WAG Liukin just resigned

[Deleted member 14190]

Makes one wonder aboutthe stuff we haven’t heard about that will likely be forthcoming. Hmmmmmmm

Everyone is in attack mode... I would get out too

 

[John]

We can only speculate on the reason he left. If I had money to wager I would place it on self-preservation. NTC is awesome but I am sure he wants his gyms to continue. Become invisible and attempt to evade the fallout. I do not know him personally but like everyone else, I read the blogs and have heard the rumors. Stay in the spotlight with the swirling rumors and how long before there is an investigation?

My Two Cents.

 

[Gymmommy71]

Why not just have no one replace him and have them pick the team based on results at qualifiers...each gymnast who makes the team brings their own coach and they compete their events based on their scores at qualifiers.

Why give one person so much autonomy and power over peoples dreams - that’s how politics and corruption start...or is that too hard for some reason?

 

[John]

@Gymmommy71 agreed something like you describe, could easily be the answer. I could see coachp at worlds or better one day. That is exciting to me.

I feel that the current selection process is not fair to athletes as it works now. What bothers me is, using the Olympic trials as an example, only the top All-Arounder at trials makes the team automatically. Every other team member is selected based on someone's opinion of what the team should be. I fully understand that a team is being selected but, I just can't accept the fact that in some cases the athlete in second or third place may not make the team. That seems completely unfair.

 

[MILgymFAM]

Isn’t there something similar in place for T&T? The senior elites get points for scores or placements at qualifiers and nationals and the people with the highest point tally are the team?

* I could be remembering that wrong, but it’s something like that.

 

[sce]

@Gymmommy71 agreed something like you describe, could easily be the answer. I could see coachp at worlds or better one day. That is exciting to me.

I feel that the current selection process is not fair to athletes as it works now. What bothers me is, using the Olympic trials as an example, only the top All-Arounder at trials makes the team automatically. Every other team member is selected based on someone's opinion of what the team should be. I fully understand that a team is being selected but, I just can't accept the fact that in some cases the athlete in second or third place may not make the team. That seems completely unfair.

The issue is that there are not all all-around spots. This is due to the number of allowed athletes and the number who can compete per event. I don;t think any country bases their team just on trial scores as a result of this. Also at many competitions, during the team a competition they only allow 1 or 2 coaches on the floor, so not all the girl's coaches can be there.

 

[l.c.o]

This whole situation is just so sad.

If Liukin indeed treated gymnasts like claims say, then it would seem that this is surely in the athletes’ best interest.

My genuine question: If he used to treat them that way, but no longer treats them in that manner, is this in the sport’s best interest?

If claims are incorrect or exaggerated, and somehow he is innocent (though why would the gymnasts lie?), then it’s tragic.

I just.... I hate the thought of talented, good-hearted coaches being driven from the sport.

Obviously if they’re abusive, then good riddance even if it means a decline in competitiveness.

I can’t imagine how difficult it must be for positive coaches right now.

I mean, consideration for all of the girls come first. But without good coaches, they don’t have sport.

 

[Deleted member 14190]

@Gymmommy71 agreed something like you describe, could easily be the answer. I could see coachp at worlds or better one day. That is exciting to me.

I feel that the current selection process is not fair to athletes as it works now. What bothers me is, using the Olympic trials as an example, only the top All-Arounder at trials makes the team automatically. Every other team member is selected based on someone's opinion of what the team should be. I fully understand that a team is being selected but, I just can't accept the fact that in some cases the athlete in second or third place may not make the team. That seems completely unfair.

Well thanks for the props , but I am just a JO coach. Liukin is multiple, multiples levels above . In my opinion one of the best bar technicians in the country.

 

[John]

Well thanks for the props , but I am just a JO coach. Liukin is multiple, multiples levels above . In my opinion one of the best bar technicians in the country.

That may be the case. Now you have something to work towards. You and your athletes together. Don't just ask them to work to gain skills, do it together.

No coach is an Olympic coach until he/she is.

 

[amiandjim]

There have been complaints against Liukin for sure. I will say the younger girls have seemed to work well with him, and I personally know a junior elite who says he was wonderful when she was dealing with severe mental blocks. He kept inviting her back to camp, but didn’t push, and said the invitation was open when she felt ready. Whether that means he has really changed, I don’t know.

It does make me sad that Tom Forrester felt the need to resign as bars coach, because unless I’m uninformed, there have been no complaints against him at all. I realize the entire situation is insane and I’m the first to say “get rid of anyone who knew.” However, I genuinely think some of these coaches were well meaning and genuinely had no idea. They don’t even know to be suspicious and careful, unfortunately.

 

[John]

@sce I see your point and understand how the team is picked. I, John, simply do not like the process. I understand it's an attempt to win the team gold, I just don't agree with it.

I can't pretend to know what's best I am just a dad. I just think what would my daughter feel if she was third and never got the chance. I can think of many alternate methods but how would the change be implemented across the world competitions? FIG would need to be envovled?

 

[LindyHopper]

Valeri only stepped down as NTC, correct? He is still coaching at and running WOGA? He hasn't left the sport entirely, if I read it correctly.

 

[3rd_time_around]

Besides the sexual abuse, which is just evil, I think some of what people call abuse is just coaching gymnastics. This is a tough sport, and you don't win by having coaches who don't push when they have to. I also know that these Russian coaches came from an environment where abuse was the norm. Look at China, still abusing children in the quest for gold medals (when will those gymnastics coaches be on the world chopping block?). Over the years, many of these coaches from Soviet countries made their way to America, turned our program around into a winning one, and along the way learned how to coach properly without the abuse. Valeri is one of them, in my opinion. He is an incredible coach, and from the athletes and coaches that I know that have been under his tutelage for over 3 years, they love him! This is a great loss for USA gymnastics.

 

[strawberries]

Besides the sexual abuse, which is just evil, I think some of what people call abuse is just coaching gymnastics. This is a tough sport, and you don't win by having coaches who don't push when they have to. I also know that these Russian coaches came from an environment where abuse was the norm. Look at China, still abusing children in the quest for gold medals (when will those gymnastics coaches be on the world chopping block?). Over the years, many of these coaches from Soviet countries made their way to America, turned our program around into a winning one, and along the way learned how to coach properly without the abuse. Valeri is one of them, in my opinion. He is an incredible coach, and from the athletes and coaches that I know that have been under his tutelage for over 3 years, they love him! This is a great loss for USA gymnastics.

This is what I’ve been trying to put together in my head. This is right on!

 

[HappyGymmie]

I make my daughter eat healthy food, despite her desire to have some ice cream and her favorite junk food. I hope she would not write about me negatively in her diary when she grows up and post it online.

A Russian coach was hired to train a national team in my country (where competitive gymnastics is far behind other countries). It did not work. The gymnasts could not keep up with the rigorous training method and thought it was abusive.

 

[bookworm]

1. If Liukin indeed treated gymnasts like claims say, then it would seem that this is surely in the athletes’ best interest.

2. My genuine question: If he used to treat them that way, but no longer treats them in that manner, is this in the sport’s best interest?

3. If claims are incorrect or exaggerated, and somehow he is innocent (though why would the gymnasts lie?), then it’s tragic.

4. I just.... I hate the thought of talented, good-hearted coaches being driven from the sport.

Point 1: He does treat gymnasts like the" claims" say...Atler's accounts are older but Ohashi's blogs are recent enough to say a leopard hasn't changed his spots. He was cut from the same cloth as Marta, and if USAG doesn't want Marta the Male version, he needs to go for the gymnasts' sake.

Point 2: He's been outed so to speak for how he's treated gymnasts and finally, someone is saying no to the abusive tactics. He may "no longer treat them that way" when someone's looking for now, but how long will that last? Fat shaming to the point of eating disorders is not good for any sport, period.

3. Please, please ..I'm sure these athletes had a hard enough time by revealing the abusive tactics used on them without folks calling them liars....they're not lying.

4. Valeri may be talented , and like coachp said, a great technician for bars, but "good hearted" coaches don't abuse their athletes.

 

[LindyHopper]

I just think what would my daughter feel if she was third and never got the chance.

If i am correct, there have been times that a "better" gymnast is injured before trials (therefore can't compete), and gets petitioned onto the team, bumping someone who placed off the team. Sucks.
I cant help but think how Maggie Nichols felt in 2016, she even got passed over for Olympic alternate.

 

[Deleted member 18037]

If i am correct, there have been times that a "better" gymnast is injured before trials (therefore can't compete), and gets petitioned onto the team, bumping someone who placed off the team. Sucks.
I cant help but think how Maggie Nichols felt in 2016, she even got passed over for Olympic alternate.

The current system is only the 1 st place person at trials gets a spot. The rest of the spots are determined in a back room. Nothing to do with injuries.

 

[LindyHopper]

The current system is only the 1 st place person at trials gets a spot. The rest of the spots are determined in a back room. Nothing to do with injuries.

Dominique Moceanu and Shanmon Miller were injured during trials and did not compete. They were both petitioned onto the 1996 Olympic team

 

[Deleted member 18037]

Dominique Moceanu and Shanmon Miller were injured during trials and did not compete. They were both petitioned onto the 1996 Olympic team

And even if no one is injured. The 2nd place finisher at trials is not guaranteed a spot. There is no point system. No rhyme or reason. No explanation. Just this is who is on team.

Track you could win every heat all season. And at trials come in 6th, Buh bye Olympics.