Coaches Question for all of you coaches...

[caligymmom]

Hi all!

Question regarding coaching style and effectiveness:

DD has just had a change in coach at her gym (we were given no notice- email the day of the switch), and given a coach brand new to the gym. I wasn't there to watch the first class with new coach but was there today. Moms who were there her first day said today was the same. The girls are all hotshots moving to preteam in July. Their previous coach had them working various skills and all 4 apparatus each class(2x/wk for 1.5 hrs) and corrected them throughout. While old coach worked with girls individually, there would always be a circuit of stations for the waiting girls to work on other skills.. Ie handstands or bridge etc... New coach says she's focusing on correcting form and bad habits right now, but in 1.5 hrs today only worked on handstands and arabesque, and then had them climb the rope for the last 30 min. My dd wasn't using her feet at all, but had the rope between her bent legs, feet not touching the rope, and was only using her arms. She climbed the rope 3 times this way and wasn't corrected- it took her a while to get all the way to the top and new coach was too busy filling out "good job" certificates to notice. While 2 girls climbed, the rest goofed off and rolled around on the floor. This grp ranges in age from 5-7, my dd being a little younger turning 5 at the end of June. I am friendly with the people at the front desk and asked about the new class structure, and they had new coach come speak with me and other concerned moms at the end of class to introduce herself and discuss new class structure. She claims she is correcting bad habits, which is tedious- hence the 30 min in handstand position both on the floor and in actual handstand, so the goofing off was their earned playtime for paying attention during the correction time. She says the certificates she spent so much time filling out instead of correcting our girls, are to give them goals and reward them for reaching them, and later will set harder goals and based on all of these certificates they have received, they will believe they can achieve the harder goals. She thinks they need goof off time so they will have fun during practice. And they spent so much time on the rope because she wants to build their strength first and then when she starts working on skills with them, they'll get it more easily. This style is so opposite to old coach, let alone any coaching I've ever seen, I want to ask if this is a known way to run a hotshots group, or any group for that matter. Btw we were not given any info on who this new coach is or her background, and I don't think if I hadn't said something today there would have ever been a conversation about our kids and the changes and progression in their classes. Thoughts?


Thanks for reading!

 

[iwannacoach]

Let it go for 3-4 weeks to let the kids and the coach learn a bit about each other as the coach installs her "system," as there's some merit in spending enough time on a skill part to make it clear to the kids the things that make the skill happen.

 

[Aussie_coach]

I also reccomend that you give it a few weeks to allow the new coach to find her feet. Coaching in a new gym, with new equipment, other classes to fit into and new groups can take a little while to get used too. Often with a brand new gym the coach has to get her head around where the girls are at and she can appear distracted and not sure what to do with them.

once she gets her head around what she needs to achieve with the girls things may improve. If they don't its time to speak to the head coach or gym owner.

Often the kids can be the best teachers for a coach finding her feet. If she continue's to spend an entire 1 1/2 hour lesson on nothing but handstands, arabesque's and rope climbs. The kids will soon start to misbehave. Because they are bored.

on the rope the kids are not supposed to use their feet at all to climb the rope, they are only spouses to use their arms/hands. If your girls are used to using their feet and have to spend time learning not too the coach may be allowing bent legs at first while they focus on the correct way to use their arms to climb.

i would also be pretty annoyed about the goof off time and if this continues make a complaint.

 

[gymisforeveryone]

Oh wow... I started as a new coach last January. I was given one group of 8-12 year olds and one group of 12-15 year olds. Both groups are competitive. Their coach left abroad with short warning in December. So I had never ever met the girls and only spoke with their old coach few times. I can tell you that if there would have been parents watching me when we had or first sessions in January I would have run away!! I WAS lost. The girls all had long history in this sport, they had bad habits, fears, different idea of class structure, different terms for skills and drills and equipment, injuries, pains... And even the building was different. It was HARD to get to know them all AND coach them AND make sure everyone was safe and doing things they were ready to. And of course I also had to share the equipment with other groups... I'm so happy the parents didn't came and judge me during the first weeks when I was just figuring out the whole situation. The parents were supportive and welcomed me friendly.

Now I have coached these girls for 5 months and I learn something new about them every day. One day I hear that Anna has a little sister and Emma has a beam in home. Other day day learn that Sara has broke her toe during flyway a year ago. Then I hear that Laura has been bullied by Emma last year but now they are best friends. Then I hear that Maria only started gym a year ago and is now learning back handsprings on beam. Then I hear that their old coach recommended different hand position in back handsprings and disciplined them using conditioning. Get it? There is so many things THEY and their parents know but I don't. We need TIME to make this work.

So, please give her a chance! And TIME. She sounds like a normal coach to me. Don't forget there is as many different ways to coach as there is coaches. And there is MANY good ways to do it. The kids are very young. You should not be horrified if the coach didn't correct your DD's climbing technique. The climbing is all about upper body strength. It doesn't matter at this point if she didn't correct her bent legs. Sounds like the coach is focusing one of the most important thing: HANDSTAND and shapes in it.

Remember that you are a mum and she is the coach. She knows what she's doing. Trust her.

 

[caligymmom]

Thanks for the feedback guys! We all pay almost $400/mo for these 2 weekly classes, and expect our kids to be doing/learning a lot. It was definitely a little shocking to see someone new all of a sudden and have the class structure completely change. I think it IS fair to give her a few weeks to find her stride and figure out this grp of kids. I really appreciate the replies! Thx again

 

[Deleted member 14190]

Thanks for the feedback guys! We all pay almost $400/mo for these 2 weekly classes, and expect our kids to be doing/learning a lot. It was definitely a little shocking to see someone new all of a sudden and have the class structure completely change. I think it IS fair to give her a few weeks to find her stride and figure out this grp of kids. I really appreciate the replies! Thx again

==
A few months more likely, takes time to get to know kids. As far as coaching changes, get use to it, it's a part of this sport. I remember 2 years ago the parents were all up in arms because they got a brand new coach who didn't have much experience with girls. fast forward 6 months and we won level 4 at state with that coach. You have to give a coach breathing room and mentor them at the same time. Trust your program will guide the coach over time. PS. and tell the parents to stay home...

 

[iwannacoach]

coachp..... you just reminded me of how I got my start, as a temporary fill in helping an interim coach in the aftermath of a head coach vs owner "Main Event." I ended, 7 months later, taking the HC position and proceeded to set it all up in a way that made sense to me. I lost 3 of the "best" kids out of the large handful that remained after the "Main Event." Their parents expressed their regrets, assured me that they held me in high regard, but they wanted to give their dd's the best chance to "make it."

The kids that remained did very well, and the kids that left? Not so much.

 

[Natasha]

Hi all!

Question regarding coaching style and effectiveness:

DD has just had a change in coach at her gym (we were given no notice- email the day of the switch), and given a coach brand new to the gym. I wasn't there to watch the first class with new coach but was there today. Moms who were there her first day said today was the same. The girls are all hotshots moving to preteam in July. Their previous coach had them working various skills and all 4 apparatus each class(2x/wk for 1.5 hrs) and corrected them throughout. While old coach worked with girls individually, there would always be a circuit of stations for the waiting girls to work on other skills.. Ie handstands or bridge etc... New coach says she's focusing on correcting form and bad habits right now, but in 1.5 hrs today only worked on handstands and arabesque, and then had them climb the rope for the last 30 min. My dd wasn't using her feet at all, but had the rope between her bent legs, feet not touching the rope, and was only using her arms. She climbed the rope 3 times this way and wasn't corrected- it took her a while to get all the way to the top and new coach was too busy filling out "good job" certificates to notice. While 2 girls climbed, the rest goofed off and rolled around on the floor. This grp ranges in age from 5-7, my dd being a little younger turning 5 at the end of June. I am friendly with the people at the front desk and asked about the new class structure, and they had new coach come speak with me and other concerned moms at the end of class to introduce herself and discuss new class structure. She claims she is correcting bad habits, which is tedious- hence the 30 min in handstand position both on the floor and in actual handstand, so the goofing off was their earned playtime for paying attention during the correction time. She says the certificates she spent so much time filling out instead of correcting our girls, are to give them goals and reward them for reaching them, and later will set harder goals and based on all of these certificates they have received, they will believe they can achieve the harder goals. She thinks they need goof off time so they will have fun during practice. And they spent so much time on the rope because she wants to build their strength first and then when she starts working on skills with them, they'll get it more easily. This style is so opposite to old coach, let alone any coaching I've ever seen, I want to ask if this is a known way to run a hotshots group, or any group for that matter. Btw we were not given any info on who this new coach is or her background, and I don't think if I hadn't said something today there would have ever been a conversation about our kids and the changes and progression in their classes. Thoughts?


Thanks for reading!

Sounds like a very solid coaching approach and is very similar to what our gym's hotshot program does. Correcting basics is very important now as well as building strength. The first year the girls really do not work skills at all as they do positioning, conditioning and form. And yes, it can easily take more than 30 minutes to work on basic handstands. Handstand positions are extremely important. Every year after competition season our whole gym focuses on basics and our entire optional group is currently spending their floor workout once a week doing nothing but handstands. This is probably also a time for her to assess where each girl and the group at a whole is regarding strengths/weaknesses so that she can tailor practices to what they need.

 

[Deleted member 14190]

coachp..... you just reminded me of how I got my start, as a temporary fill in helping an interim coach in the aftermath of a head coach vs owner "Main Event." I ended, 7 months later, taking the HC position and proceeded to set it all up in a way that made sense to me. I lost 3 of the "best" kids out of the large handful that remained after the "Main Event." Their parents expressed their regrets, assured me that they held me in high regard, but they wanted to give their dd's the best chance to "make it."

The kids that remained did very well, and the kids that left? Not so much.

==
It's unfortunate when you have kids leave the program. I have been through it dozens of times, and have always beaten those kids with the remaining ones, and yet year after year i still have one or two leave with the same results... We have about a dozen gyms within 15 miles of us, (one has an olympian), so its a tough area.. I have recently had two parents who once left, approach me on more then one occasion,,, wanting to return... sorry.... you live and die by the choices you make for your kids, so make sure it's a choice for your kid and not you....

 

[gymdog]

Thanks for the feedback guys! We all pay almost $400/mo for these 2 weekly classes, and expect our kids to be doing/learning a lot. It was definitely a little shocking to see someone new all of a sudden and have the class structure completely change. I think it IS fair to give her a few weeks to find her stride and figure out this grp of kids. I really appreciate the replies! Thx again

WHOA, what region are you in? That's nearly three times as much as a 1.5 hr twice weekly class where I live, and I live in a generally expensive metro area.

But nothing you mentioned all in all is a red flag, so I would give it a few weeks...at least the rest of May.

 

[caligymmom]

WHOA, what region are you in? That's nearly three times as much as a 1.5 hr twice weekly class where I live, and I live in a generally expensive metro area.

But nothing you mentioned all in all is a red flag, so I would give it a few weeks...at least the rest of May.

Los Angeles... Trust me, if we were paying a 3rd of what we pay now, I wouldn't give a second thought to what they did all class!

 

[Jabba]

Stick with it. Give her a chance. I 100% agree with focusing on building strength and basics. Bad habits are hard to correct, good habits take time to create. And she's focusing on a reward/ sense of accomplishment for them when they achieve a goal. Sounds like she's going in the right direction to me. Change can be a good thing.
Sent from my SCH-I405 using ChalkBucket mobile app

 

[gymdog]

Los Angeles... Trust me, if we were paying a 3rd of what we pay now, I wouldn't give a second thought to what they did all class!

Hmm yeah, LA is one of those areas. Well, there are a couple gyms in the LA area, it might be worth looking into their programs and prices. That still seems really pricey. You might find a place for around $200 something a month for those hours, that is a better fit for what you're looking for. I think it's worth it to check out now, before you commit to team anywhere. I would still give this coach a chance for the rest of May, just keep the other programs in mind if you're still not happy.

 

[Natasha]

Is $400 a month typical for your area for 3 hours a week? That is more than what we pay for 20 hours a week. If it is $400 for pre-team, what is it for optionals?

 

[BlairBob]

I'd have to do some number crunching but I've never heard of $400/month in CA. I'm mostly from Norcal but I did do a bunch of scouting down in Socal. That's pretty insane but I'm guessing some of the big gyms might be able to command that.

Filling out stuff in class is a huge time killer though. I've done it and it just saps time even when I could do it super fast.

For the first few classes as those little girls transition it might make sense to give them some free time to adjust to a new coach.

For team kids, I would prefer they only climb the rope without legs. Even if they are 4 or fat/weak. Occasionally, I might let them do rope climbs with legs for fun or to get some extra rope volume in. If you only have a few ropes, it can take a long time for each kid to climb with legs (though you can institute a time limit or rope height). Even slightly bent legs can be permissible if it's their first time.

Ideally though I'd like to see them do more than just HS and bridge and arabesque and rope. Basic positions and shapes on bars and beam.

Ideally with a 90m class, I would do 2 events per day and 30 minutes focusing on warming up, basics, shapes, HS work/presses and stretching. So alternate FX/Ba or Bm/V. Something like that. Perhaps FX basics, Beam or Bars, trampoline work or vault work.

 

[Deleted member 14190]

come to think of it.... 400 for 3 hours a week? umm.... I think someones math is wrong, that about $30 an hour??? sounds fishy....

 

[caligymmom]

come to think of it.... 400 for 3 hours a week? umm.... I think someones math is wrong, that about $30 an hour??? sounds fishy....

We've never been anywhere else for pre-competitive gymnastics, so I have nothing to compare it to. And to be honest, as long as dd is having fun, learning, and progressing, I'm fine to pay whatever price. It's when I see not many skills being worked and the goofing off, the fact of the price becomes an issue. In any case, based on the advice from all of you we have decided to stick it out and give her a chance. I'm just so thankful for this forum because this is a tough process to navigate as a parent, especially if you were never a gymnast. It's so expensive that it's hard not to become invested in what's happening in the gym during the classes. I'm going to trust the professionals, as you have all suggested, and see what happens between now and when the girls move up. All of you have definitely put my mind at ease, so thank you!

 

[gymdog]

I dunno, even if you come to like the coach I'd look around, just to see what the financial commitment is at other gyms.

 

[Deleted member 14190]

We've never been anywhere else for pre-competitive gymnastics, so I have nothing to compare it to. And to be honest, as long as dd is having fun, learning, and progressing, I'm fine to pay whatever price. It's when I see not many skills being worked and the goofing off, the fact of the price becomes an issue. In any case, based on the advice from all of you we have decided to stick it out and give her a chance. I'm just so thankful for this forum because this is a tough process to navigate as a parent, especially if you were never a gymnast. It's so expensive that it's hard not to become invested in what's happening in the gym during the classes. I'm going to trust the professionals, as you have all suggested, and see what happens between now and when the girls move up. All of you have definitely put my mind at ease, so thank you!

==

Great, if you get unhappy you can come to my gym, I will charge $100 an hour and she will be super happy....

 

[bookworm]

Los Angeles... Trust me, if we were paying a 3rd of what we pay now, I wouldn't give a second thought to what they did all class!

So it's an issue because of what you're paying and not necessarily with how it's being coached? She's a pre teamer so I wouldn't worry too much about it unless of course, for $400 a month , this gym has made other promises to you..but she still can't compete until she's old enough.

I would definitely investigate other gyms , if just for comparative shopping, and also investigate the one you're in...what are the fees as she moves up the levels (tuition, assessments and coaches fees) , what is their track record for producing successful gymnasts (do they have a great compulsory program , great optional program, lots of elites , are girls getting college scholarships?) . We have a gym in our region that charges exorbitant fees but only concentrates on their elites, to the detriment of the rest of their JO program, but if you asked about their "success" , they would cite their elites' achievements ...so you need to look at everything that goes on in a gym...