WAG Class of 2023 first verbal

[Natasha]

She is not old enough to post Twitter, Snapchat, FB, all say they will remove accounts if they realize you are under 13. Ironic, huh?

I was thinking the same thing--- 12 year olds are not deemed mature enough to have social media according to rules, but apparently are mature enough to be making college decisions. Really, way too much pressure too young.

 

[Midwestmommy]

5 things:

It's silly because she isn't even through puberty yet (on average girls grow 2-3 more inches after first period).

The younger these skills get pushed, the more likely their bodies will be broken before they even get to college.

It makes a mockery of NCAA rules.

All adults involved should be embarrassed and the fact that they aren't emphasizes the reality that stricter rules are needed for the well being of children. They may look like mini robots out there, but do not cognitively develop faster than their peers. All too familiar in this sport, kids are pushed too early.

The pressure this puts on a 12 year psychologically borders on abuse.

 

[Deleted member 14190]

Bottom line is... everyone is a critic until it's .... your kid.

 

[Texasmomof3]

But if it is their dream school and they are planning to go there no matter what, then maybe they actually aren't limiting their choice of major and career expectations.
Most, if not all, of the bigger schools have plenty of majors to choose from.
All of my possible majors were available at every D1 school that has a gymnastics team.

The school might offer the program, but it doesn't mean the athlete is allowed that major. I know a number of schools where the coaches limit which majors are open to their athletes.

 

[Texasmomof3]

I am thinking of a particular gymnast I know. She was verbally committed to a top program in 9th or 10th grade. When schools would ask her what she wanted to study, she didn't know what to say (since she was only 13/14 at the time it was starting). So her parents said to say she wants still study X, because gyms would like to hear that. She now does plan to study X, because it will be a good major to go with being a college athlete.

She told me it was easy, because she never had to actually decide what she is interested in studying. I find that very sad. But she seems completely happy with the decision.

 

[Muddlethru]

One very important caveat here. A verbal contract anticipating an event 3-4 years off in the future is generally NOT going to be enforceable in a court of law.

That is true. However, communication between college coach and athlete does not stop on the day the initial verbal commitment is made. Communication and reassurances are usually ongoing until they sign the LOI. The complaint could easily contain the date the last reassurance was made. I also know the statute of limitations of a promissory estoppel is 4 years from the date of breach. Nonetheless, I likely should not have even mentioned the enforceability of this type of lawsuit because I don't even know if one was ever filed and I know it would be a difficult and costly endeavor. But it is there if the damages are quantifiable and severe and the athlete's family chooses to engage in a lawsuit.

 

[sewgood]

The school might offer the program, but it doesn't mean the athlete is allowed that major. I know a number of schools where the coaches limit which majors are open to their athletes.

What are they limited to?

 

[Texasmomof3]

What are they limited to?

Some programs don’t allow engineering majors, nursing, anything with clinical rotations, anything with labs, any programs with a co-op semester, certain natural sciences, any teaching degrees that include student teaching.

Basically, if it interferes with practice time, you aren’t allowed to study it.

 

[duyetanh]

Some programs don’t allow engineering majors, nursing, anything with clinical rotations, anything with labs, any programs with a co-op semester, certain natural sciences, any teaching degrees that include student teaching.

Basically, if it interferes with practice time, you aren’t allowed to study it.

At the college where i had my athletic scholarship, every major was allowed...but the coaches werent thrilled with certain ones...the athletic dept would always know the course schedule ahead of time to see what classes would fit with workouts. Unfortunately, some classes obviously had prerequisites. I do know several athletes who had to do at least 1 extra *session* so to speak, because it wasnt possible to take certain courses during the height of the season. This didnt happen to me due to scheduling conflicts, but because the training was so intense, I did do two extra sessions to complete my schooling. It was just near impossible to do over the min units during competition season.

 

[sewgood]

Some programs don’t allow engineering majors, nursing, anything with clinical rotations, anything with labs, any programs with a co-op semester, certain natural sciences, any teaching degrees that include student teaching.

Basically, if it interferes with practice time, you aren’t allowed to study it.

That’s terrible.

 

[tomtnt]

Bottom line is... everyone is a critic until it's .... your kid.

Lol, so true..

By the way, take a look at incoming Florida freshman vanasia bradley. Committed in 2014 and was injured for 2 years. Barely competed until 2016 and never regained her prior elite level and medically retired. Florida honored her verbal commit and she is joining the team as a student-coach on scholarship.

 

[Deleted member 14190]

Lol, so true..

By the way, take a look at incoming Florida freshman vanasia bradley. Committed in 2014 and was injured for 2 years. Barely competed until 2016 and never regained her prior elite level and medically retired. Florida honored her verbal commit and she is joining the team as a student-coach on scholarship.

Thats pretty stand up for sure.

 

[Aussie_coach]

Wow, that is crazy. I am speaking as a true outside here and we do not have college gymnastics or college athletic scholarships here in Australia.

I certainly see the pluses for gyms having this big carrot to offer to kids. To encourage them to stick at gymnastics through their high school years. But the rest seems crazy to me.

It would seem that it would make a lot more sense not to offer places until the gymnasts are at least in 12th Grade, here in Australia tertiary places are not usually offered until 2 months AFTER graduating high school. Students apply for tertiary education in September of their senior year (as the school year starts in January that is 2 months before they graduate). Then if an audited on of sorts is required it is scheduled after that date. They apply for all courses and schools they want through one central system and just list their preferences. Then spots are offered for the top preference they get into once final 12th Grade results come out.

Offering scholarships in 12th at least means you know where the athletes is skill wise, injury wise, academically etc. In 7th or 8th there is so much that can come into play and push them out of the sport altogether, or stop their progress.

7th and 8th graders here don’t have “dream schools” or any idea what or where they want to study after school, or if they even want to study after high school. Which seems a lot more age appropriate, the early teen years are about learning and discovering yourself and your interests.

 

[kecks]

...just wanted to say: so happy to live in a country in which everyone who performs well enough academically can enter college for free. this whole ncaa thing looks beyond crazy to an outsider. i teach year 6 and 7 and 8 all the time. these kids have no idea that there is such a thing as "their future". they can not have a "dream school" beyond their "dream you tube star" or "favourite football team" or "dream occupation" (most of the time vet or professional athlete, for sure). these are teenagers. it is beyond anyone to know what will be good for them in four or five years time.

 

[profmom]

Well, do remember that this board is going to produce a particular perspective on college because of the athletic component. The US has thousands of colleges and universities. Every state has some that the public supports (albeit to a small degree these days). If a student in the US works hard, gets good grades, and does reasonably well on standardized tests, putting in a range of applications at a variety of schools should net the student at least a little merit aid somewhere. Some folks in the US also limit their overall costs by starting out at what we call community colleges -- these are teaching-intensive institutions that generally offer only a few four-year degree options but provide packages of introductory and lower-level courses that fulfill basic requirements and end with an associate's degree. The student can either walk away with that (much cheaper) degree or transfer to a four-year college and receive a bachelor's from the four-year institution. Some of my best students have come to me from our local community college, though people contemplating this route should be aware that the best chances for four-year completion lie in starting at a four-year school, living on campus, and being in a small living-learning community as a first-year student.

Good colleges take care of student athletes and help them to be students first. We register them early, so they can get sections or offerings of large courses that fit with their practice schedules. By me, athletes have some extra help with advising, but we advise our own majors. My advisees take a lighter load during their competition seasons, and we backfill with an extra course during winter term (a four-week term in between fall and spring semester) or a summer course if winter doesn't work. We look to schedule the tough courses and capstones in the off season, and balance the schedule so that the student isn't taking several time-consuming courses simultaneously. Sometimes we can even find internships that work. The nice thing is that this holistic advising model that takes into account a student's entire life works well for all students, not just athletes.

My objection to early commitments is that there simply are so many options in the US that for most, it doesn't make sense to fall in love with one place before even beginning the application process. Falling in love with a place that early is usually about falling in love with an idea, not through real knowledge about the institution, its flavor, and its academic offerings. And for all but the tiniest handful of prospective students, there are likely several institutions out there that would be just fine.

There's so much unnecessary anxiety around college in the US and getting into and going to a "good" college. I am always saddened to see friends' children making decisions to borrow ridiculous amounts of money to attend a private school that is only marginally better, if better at all, than their public option. US News rankings do not tell the whole story, and most Research I universities and strong liberal arts colleges nowadays are loaded with astoundingly brilliant and accomplished faculty who've survived the toughest job market gauntlet in fifty years. What you want is to be at a school that has those faculty in the classroom teaching your kids. If they choose a school like that, they'll be fine.

US colleges and universities are still the best in the world, and if you open your eyes to possibilities rather than narrowing things down and worrying about one or two places, you may see wonderful things you never expected to find. Take a deep breath and keep that in mind as you prepare for the whirlwind!

 

[Muddlethru]

Agree with most of profmom's post above but would also like to add, inasmuch as there are so many options available to students in the US and that there are so many outstanding learning institutions, keep in mind that there are only about 64 Div. 1 college gymnastics teams. As such, the pool of colleges to choose from is already, not just slightly but significantly limited. You now only have a handful of highly academic colleges to choose from; 4 Ivies, Cal, Chapel Hill, Michigan. So committing early is not really as huge a limiting factor as one may think; choosing to do college gym is. Additionally, if you have a top gymnast, going to a top gymnastics team would be a preference and would further narrow your choices to 30-40 teams. Then, you get to know the coaches and the prospective teams, the program, benefits of the gymnast in the team and now your choices are down to maybe 1 or 2 teams. I acknowledge that there are gymnasts that choose a college because they fell in love with the campus perhaps. But most regular students use the same gauge. I don't support too early commitments but I can see why it may be good for the gymnast. Having a college waiting for you at graduation, paying for your education, plus other perks is certainly a huge plus.

 

[tomtnt]

You left out Stanford, UCLA (ranked higher than the other 2 public schools you mentioned), Univeristy of Washington

 

[bogwoppit]

Not sure I agree that "US universities and colleges are the best in the world", according to the tables put out each year the best are pretty well spread out over the world. Considering I pay less than $5000 a year for my kid to attend McGill I think a lot of US schools are overblown. Leaving Uni with an undergrad degree and $160,000 USD of debt is ridiculous.

https://www.theguardian.com/higher-...-200-universities-in-the-world-2018-the-table

I do think college attendance in the US is seen as a much more important right of passage than in many other countries. That of course puts a ton of pressure on kids and their parents.

 

[Aussie_coach]

Itndefinetly seems to be a right of passage. Here thee is no pressure to attend further education. In fact kids are only encourage to do so, if they have their sights set of a specific career.

 

[kecks]

here kids are encouraged to do what suits their abilities. some go into training on the job at age 15 after year 9. they get paid for three years by the company they are training with and go to a public "vocational school" for one day every week where they get some further general eductaion (german, religious instruction, math, english, social studies...) but mainly attend classes about the job they are training for. they pass a state exam after two or three years (depending on performance and ecuation before starting the training on the job). there is such an exam for every job thinkable (and new ones all the time), like for car mechanics, hair dressers, kindergarten teachers, lots of different things (kindergarten teachers do train 5 years so, execption of the rule). so most kids do not attend college here (around 60% do not). they still get a structured education that qualifys them for a job. and they get paid to train, they do not have to pay to train.