Would you tell . . .

[Muddlethru]

a gymnast you are coaching or your DD that she can win a states championship? On one side, I feel it may make the gymnast want it more and work harder towards that goal. But on the flip side, if she does not make it, the "failure" (for lack of a better word) makes it more difficult to accept. My DD's coach told her she could win states. She felt good hearing this. I guess it feels good to know someone believes in you. But when she fell off beam and scored an 8.9, she knew the 1st place AA was definitely out of reach and potentially placing at all and she cried. According to my husband, she cried for 15 minutes! I think the pressure is enough to do well at meets (and my DD is truly already too hard on herself) and to have the added pressure of your coach even expecting the most may be too much. Also at competitions (handstands and the like at meets), her teammates root for her as the likely winner and I don't think she enjoys these expectations. Two questions, 1) what do you think about this tactic of telling the gymnast your high expectations and 2) if a gymnast does not like this "pressure" does it mean she is not cut out to handle the pressures of high level gymnastics? My DD is a 9 YO L7. She will be a 10 YO L8.

 

[pinkgiraffe1594]

I think coaches need to use their best judgement based on knowing what the kid is like. Some kids could handle or even flourish with all that extra pressure and others just can't. Neither group has it better though.

If she's young, I think it may be too early to tell whether or not she will be able to handle it. It requires a huge amount of support and work to gain all that mental toughness.

 

[10.0]

There is a big difference between "I expect you to win at states" and "You could win at states" My thoughts are the coach was probably trying to be encouraging not trying to make you dd fell like a failure if she didn't win. I think you need to explain this to dd.

As far as the teammates, again something you need to explain to her. She probably is really good and the teammates root for her, it is a good thing. I highly doubt they are dissapointed in her. I believe competition is good for kids, it prepares them for real life, there are winners, there are loser, sometimes you suceed, sometimes you fail and there is always pressure to do well. It is good lesson to learn early.

 

[cher062]

Let's face it they all "Could" win states IF they work hard and stay focused. Honestly telling any kid they COULD is different from saying they WILL or are EXPECTED to win states.

Alot will depend too on the kid and how the hear what is really being said.

 

[Muddlethru]

I agree with the previous posters. And it never crossed my mind that my DD's coach had any other intention than to inspire and motivate. But sometimes when kids are young, it is hard to tell the difference between motivating and expecting. It is also the personality of some children to want to please. If the coach looks very excited at the anticipation of her gymnast winning a meet, this can translate to disappointing her coach if she does not win.

 

[cher062]

Yes it's true it can translate to that but that is all part of this sport just like any other sport that has some type of championship. Just one more part of life in any sport that the kids have to learn how to deal with.

 

[gym law mom]

Again I agree with others that it depends on how the coach phrased the comment about winning states. Every girl that marched in with your dd had some desire to "win states" and most likely your dd would have put pressure on herself even if nothing had been said.
Maybe a sit down talk with the coach on how to help your dd deal with the pressure she puts on herself is in order.

 

[Muddlethru]

Yes it's true it can translate to that but that is all part of this sport just like any other sport that has some type of championship. Just one more part of life in any sport that the kids have to learn how to deal with.

There are a lot of things in any sport that we have to deal with and learn. But the magic happens when timing is considered, the personality of the athlete, etc. If we treated all athletes the same, regardless of age, skill ability, shortcomings then many would fail. The best lessons learned by athletes are when it is taught in due time.

 

[MaryA]

It's hard... I've said before, this is a sport of "coulda, shoulda, woulda." I hear a lot of talk about, "If you had only stuck your cartwheel, you could have placed..." and even, to put a "full of herself" kid in her place, "If you had one or two more wobbles on beam, you wouldn't have qualified..." Just to make myself crazy, I looked at the scores of the other sessions for the level 5 states and thought, "Gosh, if Kathy had been in a different session, she could have gotten as high as 3rd place AA, where as at her meet she didn't even place!" (of course, I didn't say that to her) I think it's important that kids understand this from an early age... there are good days and bad days, easier competitions and harder competitions. And I think that making sure the message is loud and clear that if she tries hard, you will be proud of her, her coach will be proud of her, and her teammates will be proud of her, regardless of the scores or the placing, is the most important thing. Whether the coach should have said that to her or not, I suspect that he/she won't do it again next year!

Sorry for the tough meet. I hope she still came away from it feeling O.K. about how she did! I'm always blown away by the younger ones at the optional levels! And an 8.9 with a fall is pretty awesome!

 

[All Chalked Up]

IMHO, I would not want my parents to say that, then I would feel pressured because they have no gymnastics knowledge. Now if my coach said that I could possibly win, I think it would drive me harder to go for it, because I know my coaches would not tell me that unless they were very sure that I could possibly win.

It sort of depends on personality too.

 

[Optionals United]

It really depends on the person. like someone else said there is a difference between you could win and you should/are expected to win. someone might be able to handle the pressure knowing they could possibly win and others will just fall apart. at your DDs age i wouldnt have said that. they are in the sport as this point to have fun not win states. sure that would be awesome but it shouldnt be expected of them. my coach told me leading up to states that i could possibly win bars and a took it with a grain of salt. i put it in the back of my head and just did my best. my only expectation of myself was to try my best and let my score and place be whatever as long as i tried my best. so it really depends on the person their age and maturity.

 

[Gymnasticgrandkids]

I think setting someone up for any kind of disappointment (or expectation) is not a good thing. If the coach tells the gymnast that they are doing really well and that if they continue to progress as they have been then there is a good chance that they could do very well at (whatever meet)...but saying that they could "win" seems to me to be showing that the coach is expecting great things from them that may put undue stress to meet that goal and cause them to do poorly. The gymnasts need to be encouraged when they are producing but not made to feel that added stress...I've always said if you are having fun, you will usually will do well but then my DGD was actually having fun (and doing very well) when she crashed and burned at state so I guess that doesn't work either.

 

[Muddlethru]

I think setting someone up for any kind of disappointment (or expectation) is not a good thing. If the coach tells the gymnast that they are doing really well and that if they continue to progress as they have been then there is a good chance that they could do very well at (whatever meet)...but saying that they could "win" seems to me to be showing that the coach is expecting great things from them that may put undue stress to meet that goal and cause them to do poorly. The gymnasts need to be encouraged when they are producing but not made to feel that added stress...I've always said if you are having fun, you will usually will do well but then my DGD was actually having fun (and doing very well) when she crashed and burned at state so I guess that doesn't work either.

Gymnasticgrandkids I like the words you used. It motivates and inspires and less stress/pressure inducing. Anytime you say you could win, the word "win" is usually what sticks and anything less than winning could be seen as a disappointment. Young kids are not capable of deciphering/analyzing sentences or motivations. Thank you gymnasticgrandkids. And just for the record, I truly do not think the coach really did anything wrong and I am not upset at the coach at all. It was just heart wrenching to watch my DD breakdown sobbing for something that could have been avoided and was really unnecessary at such a young age and too early in her gymnastics career.

 

[Muddlethru]

IMHO, I would not want my parents to say that, then I would feel pressured because they have no gymnastics knowledge. Now if my coach said that I could possibly win, I think it would drive me harder to go for it, because I know my coaches would not tell me that unless they were very sure that I could possibly win.

It sort of depends on personality too.

Thanks for your post gymgirl808. But just out of curiosity, if your coach did tell you that and you did not live up to her expectations, would you feel like you let your coach down? How would you feel if your meet ended up to be the worst meet of your season? Would you think the coaches would now think less of you? Also about how old are you?

 

[coachmolly]

Like others have said, it really depends on the kid. But I think it's important to remember that gymnastics is a subjective sport, meaning scores and placements are out of the control of the gymnast. There is no saying who will be judging a meet, what scores will look like, or how the other gymnasts will perform- so putting an emphasis on winning a meet or setting that expectation, I think can be setting a kid up for disappointment. I think it's better to tell a gymnast they are prepared for the meet, point out their improvements since the last meet, and encourage them to set realistic goals not relating to scores and placements.
By the way it sounds, I don't think your DD's coach was saying that to set an expectation, more as a motivational factor. But that approach, especially for kids who are hard on themselves natural, probably isn't the best way to go.

 

[Muddlethru]

Like others have said, it really depends on the kid. But I think it's important to remember that gymnastics is a subjective sport, meaning scores and placements are out of the control of the gymnast. There is no saying who will be judging a meet, what scores will look like, or how the other gymnasts will perform- so putting an emphasis on winning a meet or setting that expectation, I think can be setting a kid up for disappointment. I think it's better to tell a gymnast they are prepared for the meet, point out their improvements since the last meet, and encourage them to set realistic goals not relating to scores and placements.
By the way it sounds, I don't think your DD's coach was saying that to set an expectation, more as a motivational factor. But that approach, especially for kids who are hard on themselves natural, probably isn't the best way to go.

Coach Molly, I like your post and agree with you 100%. More importantly, I think you hit the nail on the head when you said "especially for kids who are hard on themselves naturally, probably isn't the best way to go." My DD is soooo hard on herself. I've never seen anything like it. She gets so angry at herself when she can't do things. I just hope she eventually grows out of it.

Lastly, just for the record, the coach may not have said "I expect you to win", but when someone says "you could win", the expectation is there, otherwise, it would have have been said. Good or bad, her whole team also believed/thought/expected her to do well. Coach Molly and gymnasticgrandkids suggested motivational words I believe works a whole lot better than "you could win"!

 

[Galadriel]

I definitely agree that it depends on the gymnast - my dd similar experiences to yours, and she is hard on herself. If she has lower expectations - ie not thinking she could win or place well, she tends to be more relaxed, and actually do better!
If she is in a situation where the pressure is there and the expectation to do really really well, and a mistake is made, then she would be upset afterwards. Earlier this year a younger gymnast who is excellent had this expectation made clear to her by the coach, and didnt perform as well as usual, and my dd was able to take her aside for a little walk and help her feel better - she said that team mates and parents tend to crowd round and offer all sorts of platitudes to try and make you feel better, but really it doesnt make you feel better - she found it best just to take some time to yourself and get away from everyone for a few minutes.

 

[IJustWriteChecks]

We actually had this happen last season. My DD was an 11-year old L7, and she had a spectacular season on beam. Scored 9.4 - 9.6 at every meet. Before states, I took her to the gym for a light practice and asked the coach how long he wanted her there. The response was, it doesn't really matter, she'll win anyways. This was said right in front of my DD. Well, guess what??? She fell. Only fall of the season. She was devastated, and we were too. The higher the expectations are set, the harder it is when they fall short. We learned a big lesson from it though, and hopefully, the coach did too. That's way too much pressure to put on a child.

 

[pinkgiraffe1594]

It's hard not to take the judging personally when the work involved in doing well is so personal. :/ There's enough pressure, why add more? It should be fun....that's when kids do the best.

 

[aerialriver]

I have had those exact words said to me. I am the most negative, pessimistic, self doubting person you can find, and I took those words as a compliment. My coach has also said it to a couple of my teammates and they tend to be the talented ones, she does not say it to everyone. Maybe you could tell your daughter this.

Although I understand and also like all the fancy wording to walk on egg shells with children, most gym coaches do not have a degree in child psychology, and while your daughter may take it the wrong way another kid might take it as a huge compliment. It was probably not something the coach thought through in the moment. It would kind of be like telling someone they look great in a certain outfit and them taking that as they look ugly in everything else they wear. Honestly if she continues to struggle with this, you might have a sit down with her coach and have her tell your daughter why she said it.