immature.44842/

See above. Medication and therapy are the MOST successful approach to treating ADHD. I'm not sure what your pedi neurologist means.

This sounds very familiar, I think I may have even posted in this thread. I will be sure to check again though.

As a seasoned mom of 1 level 10 that started at age 6, made team at age 8, has been level 10 for 3 years and has suffered many serious injuries; another dd that started team at age 9, tried Gym Stars, Level 4, Prep OP, Level 5 and now is a cheerleader; and a just-turned-4-yr-old that has been invited to preschool pre-team: You need to relax!!! Please! your daughter is right on track. I've seen many ADHD girls make the team and do great without private lessons. Our owner's philosophy is that you don't need private lessons if you are working during practice (they allow privates, but don't believe they are necessary to succeed). You don't want to push your daughter at this age. Let her progress naturally, and she will be fine. She's not too old, she's the perfect age. Carly Patterson didn't even begin taking gymnastics until she was 6 years old.

Just a side note, as I read through this thread, your responses seem to be always defending doing the private lessons. It seems you have made up your mind and are looking for validation, and sort of arguing with the posts that say she doesn't need them. But, read the advice carefully and take it to heart. Most of us at Chalk Bucket have lots of experience in the gym world, and have seen and experienced a lot, and we really do have some great advice.

I thought I had made up my mind but I still want advice. I'm obviously new to how all of this works and I wouldn't have asked if I didn't want to hear from experienced parents. I see that private lessons probably won't be helpful the same way her tutoring at school is, and I'm hoping when the director calls she will have some good advice. Most important to me is that she is on their radar as someone who wants to be here long term and is serious about it.

Someone mentioned class size, and since I'm here I thought I'd look more closely. There are 8 in DD's group today. They had 3 coaches and split into 2 groups. One group has 5 kids and 2 coaches. DD is in the group of 3 with one coach. I don't like to judge skills but it does seem like DD's group of 3 are the more advanced. The other 5 I believe are newer students though, so that's probably what it is. But I like the ratio.

The 6 and over group has about 24 girls and I only see 2 coaches for them.

 

[bogwoppit]

Wow those coach gymnast ratios are awesome. Moe commonly you will see 8 gymnasts to one coach, sometimes with a young helper. I would rather have her there than pre team with 1/12 ratio.

 

[3rd_time_around]

Wow those coach gymnast ratios are awesome. Moe commonly you will see 8 gymnasts to one coach, sometimes with a young helper. I would rather have her there than pre team with 1/12 ratio.

the first group 3:8 is good, but the 2:24 for 6 yr olds is not. Our gym only allows 1:6 up to age 5, then 1:8 6 and up. If they did separate the more advanced ones, than that is a good thing, and she is probably in the best class she could be in.

 

[Malenkaya]

Wow those coach gymnast ratios are awesome. Moe commonly you will see 8 gymnasts to one coach, sometimes with a young helper. I would rather have her there than pre team with 1/12 ratio.

For the younger groups they are really good with the ratios, I noticed that early on. In the preschool class her group had no more than 8 and there were always 2 coaches. They do some warming up together and then split them into two different groups for the actual class. This is the same system they are using at the kindergarten level.

the first group 3:8 is good, but the 2:24 for 6 yr olds is not. Our gym only allows 1:6 up to age 5, then 1:8 6 and up. If they did separate the more advanced ones, than that is a good thing, and she is probably in the best class she could be in.

I can't see everything from where the parents can sit, and the 6 and up group is on the opposite side so this was my best guess. There were at least 24 girls and I saw 2 coaches. Maybe a third showed up but I can't be sure. My fear is that next month she turns 6 and gets dumped into the bigger group. Since I know they pull kids out for the team track from kindergarten I'm afraid she kind of gets lost in a big group after turning six.

 

[sce]

My fear is that next month she turns 6 and gets dumped into the bigger group. Since I know they pull kids out for the team track from kindergarten I'm afraid she kind of gets lost in a big group after turning six.

I feel I am repeating myself here. Talk to her coach now. Let her coach know she is interested in team. Ask what the process is. Mention your concern about getting lost in the rec group. Staying silent and wondering or worrying won't help anyone.

Part of why my dd is moving up tot he team is that I did speak up along the way. I felt she as getting overlooked, (long story but basically she was told she could do rep-team if she was less silly - with no definition for this. This is not concrete enough for an 8yo!) and she was given the chance for her to try-out for [re-team, which she made. I've asked along the way what the criteria for moving up was. Her coach then knew she was interested in that and communicated with her about what she was looking for form her. Form there it was dds job to do the work, which she did.

When you talk with them, you will probably find out one of three things, 1) They are already considering her for pre-team or team 2) How she can progress, or what she still needs to do to progress, to the pre-team and team 3) That they won't consider her for the team and you might then want to look elsewhere

 

[Malenkaya]

I feel I am repeating myself here. Talk to her coach now. Let her coach know she is interested in team. Ask what the process is. Mention your concern about getting lost in the rec group. Staying silent and wondering or worrying won't help anyone.

It's nearly impossible to talk to a coach before/after class. The place is a madhouse. I left a message for the director exactly a week ago and I was thinking if I didn't hear back from her tomorrow I would make a call and see who I can talk to. The receptionist/person at the front desk was of little help. A year ago the lady at the front desk was a coach, and was in charge of organizing the meets they hosted and what little I do know I got from her. She was friendly and helpful and it kind of goes beyond saying that I miss her.

 

[3LittleGymmies]

Our gym pulls girls as young as 3, but frankly - I don't feel like they always make the right decisions. Talent isn't enough and many of the parents have no idea what kind of time/financial commitment they are getting into. Most of the pre-team girls quit or switch back to rec once the parents come off of the high of "We think Suzy is talented " and realize the hours are only going to keep doubling and the rates are just going to keep going up and the commitment is year long. I am honestly kind of worn out from listening to parents complain now that the summer schedule is out. "It's way too much", "Suzy also wants to do art camp, swimming, Spanish, violin, visit her grandparents for three weeks, go on our family trip to outer space and to sleep-away camp", "there is just no way we're doing it", etc. I am exaggerating a tad, but really... I wish it was all or nothing... commited or not on the team (pre-team or otherwise). (I am not talking about taking a week off... this is incessant complaining and extended time off/no interested in the commitment). I really wish the coaches would just explain it thoroughly from the start (what they are getting into) and choose to have fewer, but more commited families/girls. It really seems like a waste of their time to do it any other way. But it's a business. Anyway, my point is... make it known that you are willing to make the commitment. It really breaks my heart to see some of the rec girls working so hard because they want a spot on pre/team when some of the pre/team kids are goofing off and/or their parents are griping about the commitment.

 

[3LittleGymmies]

Sorry for typos, on my phone

 

[LJL07]

For the younger groups they are really good with the ratios, I noticed that early on. In the preschool class her group had no more than 8 and there were always 2 coaches. They do some warming up together and then split them into two different groups for the actual class. This is the same system they are using at the kindergarten level.



I can't see everything from where the parents can sit, and the 6 and up group is on the opposite side so this was my best guess. There were at least 24 girls and I saw 2 coaches. Maybe a third showed up but I can't be sure. My fear is that next month she turns 6 and gets dumped into the bigger group. Since I know they pull kids out for the team track from kindergarten I'm afraid she kind of gets lost in a big group after turning six.

I understand what you mean. It is easy for them to get lost in the shuffle when they move up to older, large developmental group. My DD actually got left behind in the small preschool group when the kids were getting moved, and I was completely baffled. Turned out her coach deliberately left her there for the very reason that she not get lost in the big group and could try for team in the spring. Team selection is a secretive process at a lot of gyms, so you really have to ask. Could you try emailing? If they don't respond to you, go look at other gyms. I would save the privates if she is lacking specific skills to get on team as others have said.

 

[IreneKa]

Are there other gyms in the area? You don't have to commit to anything, but going somewhere else and getting your DD evaluated wouldn't hurt.