Parents New Level 4 Scoring?

[3LittleGymmies]

If you have a daughter competing the "new" Level 4, how has the scoring been where you live? My daughter had her first meet of the season today (she did "old" Level 4 last year with consistent AA's between 36-38+) and the judging was a complete shock to most of us parents. There were VERY few 9's in the entire session, maybe a handful.. and even those were very low 9's. Girls were placing in the top 6 with 7's and 30-32 AA's. There were more 6's and 7's given than 8's by far (and again, very few 9's). My daughter had an 8.950 on beam (one of the highest from her team), 8.4 on floor (very confusing, because it was beautiful), and shockingly, two 6's on vault and bars. She has never received under a high 8, so to say that she was devastated would be putting it mildly. I was very bothered by the fact that after she got her 6.4 on vault and was clearly shaken up when they headed to bars (so much so that she couldn't even get a kip in warm ups), she was put on bars first. That hurt my mama heart and I don't really understand that decision.. but it was what it was. I was so proud of her for holding her tears in and being happy for those who placed, but as her mom, I knew that she was crying inside. Hard stuff. But really, no one seemed to score well at all. Beautiful routines that I could have easily seen getting high 9's last year in "old" Level 5 were getting 7's. I wish that she was more prepared to score THAT poorly. I can't imagine her coaches not knowing that the scoring would be that low across the board.. but maybe they didn't? We did have a gym switch in between these seasons due to a move, but I have not felt that she was unprepared going into this meet at all. It was all really a shock to everyone. Her gym doesn't usually allow privates, but I am going to ask to meet with one of the coaches and discuss this. I mean.. if she's doing so much wrong that she's scoring that low, she obviously needs extra help. It seems like she may have been better off scratching those events . But like I said, they were "counting" good routines over the past week and she was cleared to compete for AA and felt confident going in. I don't know if it's just the new routines, or the coaching, the judging, or what. I don't think that it's her specifically, because no one really did very well.

 

[2G1B]

I don't know about level 4 specifically, though I know that our team has girls who are scoring 9s. BUT... it is the end of the fall season for us. It sounds like you guys are just starting. (By "end" I mean states are next weekend for level 4, they were this weekend for levels 1, 3 and 5.)

For my youngest DD, who is a level 2, she won 1st place for beam at her second meet (back in early September) and her score was only an 8.4. No one was more shocked than her. She had been upset with the low score; but then went on and on to me about how "that is NOT a first place kind of score! If that score won first place then everyone has some serious work to do!!" LOL (she saved this discussion for in the car after the meet.)

My point is that it did seem that at the first few meets of the season scores were on the low side. By this weekend they seemed to be more to where they had been comparatively last year. Maybe a little lower; but not crazy low.

 

[3LittleGymmies]

Yes, @2G1B... this was her first meet of the season. Our states are at the end of April. We only have one "season" (compete Nov-April). Do some states have two seasons? I had no idea that some states competed different seasons!

 

[JoyAvenueMom]

We had our first meet last weekend and the scoring was really low as well. There were a few 9's...mostly very low 9's. A good mix of 7's and 8's and plenty of 6's. We were prepared for low, but wow! People commented on how the judges were just getting used to the new routines, etc. but the funniest part was that vault scores were REALLY low, and that was the one "routine" that didn't change. (8.4 won in Kippers group) I don't think anyone scored over 36AA...even the ones repeating the level.

 

[2G1B]

It is my understanding that in our state the "main" season for compulsories is fall; but then there is a smaller (less competitors) spring season. There is a state meet for both.

 

[Natasha]

It is very common for vault scores to drop significantly when going from the flatback to the handspring vault. It is a much more complicated vault and at the beginning of the season it is typical to see very low vault scores, especially among the younger ages. (Think about it, they will do this same vault for at least 3 levels!) Bars are also generally much lower going from L3 (or old L4) to new L4. There is so much more in the bar routine and more opportunities for deductions. At the beginning of the season girls just don't have all the details, connections, straight arms, etc. I think what you are seeing is more a function of moving up a level than the routine changes. Typically you will see much improvement in scores as the season goes on.

 

[Natasha]

Oh, and as far as being first on bars, that may or may not have been a coach decision. In our area almost all meets we attend the order of the girls at each event is preselected by the computer program and it rotates for each event. The coaches have no control over it nor any power to change the order.

 

[saddlupasb]

I agree with gymtigermom. I judged vault last weekend and saw a whole range of them. It is like that early in the season. You said you moved. Did you move from one Region to another?

If the coach was able to pick order then maybe they had already done that before warmups. At smaller meets around here we have to write our order down and give that sheet to the judge. Or they may have put her first because she was missing a skill. That is pretty common also.

I want my L4 dd to focus on how much she improves each meet. And that isn't based on scores. She has never gotten a 6 at a meet but I'm sure that will change next weekend on either bars or vault. But hey, the season is just beginning and for us her personal growth is more important than her scores.

 

[3LittleGymmies]

Thank you all for your encouragement and advice. I love CB for this very reason!

@saddlupasb, she is not missing any bar skills. Her bars are usually decent. She usually does extremely well on floor and beam and not as well on bars and vault. She does bend her arms on her kips, but only two girls on her team have a totally straight-arm kip. Her swing-swing isn't always as high/powerful as it seems like it's supposed to be. She has always struggled with bars. I think that she thinks too much! She finally turned it around about halfway through the season last year and ended with a 9.5 at state. She was very shaken up about her vault score, and they headed to bars next where she couldn't even kip during warm-up's.. so I had a feeling that it wasn't going to be good (and the look in her eyes.. poor girly!) and when she was put on first, I felt so badly for her . In your opinion as a coach and judge, do you think that her coaches had an idea of what her scores would be? I can't help but feel like they should have prepared her for scores that low, especially knowing how well she did last year. Like I said, they were "counting routines" over the past few weeks and needed a certain number of "good" routines for each event or they wouldn't be able to compete them all. She was cleared to compete them all. Of course, now I am wondering what the definition of "good" is.. because I am not sure that anyone would say that a 6 is "good"! We did not switch regions...

 

[3LittleGymmies]

And as a total aside.. I was so proud of my gymmie for holding back her tears and plowing through the rest of the meet and awards, where she genuinely cheered for and congratulated those who placed on bars and vault... even though, as her mom, I knew that she WANTED to cry! (and she did once she got in the car) What kind of bugged me is that she stayed *so strong* (we have talked a lot about how to act if something like this happens) out there and not a single coach acknowledged that or the good sportsmanship she showed.. yet the girls who cried over scores they got received all kinds of hugs and encouragement. Sigh. I sure hope that front she put on wasn't perceived as her "not caring".

 

[gymmomtoo]

Scores were low here at the first meet of the season--(a meet our gym hosted) with comments from the judges that some coaches weren't teaching the routines correctly. But they have seemed to improve (not that I've been to meets, but from looking at scores posted online), so I wouldn't be surprised if your daughter's scores jump up once the coaches "fix" whatever was wrong.

And WTG to your daughter for showing such good sportmanship!! I'm sure the coaches notice that kind of thing.

 

[roll123]

We have had three level 4 meets so far and we have found the same thing. I was so upset when my daughter was getting 7's but then At awards she actually placed in the top 5. I couldn't believe it when she did! I suppose they are just scoring the routines lower this year, we have seen an increase from first meet to third but still not near what we were scoring at our third meet next year.

 

[LizzieLac]

There are certainly the "low scoring" meets out there, but in my experience it is pretty normal for kids just moving up to a new level to struggle with scores at that start of a season. When my DD (who scored almost a 38 at level 4 states) started level 5 she was getting 8s on bars. When I looked at the routine I couldn't understand why. She "did" all of the elements. I asked her bars coach and he said, "there are a million things they can deduct for - every bent arm, low cast, leg separation, insufficient tap swing, and pause that causes it to be unconnected."

As the year goes on those things improve...

 

[JBS]

Scores in our area are like last year. 38's are not uncommon at L3. 37's at L4 & L5.

Our club runs a wide range of abilities at each level though...anywhere between a 31 or 32 and 37's.

 

[GymGirl's Mom]

Our season just began. I have found scoring to be about equal to what it was at old L5 last year beginning of meet season. DD is not in a "high scoring" area- typically we hardly ever see 9.5's and above-- the gymnastics just has to be spot on perfect. A "low" 9 is for really terrific technique, form, etc. You just don't see lots of 37+ AA scores around here at a meet- a handful or less.

That said- judges get pickier the higher the level. Just having all the skills to complete a routine isn't enough to break an 8 in L4 (old 5) IMO. All the little things count- and add up- bent elbows, feet not together, knees not straight, etc- can really bring a score down. My guess is your DD while able to complete her skills and routines needs polishing. You have a long season- she will see her scores rise as the season progresses.

 

[saddlupasb]

But she was missing her kip in warmups and a lot of coaches will put them up in order of how they think they will do. Did you have a practice meet?

I let the kid with the best sportsmanship take home the Team trophy. Crying over scores is not acceptable behavior. Good for her for staying strong.

 

[3LittleGymmies]

@saddlupasb, she doesn't normally ever miss her kips even at practice. They went from vault to bars and I think that vault score just really messed with her head . She said the order was printed on a sheet (she also went first on bars)... but do they need to go by the sheet 100% of the time? I'm really just curious about that because I have worked almost every event and have only seen coaches give the judges cards. I am absolutely NOT saying that she would have gotten a 9 if she went last instead of first. But I do wish someone had given her a little pep talk after that vault score to help get her head in the right place before they warmed up on bars. She said that nothing was said to her, and I didn't see anyone approach her, either. If I could see the "rattled" look on her face, surely they could, too... ya know?

 

[3LittleGymmies]

They did have a mock meet, but only positive comments (nice pointed toes! etc.) were given by older gymnasts.. not scores by judges.

 

[wgymmom]

It's been very hard here too. DD's first meet, none of the L4 girls got so much as a 9. DD had never received a score lower than 8.6 last year, never scored below a 36 AA. Her AAs this year have been 34.95, 36.15, and 35.075. I don't get it - first year L5s last year could get 36-37s, so it seems like the "new" L4 is being judged more harshly than old L5.

 

[wgymmom]

Oh, and I also felt like we should have been given more of a heads-up. They told us about a week AFTER the first meet that scores were expected to be lower. Thanks for telling me (and my poor gymmie) beforehand!