WAG Reattempting skills after a fall (elite)

[amandagymnastics]

Hi gym fans! I am wondering if anyone knows if there are hard and fast rules for when it makes sense for an elite gymnast to reattempt a skill they fell on. I vaguely remember Tim Daggett sometimes commenting on this in the past after a gymnast would fall, i.e. "this is a composition requirement, she has to reattempt otherwise...."

But I feel like I rarely see gymnast reattempting skills after a fall in competition. So I'm curious when you would have to or really benefit from doing so. For example, if they completely miss their hands on a bars release, would they lose the value of that skill if they don't reattempt?

 

[HopefulGymnast]

I don't know all the details, but it depends on a few things at least:

Partly going off the top of my head here, so you'd have to look it up to be sure:
- If they 'reach the end position' of a skill, the skill still counts even though you get 1.0 deduction for a fall. This means e.g. grasping the bar significantly before slipping off, or landing with both feet on the beam in a handspring.
- If you don't reach the end position, the skill doesn't count. In some cases this may mean you don't have a dismount, unless you get back on the apparatus (if you fell before/during the dismount.)
- Connection value and bonus are not awarded in case of a fall, even if you reach the end position.

I am unsure about the biggest one: composition requirements. I cannot find any confirmation quickly. I would think you get the composition requirement if the skill counts, meaning if you reach the end position. Even if you fall after reaching that end position.

Now, assuming I got these things right, you can look at a few examples of why gymnasts act differently in different situations.

Not worth the risk:
- If a gymnast falls after reaching end position, they loose connection value and bonus if there was any. Re-attempting the skill brings a lot of risk: even if you don't fall you can easily get a few tenths deductions on a skill, and if you fell on it it likely isn't your most secure skill. Connection value/bonus may be only up to a few tenths. Not usually enough to take the risk and deductions of repeating the skill.
- If a gymnast does NOT reach the end position, they may still be fine leaving the skill out. It may be that they didn't need that skill for any requirements, and then they just lose the value of the skill and any connection value/bonus. But losing the skill just means they then count their next highest skill that wasn't counting before, so the difference could still end up being just a few tenths. Again, sometimes not worth the risk

Worth the risk:
- However, if a gymnast doesn't reach the end position, sometimes they loose a lot of points on the skill (again, maybe combined with connection value and bonus). If they were doing an H skill, and they now have to count an A, that's 0.7 in skill value alone they're losing. May be worth a retry of the skill. (Note that the scenario of counting an A if you're also doing H skills is unlikely, but it seemed like a clear example).
- Most common reason to retry a skill is probably: not reaching the end position, and thereby missing a composition requirement. This costs 0.5, and of course you're can also no longer count the skill if you were counting it, you may miss connection value and/or bonus. So in this case, it may be worth a retry of the skill.

Why not retry even when missing a composition requirement?
Some reasons can be
- The gymnast doesn't need it. They feel they can score well enough even missing those points, and don't want to add the risk when they know the rest of their exercise was good enough.
- Or a milder version: their aim changed from 'score as high as possible' to 'just get an acceptable score in without another fall in case somebody else falls'.
- The opposite: the gymnast feels it doesn't really matter anymore, they needed to fully go for it and now they're completely out of the running. They just want to get the routine over with safely, no reason to risk another fall.
- The gymnast feels they won't be able to do it on a second try given how the first try felt. Or because they are disoriented from the fall, no longer in the right mindframe, or hurt from the fall, etc.
- It is not worth the risk of retrying, because they are not getting connection, bonus, or skill difficulty out of it and they don't deem the 0.5 enough to retry a skill that feels risky.

Now, I haven't yet competed under the code of points, I'm not a coach, and I'm not yet a jury, so take this all with a grain of salt. This is just coming from a person who likes rules, knows how some of it all works, and is good at analysing things.

PS. If anybody wants to tell me if CR are still given after a fall if you reach the final position, let me know. Else I will check during my next jury lesson if I'm healthy enough to prepare for the lesson.

Hope this helps

 

[Coach Kate]

A fun one to watch is when the guys fall on their pommel horse dismount. Many times you will see them stand there without saluting and look for a signal from their coach as to whether they need get back up and do a dismount.

 

[Pineapple_Lump]

For a competitive elite, there is usually no point in repeating a skill regardless of value as far as awards/placements/qualification goes. Requirements are only worth .5 a fall is 1.0. Most will cut losses and just carry on. Perhaps in smaller competitions where it is about experience/ personal growth they may repeat. Generally coaches/athletes try to compose routines where their 'safe' skills are covering the CR's.
You have to be code savvy too in how you order elements in case of downgrading. Off the top of my head a switch ring without sufficient head release is called a switch split, so if you had a switch split as part of your CR - you would want that before the switch ring in the routine incase it were to be downgraded.

In this case the athlete probably shouldn't have been attempting the skill in the first place, let alone repeating. Great spotting, questionable coaching.