Coaches Gymnast mum clueless lol

[Issagymnast]

My daughter is 8 years old and just entered Level 3 after winning all Level 2 meets with scores. She is a natural talent. Gymnastics picked her. My question: she is very good and is capable of doing level 4, possibly higher routines. Our gym goes year by year and level by level obviously to sweep podium in my humble observation. Coaches, do you just keep progressing level by level and hoping for upgrades or uptraining which doesnt really happen or do you find a gym that embraces the talent and trains them to see capabilities. Im new to this but wondering how to proceed. We love our gym, apart from some nasty parents lol. The coaches never approach us to talk about our gymnasts and we generally dont know anything about our kids performances until competition unless we ask to meet them. How do we know our gymnasts talents and capabilities if they are not challenged? I see 8 year old doing higher levels and amazing routines. Mine is fully capable. Do we get a private coach/new gym or do you just keep grinding year by year. I need solid advice. We are in Los Angeles. Thank you

 

[raenndrops]

How do you know she could do level 4 (and possibly higher) routines?
Does she have all of the skills? We had a girl who dominated at Level 3, struggled on bars and vault at Level 4, and retired when she wasn't ready for level 5 the next year. And this was a girl who was offered the opportunity to move up to level 4 after 3 meets in level 3 because she had the skills (just not perfected), but she turned it down because she liked winning.

 

[Issagymnast]

How do you know she could do level 4 (and possibly higher) routines?
Does she have all of the skills? We had a girl who dominated at Level 3, struggled on bars and vault at Level 4, and retired when she wasn't ready for level 5 the next year. And this was a girl who was offered the opportunity to move up to level 4 after 3 meets in level 3 because she had the skills (just not perfected), but she turned it down because she liked winning.

For example, on floor....The gym told me she can do level 4 as she has a solid round off with 2 backhand springs which she has been doing for a long time. The only thing in level 5 would be back tuck and floor landing. She can land it on Tumble Trak but not sure about on floor yet. She just turned 8 years. My question above was not answered. What are your thoughts...level by level? I'm in no rush but how does one challenge and stimulate the athlete? She is only in level 3 now in any case! I'm just curious as the line of thought used to be push them hard and do as many skills as possible, now it seems to be more about perfecting each level and very relaxed despite ones abilities. I wish there was a mid point.

 

[superNova08]

At all the gyms I've been at, both coaching and competing, the philosophy has always been slow and steady wins the race. You don't want to push too hard too fast or you will be left with injuries. How much does she train right now? What would the hours increase be if/when she moves up? I find it slightly odd that she has all Level 4 and most of Level 5 but can't compete 4. Is she lacking the social/emotional maturity to compete these levels?

 

[mezzamare]

I totally get how you feel, because I felt that way a lot when my daughter first started in gymnastics. You see your kid, you see that they have talent, you see that they have skills beyond their current competitive level, and you wonder: why are they being held back? Why aren't they advancing faster? Why aren't these coaches picking up on the things I see?

What I have learned in the interim (my daughter is now training level 9) is that not only do your coaches see what you see, they know best what she is capable of AND (most importantly) they know how to get her to her full potential. Gymnastics is a slow build sport, in which things like form, shaping, mechanics, strength, flexibility, timing and air-sense all play vital roles. And building these skills to a high level takes time... these foundational skills are front-loaded into the early compulsory years so that when the athletes hit optionals and start doing bigger skills, they can do them safely, consistently, and successfully. It's also very typical to compete below your full skill-set, since it is safer and less taxing on the athlete as whole.

You'll hear "trust your coaches" a lot on this site, and in this context, it means: they know what they're doing; even if it looks like things aren't moving or things aren't happening, your daughter is learning the finer points of this sport so that when she hits higher levels and the training wheels come off, she can fly in ways that will blow you away.

 

[Dahlialover]

It is hard to know, from the info you’ve provided, if your gym is pacing your child appropriately. Some gyms push kids too fast and some gyms go super slow because they prioritize winning at the lower levels. You want your daughter to progress at a pace where she feels challenged but not overwhelmed.

You have to do a bit of research to figure out what your gym’s pattern is. If they have a big level 10 team and they have girls getting recruited for college, then you can assume that someone around there knows what they are doing. However if they have winning level 3 and 4 teams and weak optionals program, that tells a different story. You can post anonymously on one of the big gymnastics moms Facebook groups and ask about the quality of gyms in your area including yours. If your gym has a reputation, someone will tell you.

You can certainly ask for a meeting with the coaches to discuss your daughter’s goals and their plans for her progression. They may be willing to explain their thinking to you. If you don’t feel confident in their responses, you might want to investigate your other gym options.

 

[Issagymnast]

I totally get how you feel, because I felt that way a lot when my daughter first started in gymnastics. You see your kid, you see that they have talent, you see that they have skills beyond their current competitive level, and you wonder: why are they being held back? Why aren't they advancing faster? Why aren't these coaches picking up on the things I see?

What I have learned in the interim (my daughter is now training level 9) is that not only do your coaches see what you see, they know best what she is capable of AND (most importantly) they know how to get her to her full potential. Gymnastics is a slow build sport, in which things like form, shaping, mechanics, strength, flexibility, timing and air-sense all play vital roles. And building these skills to a high level takes time... these foundational skills are front-loaded into the early compulsory years so that when the athletes hit optionals and start doing bigger skills, they can do them safely, consistently, and successfully. It's also very typical to compete below your full skill-set, since it is safer and less taxing on the athlete as whole.

You'll hear "trust your coaches" a lot on this site, and in this context, it means: they know what they're doing; even if it looks like things aren't moving or things aren't happening, your daughter is learning the finer points of this sport so that when she hits higher levels and the training wheels come off, she can fly in ways that will blow you away.

Thank you! This makes total sense and eases my mind. Great input and advice.

 

[Issagymnast]

It is hard to know, from the info you’ve provided, if your gym is pacing your child appropriately. Some gyms push kids too fast and some gyms go super slow because they prioritize winning at the lower levels. You want your daughter to progress at a pace where she feels challenged but not overwhelmed.

You have to do a bit of research to figure out what your gym’s pattern is. If they have a big level 10 team and they have girls getting recruited for college, then you can assume that someone around there knows what they are doing. However if they have winning level 3 and 4 teams and weak optionals program, that tells a different story. You can post anonymously on one of the big gymnastics moms Facebook groups and ask about the quality of gyms in your area including yours. If your gym has a reputation, someone will tell you.

You can certainly ask for a meeting with the coaches to discuss your daughter’s goals and their plans for her progression. They may be willing to explain their thinking to you. If you don’t feel confident in their responses, you might want to investigate your other gym options.

 

[Issagymnast]

It is hard to know, from the info you’ve provided, if your gym is pacing your child appropriately. Some gyms push kids too fast and some gyms go super slow because they prioritize winning at the lower levels. You want your daughter to progress at a pace where she feels challenged but not overwhelmed.

You have to do a bit of research to figure out what your gym’s pattern is. If they have a big level 10 team and they have girls getting recruited for college, then you can assume that someone around there knows what they are doing. However if they have winning level 3 and 4 teams and weak optionals program, that tells a different story. You can post anonymously on one of the big gymnastics moms Facebook groups and ask about the quality of gyms in your area including yours. If your gym has a reputation, someone will tell you.

You can certainly ask for a meeting with the coaches to discuss your daughter’s goals and their plans for her progression. They may be willing to explain their thinking to you. If you don’t feel confident in their responses, you might want to investigate your other gym options.

The gym is only 7 years young. They want to sweep podium and establish themselves as winners. I will ask in FB groups... that is a great idea. I spoke to the coach and it was all very evasive and gave me little to no confidence. However it was the first conversation in 2 years I have had with any coach as they never want to talk to parents or communicate! They just want to coach I guess. Do you have an opinion on if and when coaches should speak to parents or is it a case of all is well until they reach out?

 

[Issagymnast]

At all the gyms I've been at, both coaching and competing, the philosophy has always been slow and steady wins the race. You don't want to push too hard too fast or you will be left with injuries. How much does she train right now? What would the hours increase be if/when she moves up? I find it slightly odd that she has all Level 4 and most of Level 5 but can't compete 4. Is she lacking the social/emotional maturity to compete these levels?

No she is very mature in all aspects. She trains 16 hours/week. They hold the kids back to sweep podium, but I guess what is the rush. At this stage she would be 15 at Level 10 if all goes well. I just wonder how they stimulate the athlete and challenge her given her natural talent. Her father was an ex professional athlete so she is gifted. I am looking to outside sources for developmental training to keep her interested and motivated and training above her level if she is keen.

 

[Issagymnast]

How do you know she could do level 4 (and possibly higher) routines?
Does she have all of the skills? We had a girl who dominated at Level 3, struggled on bars and vault at Level 4, and retired when she wasn't ready for level 5 the next year. And this was a girl who was offered the opportunity to move up to level 4 after 3 meets in level 3 because she had the skills (just not perfected), but she turned it down because she liked winning.

Yes it is early days but she is gifted. We will perfect each level before we move up. I just want to ensure this is the right progression. The coach made it clear they don't jump levels at all. Oddly another girl just did and has never competed.. possibly for NUMBERS (who knows). I'm happy to do as the coaches say as they know the team and the sport. I think as they are a new gym they are focused on team winning above all.

 

[GymDadWA]

Like @Dahlialover was asking, what does their upper level team look like? If they have a medium to large group of upper level gymnast that are being placed in colleges or the upper levels are doing very well at meets than there is nothing extra you need to do. You do not need a private coach, you do not need to schedule meetings, you don't need to ask about an accelerated program, you simply need to be an emotional support source for your child.

If the team is struggling to retain upper level gymnasts or there is a history of injuries than a gym with more experience might be appropriate.

Also one other thing to note is that gymnasts need to be ready on all events to move up, it doesn't do them any favors to move them up because they might be great at something but then struggle on a different exercise. Not saying this is your child's situation, but often I've seen situations where you wonder why a child is at a certain level and then find out that they aren't at the same place with all their skills. Expecting a child to just figure out the missing skills at the new level can be a terrible situation and once you go up you can't go back down.

 

[Issagymnast]

Like @Dahlialover was asking, what does their upper level team look like? If they have a medium to large group of upper level gymnast that are being placed in colleges or the upper levels are doing very well at meets than there is nothing extra you need to do. You do not need a private coach, you do not need to schedule meetings, you don't need to ask about an accelerated program, you simply need to be an emotional support source for your child.

If the team is struggling to retain upper level gymnasts or there is a history of injuries than a gym with more experience might be appropriate.

Also one other thing to note is that gymnasts need to be ready on all events to move up, it doesn't do them any favors to move them up because they might be great at something but then struggle on a different exercise. Not saying this is your child's situation, but often I've seen situations where you wonder why a child is at a certain level and then find out that they aren't at the same place with all their skills. Expecting a child to just figure out the missing skills at the new level can be a terrible situation and once you go up you can't go back down.

 

[Issagymnast]

Hi, the gym has only been around 7 years so very green...don't think they have much success with upper levels. Lower levels all do very well. I will keep her there for now although I just had a meeting with one head coach (first meeting ever and we have been there 2 years) and she was very negative and not transparent and couldn't answer how we "stimulate the athlete". They had a large walkout a year or so ago of many gymnasts and maybe this speaks more to you all than me? In any case I found a private developmental coach and he will assess my daughter soon. He is saying there is no rush so we will stick level by level and see how we go. I mean a 16 year old is in the Olympics so I don't think she went level by level. I was really asking about elite athletes for college and higher competition purposes. What route do they take?

 

[Dahlialover]

No she is very mature in all aspects. She trains 16 hours/week. They hold the kids back to sweep podium, but I guess what is the rush. At this stage she would be 15 at Level 10 if all goes well. I just wonder how they stimulate the athlete and challenge her given her natural talent. Her father was an ex professional athlete so she is gifted. I am looking to outside sources for developmental training to keep her interested and motivated and training above her level if she is keen.

I have a boy. He started rec gym 18 months ago. He did one day in rec, skipped preteam, skipped level 3, competed level 4 (state and regional champion), skipped level 5, and is now going to compete The highest level available to boys his age (6 elite). If they made him do every level, he’d be back in level 3 and would probably have quit gymnastics. Even with that relatively rapid progression, he was bored and waiting around a lot.

If your kid really is different than the other kids (it’s fairly obvious when that is the case), then go find a gym that has gymnasts getting recruited for college programs and, ideally, competing TOPS, HOPES, and Elite. Doors will close for your child if you wait too long to move her to a competitive gym. Go find out which gym is the best in the area and arrange a trial.

 

[GymDadWA]

'Olympics'

Elite athletes have different paths, there are some that go the TOPS>HOPES route but gymnasts like Simone never did HOPES.

This is an old list but you can see that there is no strict have to do something by a certain age requirement: https://thegymreport.weebly.com/news/timelinenatteam

Does your private coach work at the same gym or how did you run across them? Having a personal coach outside the main gym is unusual.

 

[Dahlialover]

Hi, the gym has only been around 7 years so very green...don't think they have much success with upper levels. Lower levels all do very well. I will keep her there for now although I just had a meeting with one head coach (first meeting ever and we have been there 2 years) and she was very negative and not transparent and couldn't answer how we "stimulate the athlete". They had a large walkout a year or so ago of many gymnasts and maybe this speaks more to you all than me? In any case I found a private developmental coach and he will assess my daughter soon. He is saying there is no rush so we will stick level by level and see how we go. I mean a 16 year old is in the Olympics so I don't think she went level by level. I was really asking about elite athletes for college and higher competition purposes. What route do they take?

A large walkout is a major . All signs point to this not being a gym where your daughter can reach her potential. If you need a private coach, then you need a new gym!

Also, getting coaching outside your gym is a major faux pas in the gymnastics world and is grounds to kick a kid off team. I’m skeptical about this “private” coach. Perhaps you’ve found someone on the banned list who is trying to get around The restrictions. Do not leave your child alone with this person, it sounds questionable.

 

[ORgymmom]

It’s hard to know what’s going on at a gym without being local to it, but I see some red flags at your gym based on recent results. You said they are focusing on taking girls level by level, but their scores all the way through states looks like those of gyms that rush girls through compulsories without getting solid skills on certain apparatuses and/or gyms where girls aren’t properly prepared and are falling far more than is typical. I don’t know which it is, but that combined with everything else you’re saying makes me nervous.

Take your time and look around for other options for your daughter. Competing two meets at level 2 is just step 1 (or maybe step 0) of a long compulsory journey, nevermind the rest. DP compulsory progressions exist for a reason when done right. Find a gym that focuses on strength and shapes. Take dance classes outside of gym if it isn’t included in training. Get all of those things down cold before worrying about what level uptraining you think should be happening.

PS You might want to ask to change your username and edit your post to take out the results so you can be a bit more anonymous.

 

[Issagymnast]

Elite athletes have different paths, there are some that go the TOPS>HOPES route but gymnasts like Simone never did HOPES.

This is an old list but you can see that there is no strict have to do something by a certain age requirement: https://thegymreport.weebly.com/news/timelinenatteam

Does your private coach work at the same gym or how did you run across them? Having a personal coach outside the main gym is unusual.

I was actively looking as Im not 100% sure the gym is right for her. She is very gifted. He will assess my daughter soon. He was an ex olympic gymnast and I saw his business advertised. We spoke at length after I posted this. He runs developmental gymnastic lessons and stimulates the athlete. Exactly. MIne might quit given the 16 hours slow training ALLTHE TEAM. The current gym said they know she is capable of much more but its level by level. Honestly I think they train talent not used to a natural and maybe they dont know how to address it best. They cant tell me to leave as its a business after all. Thank you for your advice, its invaluable.

A large walkout is a major . All signs point to this not being a gym where your daughter can reach her potential. If you need a private coach, then you need a new gym!

Also, getting coaching outside your gym is a major faux pas in the gymnastics world and is grounds to kick a kid off team. I’m skeptical about this “private” coach. Perhaps you’ve found someone on the banned list who is trying to get around The restrictions. Do not leave your child alone with this person, it sounds questionable.

Thanks. He coaches for another well known gym but does outside classes at a college. I have not seen him yet. I will always stay with my daughter. Appreciate your advice. Im learning and digesting all information. Other than levels 2-10...what other ways can a gymnast become elite? Im keen to explore other avenues.

 

[ORgymmom]

Elite qualification rules are here:

https://static.usagym.org/PDFs/Women/ElitePre-Elite/24elitechart.pdf