Parents At a loss (mental block follow-up)

[ac7179]

My daughter is very similar. I fight the battles on some things (school work) and not so much with others. She is really pretty talented in gymnastics but was not enjoying the 12+ hours practicing as a second grader. She liked gymnastics but wanted more time to play at home. She thought the coaches were mean. Really, they were just pushing her to be the best she could be but she didn't understand that at 7.

So, even though it was difficult for me, we pulled her out and moved her to a gym that works out less hours a week (down to 6), and she repeated Level 4 (well, moved down to Level 3). It has been helpful. She still enjoys the sport and no mention of quitting, although I can't say she always gives 100% in conditioning and stretching.

When I think back to when I was a kid, I didn't even start gymnastics until 10, so it seems a little silly of me to expect that she should just have this innate work ethic as such a young child. I know some kids do, but she just doesn't so far and instead of treating it like there's something WRONG with her, we decided to just back off and give her more play/relax time. It's helped in the gym.

I wish you the best.

 

[gymdog]

It's not that we CAN'T afford it, but honestly, who wants to spend hundreds of dollars a month on something their kid won't put effort into? Gymnastics is not the first time we've had this problem with her by far (school is the most common place we deal with it).

I do appreciate your input, but I want to try to teach her how to work harder because this is an issue in more than just gymnastics and it's a life skill. Sure, I can put her in a cheaper sport but she's still not going to work hard. I'd rather first address the issue of work ethic in a sport she does love and wants to be in.

But if you're completely honest with yourself, do you really think what you outlined in this thread as your plan is likely to change her as a person? I think you run a high risk of disappointment and worse, that your child will know it.

My parents never asked me anything other than if I wanted to quit gymnastics. When I said no they signed up again. I did gymnastics until my early twenties and it made me the person I am today. It doesn't matter what level you are. In ten years will it matter that she didn't do back handspring until you yelled at her? When your child is an adult and no longer lives with you, is this what you want to remember? My mother never missed a meet, but she also never watched a single practice (aside from a couple minutes at the end while waiting for me to finish). She remembers it all fondly because every time she was amazed at what I had learned at the meets.

Gymnastics was a sacrifice for my family too. I am not an only child. But they never held it against me. There were ups and downs but I found my own path. Gymnastics is very hard. There's no real way for an outside observer (parent, coach) to say whether a child is giving the best they can or not. I am a fairly tough coach and whining, crying, etc if the child is fine is ignored. I just tell them "rest now." When I start to get trapped in the thinking of "why won't she just do x? She's not trying!" Something always pulls me back and humbles me. Not immediately, but always. Maybe I am not trying because I don't have a masters degree (I am fully capable of getting one) or my house isn't clean (I am fully capable of cleaning it).

 

[MILgymFAM]

But if you're completely honest with yourself, do you really think what you outlined in this thread as your plan is likely to change her as a person? I think you run a high risk of disappointment and worse, that your child will know it.

My parents never asked me anything other than if I wanted to quit gymnastics. When I said no they signed up again. I did gymnastics until my early twenties and it made me the person I am today. It doesn't matter what level you are. In ten years will it matter that she didn't do back handspring until you yelled at her? When your child is an adult and no longer lives with you, is this what you want to remember? My mother never missed a meet, but she also never watched a single practice (aside from a couple minutes at the end while waiting for me to finish). She remembers it all fondly because every time she was amazed at what I had learned at the meets.

Gymnastics was a sacrifice for my family too. I am not an only child. But they never held it against me. There were ups and downs but I found my own path. Gymnastics is very hard. There's no real way for an outside observer (parent, coach) to say whether a child is giving the best they can or not. I am a fairly tough coach and whining, crying, etc if the child is fine is ignored. I just tell them "rest now." When I start to get trapped in the thinking of "why won't she just do x? She's not trying!" Something always pulls me back and humbles me. Not immediately, but always. Maybe I am not trying because I don't have a masters degree (I am fully capable of getting one) or my house isn't clean (I am fully capable of cleaning it).

Yes, this! We are not rich by far- my daughters get free lunch and are on partial scholarship at gym... But I personally wouldn't put any money towards this sport, or any, that I couldn't feel comfortable "throwing away". The rewards I hope are reaped from their participating in gymnastics are far away and intangible to me- I hope it helps them develop into confident and happy young women who can handle failure as well as success, and who can smile at the impossible. That's it in terms of the payback I hope for. I truly believe that we cannot always see how hard another person really tries, and we cannot decide for our kids what is their best effort. I watch my girls practices, because it saves me gas money and they want me to, but I never intervene and I never judge. I just smile and enjoy that I get to see an important part of their childhood unfold.

 

[SignHere]

I truly feel that if a child does not seem to be giving it her "all" , there is another reason. Too much parental pressure, a niggling injury , she feels over faced , something.

There is nothing wrong with your daughter repeating a level, even level 3, even at the ripe old age of 10. And, she just might be the strongest on the team, get a taste for winning, and get a fire in her belly to move up and keep winning.
I wish you luck, but don't force your daughter to quit something she loves because she is not fulfilling your expectations in her sport.

 

[LIGYMMOM]

I really sympathize with everything you're saying, but as I was reading through this thread I kept thinking, could gymnastics perhaps give her a bit of this work ethic you want her to obtain? I totally agree with gymdog, but it is a hard decision! If it were me, I think I would give it time, and let her deal with tough coaches, what is expected of her, and see if it gives her this gift of a work ethic.

 

[gothgymmom]

And im def taking in all these replies because its like your dd and my dd are twins! haha.. im right there in the same boat with ya hun!

 

[ac7179]

I really sympathize with everything you're saying, but as I was reading through this thread I kept thinking, could gymnastics perhaps give her a bit of this work ethic you want her to obtain? I totally agree with gymdog, but it is a hard decision! If it were me, I think I would give it time, and let her deal with tough coaches, what is expected of her, and see if it gives her this gift of a work ethic.

Yes, this. I finally decided she could either do gym on her own terms or not at all. Now, that said, there are some limits. Blatant disrespect or lack of effort won't fly. But being told to point her toes for the millionth time? I'm going to not fuss about that and let her (hopefully) find the natural consequences eventually.

Also, I'd rather her do gymnastics and remain at a lower level bc of her work ethic than not do it all. If we take her out, that time at the gym is going to be spend doing something not as productive. I'd much rather her be at the gym repeating Level 3 and Level 4 for two or three years each than quit and lose an activity that is healthy for her socially, emotionally, and physically. Although I do feel your pain, Mama! I've been there.

 

[skschlag]

One thing I try to remember about these guys doign gymnastics the number of hours a week they do (or any intense sport), is that even if they are not giving 100% all the time, they are giving way more than the majority of us are! My son put it best to me one day, when I was acting all CGM for a bit, and commented on his work ethic and the way he seemed to not be trying. His reply was "YOU go do what I am doing. I AM trying, as best I can at tte time." It made me realize a little about what they go thru, and i remember feeling that as a swimmer as well.

 

[MerriWeather]

This is not about skills or levels, I have tried to be clear in that. This is about her lack of effort. She ADMITS she isn't putting her all into it. Is it really that wrong to expect her to actually put her all into something that she says she wants to do? I have said to her and I think on here that I don't care if she's level 3 again next year if that's where she needs to be based on her abilities, but not because she's too lazy to work to her potential.

She has been in gymnastics (I use that term loosely for the early years) since she was 18 months old. She is 10 now. It's not like we signed her up this year and decided after one season she needs to work harder. She has been doing gymnastics in some form for nine years! Even though she is young, I feel like that's a pretty long time to let her do it at her own pace but there does come a time (for us) that enough is enough and we're not going to throw away our money for team if she's not putting her all into it. I would not care in the least if she were in rec gymnastics and doing this, but she doesn't WANT to be in rec. She wants to compete.

And yes, as her parents, we certainly can tell when she's not trying her hardest - even her coaches have commented on it. Looking around to see if anyone is looking and then completely skipping out on her turn at something? I'm pretty sure that counts as not working in the most obvious form.

I'm not trying to get defensive, but I feel like I'm being judged for all the wrong reasons. I'm not some overbearing crazy parent who wants an olympian. I don't care if she does this a while and then wants to quit or do something else. But if she does want to do it, I expect she put effort into it. You have to earn things in life, and she needs to start learning that.

I am coming here to vent and get feedback BECAUSE I can't/don't talk to her about it except a few times as I posted here. This is not an ongoing conversation with her. Most days, I just say, "How was practice?" and that's it. At meets, it's nothing but praise for how hard she works - not criticism that she didn't go for something we know she can do. We are very gentle and loving parents and very proud of her but this is an issue in many aspects of her life and it's starting to become a problem in school (we are addressing separately and gently) as well. It seems like if there is an obvious place for her to learn that if you want something, you have to work for it, gymnastics is the prime opportunity.

Frustrated.

 

[MerriWeather]

My last thought as I am completely losing energy right now is that she admits she's not trying her hardest and she is sad every time she doesn't place at a meet. This isn't just her parents wanting her to do better - she wants to do better but has not made the connection that she's never going to place if she doesn't actually try.

 

[profmom]

If she does not have intrinsic motivation, you cannot make her have it. It's your choice what you do about that reality. If you as a parent require intrinsic motivation in order to commit financially to an activity your child wants to do, you should communicate that to her and encourage her to select an activity for which her desire will be sufficient to meet your standard.

If she really does care about doing better and placing at meets, she will best learn and apply the connection between hard work at practice and good outcomes at meets if she figures it out on her own. Otherwise it's about as useful as nagging a kid to clean up her room, and probably builds about as much character. Your task is to figure out how long you are willing to wait for her to work it out before you pull the plug. If it were me, I'd be hesitant to do it as long as my child was enjoying the activity.

I don't think you are being judged, but inevitably if you ask for feedback and the feedback is varied, you will find some of it more palatable than other. But advice here is as free as the wind, so use what's useful to you! I'm sorry you're feeling so frustrated.

 

[LIGYMMOM]

This is not about skills or levels, I have tried to be clear in that. This is about her lack of effort. She ADMITS she isn't putting her all into it. Is it really that wrong to expect her to actually put her all into something that she says she wants to do? I have said to her and I think on here that I don't care if she's level 3 again next year if that's where she needs to be based on her abilities, but not because she's too lazy to work to her potential.

She has been in gymnastics (I use that term loosely for the early years) since she was 18 months old. She is 10 now. It's not like we signed her up this year and decided after one season she needs to work harder. She has been doing gymnastics in some form for nine years! Even though she is young, I feel like that's a pretty long time to let her do it at her own pace but there does come a time (for us) that enough is enough and we're not going to throw away our money for team if she's not putting her all into it. I would not care in the least if she were in rec gymnastics and doing this, but she doesn't WANT to be in rec. She wants to compete.

And yes, as her parents, we certainly can tell when she's not trying her hardest - even her coaches have commented on it. Looking around to see if anyone is looking and then completely skipping out on her turn at something? I'm pretty sure that counts as not working in the most obvious form.

I'm not trying to get defensive, but I feel like I'm being judged for all the wrong reasons. I'm not some overbearing crazy parent who wants an olympian. I don't care if she does this a while and then wants to quit or do something else. But if she does want to do it, I expect she put effort into it. You have to earn things in life, and she needs to start learning that.

I am coming here to vent and get feedback BECAUSE I can't/don't talk to her about it except a few times as I posted here. This is not an ongoing conversation with her. Most days, I just say, "How was practice?" and that's it. At meets, it's nothing but praise for how hard she works - not criticism that she didn't go for something we know she can do. We are very gentle and loving parents and very proud of her but this is an issue in many aspects of her life and it's starting to become a problem in school (we are addressing separately and gently) as well. It seems like if there is an obvious place for her to learn that if you want something, you have to work for it, gymnastics is the prime opportunity.

Frustrated.

Not sure who you thought was being judgemental but if was me I apologize! You are her mother and of course you know her best. I was just trying to be helpful and lend perspective. Sorry, this does sound frustrating. Keep us updated on what you decide to do!

 

[MerriWeather]

If she does not have intrinsic motivation, you cannot make her have it.

This is what I actually wonder about - you don't think motivation or work ethic can be taught? I honestly don't know because I am just that way by nature. Which, of course, makes it harder to understand why she ISN'T that way!

 

[MerriWeather]

Not sure who you thought was being judgemental but if was me I apologize! You are her mother and of course you know her best. I was just trying to be helpful and lend perspective. Sorry, this does sound frustrating. Keep us updated on what you decide to do!

Oh, I didn't really have anyone in mind. I am just so, so frustrated and conflicted. Of course no one can make me feel judged but myself.

 

[profmom]

I think the best way to teach it is to put children in situations where their choices lead to natural consequences from which they can learn, and then just step back and let them learn. Gymnastics is great in that regard.

Just to give another sports example -- my son really wanted to make the freshman soccer team last fall. His one weakness is that he's not very fast. I am no speed demon, but I do run frequently, so I invited him to come and run with me every few days over the summer. He did sometimes, but not as often as he should have. He ended up making the team, but it was a lot harder and more stressful than it had to be because it was always easier on a daily basis during the summer to say, "nah, I don't feel up to a run today." Fast forward several months -- he was doing much better about coming to the gym with me this winter to put in a few miles on the treadmill once a week even while he's doing biweekly soccer practices because he realizes that it will be a heck of a lot easier to stay in shape than to get in shape, and he really wants to make the JV team next fall. The summer will reveal if he has really absorbed all the feedback he got about his choices. My role is simply to offer the opportunity and then see what he does about it.

 

[MerriWeather]

I agree. But it's not registering with her for whatever reason (i.e. screw off at practice and then don't place in meets is not equaling put more effort into it).

 

[Gymdaddio]

Anyone besides me waiting for IWANNACOACH to weigh in on this one?

 

[LizzieLac]

IMO, since you are the parent and it is your money that gets spent (and is also intended to be for the rest of the family), your time and family sacrifice, you get to decide if her lack of effort is worth it in this sport. There any number of less expensive, less physically challenging activities that she could do as a means to learn work ethic, effort, motiviation, discipline, etc.

No one has mentioned that this sport can be dangerous. Kids who are focused and try their hardest get hurt all of the time. There may a risk to her physically if she is "going through" the motions when she does attempt these skills.

Frankly, I would be irritated if I was spending $100s and $1000s of dollars on something and my kid was going throught the motions and putting no effort into it. Not progressing is very different than not trying.

 

[Seeker]

I don't think all kids are born with the ability to connect effort with results. If this presents a good opportunity for her to work through some issue with a sport she reportedly loves, I see no issues with that -- sounds like the perfect setup. It may finally open her eyes/heart/mind in the right way if she runs the risk of losing something she loves.

You may also discover some unforeseen things along the way that will help her translate these new found skills to other areas for her. I wish you the best of luck!!

 

[profmom]

I guess what I would conclude from that evidence is that non-placement at meets is not motivating to her. If it were, she would change her behavior. If it were me and she seemed upset about meet outcomes, I'd just remind her that if she doesn't work hard in practice, she won't get the results she wants. Good luck!