Switching from NDP to IDP. Does it ever happen in the mid levels?

[Chauffeuse]

PS thanks for all the interesting replies. Food for thought.

 

[Aussie_coach]

Yes, the new changes are set to follow a little more like the old US system.

Level 1-2 will no longer have routines like they do now and compete like that, but will have skills and will compete in a circuit type competition.

Level 3, 4, 5 and 6 will no longer have free choice routines and bonus skills but will have set routines without bonus.

Level 7-10 will have optional routines but less options for bonus especially at the lower levels.

The aim is to increase the longevity of athletes. With very few even getting past level 4 or 5 now.

 

[Jenny]

But if very few get passed level 4 or 5 they are destined to never have their own routines. That is very dispiriting for girls. They like to have their own routines.

Now the idea of testing skills for lower levels as opposed to judging routines I love. I particularly like the way Canada does it for their lower levels of elites. One of the issues with the beginning of the elite path anywhere is the amount of hours needed at a young age. By not including routines so early you can keep hours more reasonable until girls are older. It takes a lot of hours to polish a routine. As long as lots of ballet and dance are included girls can start routines later.

 

[Chauffeuse]

Wow. Thanks for that, your responses are really helpful to me. I have to admit my first reaction (as just a parent) is that that sounds very much more boring for the girls? Not too mention the spectators (lol)!
And what is the point of taking out bonuses? That seems to be one of the main motivators for the girls in my daughter's squad. They love learning bonus skills. Also they have enjoyed the ability to have a different choice of music to their friends.
I am sorry to keep asking questions but do you know when this will come in for NSW NDP ? Our coach is talking about the possibility of skipping levels and if this will come in soon ( 2014/15?) then I am interested to maybe progress her a little faster in 2014.

Thanks your information is invaluable.
Regards

 

[OzZee]

Was meant to come in 2014, but has been postponed till 2015.
There is also the discussion of State Stream in NSW being abolished which is causing a load more discussions!

 

[Aussie_coach]

Yes, it was initially set to come out in 2014, but it was decided that since it is such a dramatic change more time was needed to work out the details and the new program will be released in 2015.

I have no idea about the state stream, as in my state the is not state stream and all gymnasts compete either National or International stream. But I suspect part of the plan is that the levels will be easier so girls with less talent and less hours a week should be able to compete in the national stream.

I think the reason for removing bonus skills is to first of all discourage the repeating of levels. You quite frequently see kids in Australia taking 2-3 years to get through certain levels because they are spending time trying to master the bonus skills or time trying to get the,selves to a point where they can place against girls doing full bonus skills. Our kids are not getting to level 7-10 until well into their teenage years and many have little time or motivation to continue with gymnastics by then. I am guessing they hope that girls will reach the higher levels at a younger age and on less hours a week to avoid burn out.

Again the aim is to get more kids past level 4-5. It also makes it easier to coach. In our gyms virtually any coach can manage to take a squad of level 1-3 gymnasts to competitions. But from level 4 the coaches need to be capable of choreography for beam and floor routines. Also more time is needed to run each group. A group of level 1-3's can all practice their floor routines at the same time. While each level 4 and above will take the whole floor and 1-1 1/2 minutes to run their routine just once. Many gyms don't even have a full floor so they are very limited in what they can offer.

Many gyms do have a full floor but can't give it to a whole group that often as there are many groups training in their gyms.

I agree that it will make for much more boring competitions, although one ofthe arguments they are giving for this change is that it will make competitions better for spectators.

But I don't think kids will get dispirited having to wait until level 7 for their own routines. They won't expect it any earlier.

 

[leotardmakermum]

If not getting your own routine becomes the norm, then it won't be discouraging not to have one. As far as I know, in IDP you don't get your own routine until about IDP10 or even Junior International. It's the norm there and no-one gets discouraged by it. It's something exciting to look forward to.

 

[Chauffeuse]

Thanks. Very interesting. I was thinking for the girls who are levels 4/5/6 now, they are already used to having individual music and individual bonuses in routines but are you suggesting it be will only be applying to new girls starting from level 1? .Will we have " old NDP" girls continuing thru to old level 10 or will everyone be converted to the new system even when they are half way through? I can't imaging running old and new NDP comps etc.. Too confusing !?


I can certainly see the benefit ( and the angst!) of combining NDP and SS and my earlier question in part arises from my uncertainty as to the future direction of NDP.. We have loads of NDP's aged 10/11 training 17 -20 hours a week at out gym. Our similar aged IDPs training only a handful of hours more.

Thanks

 

[Aussie_coach]

Everyone will be converted to the new system from January 1st 2015.

 

[sally]

Well my dd went from idp 2 at 7 to back to ndp and found things very different. Like the bars she was so use to training metal bar that doing wooden bar was new and had a hard time doing it. The other thing she found hard was the vault because she is so tiny getting over that table was near impossible. However after taking a year break looks like she will be going back into idp and not doing sports Acro

 

[sally]

If not getting your own routine becomes the norm, then it won't be discouraging not to have one. As far as I know, in IDP you don't get your own routine until about IDP10 or even Junior International. It's the norm there and no-one gets discouraged by it. It's something exciting to look forward to.

that is because there are no
Competitions and everybody is excited when they finally get to
Compete.

 

[Jenny]

Well my dd went from idp 2 at 7 to back to ndp and found things very different. Like the bars she was so use to training metal bar that doing wooden bar was new and had a hard time doing it. The other thing she found hard was the vault because she is so tiny getting over that table was near impossible. However after taking a year break looks like she will be going back into idp and not doing sports Acro

Good to hear from you again. Let us know how your dd is doing back in IDP. I am surprised that she found it so difficult to transition to wood bar. Did they only do metal bar before and no wood bar at all. Metal bar is very tough on the wrists and elbows and you wouldn't want a 7 year old doing hours of that a week.

 

[sally]

It was just jumping from low to high etc
That she found difficult. They did do a little bit of wooden but mainly metal bar

 

[Jenny]

oh the jumping can be hard when they are little, that makes sense.

 

[sally]

She also found that learning skills was a lot slower so got bored as well. Not sure why but with idp once you got a skill you move onto the next but with the ndp that didn't seem the case. Maybe it was just the club she was at not sure though.

 

[Jenny]

She might have been waiting for others in the group to get the skill too before they moved on. Or maybe they just liked to perfect them and take more time over them. Does she know what level she will do in IDP next year yet?

 

[sally]

Not yet I'm guessing she will do 3. She will have to get her kip back that seems to be the only thing she is missing

 

[potato]

At the moment there is a trial going on at chandler for kids 7-11 i think to go from ndp to idp

 

[sally]

That is correct

 

[sally]

Ok well my dd went for a trial at a club for idp she got in which I was not expecting as she has done acro for the past year. She is training idp5 but her bars are behind. The coach seems to think she will get it back fast once her strength picks up. She got a couple skills last night a full twist and a round off whip. Not sure what that is for. The good thing is she really enjoyed it and seeing an old friend