WAG Coach problem

[MomIdidit!]

My feedback assumed that the situation was more than just a coach being tough. But if that's the case, then I do agree with you @coachp . It definitely warrants another discussion with the coach (directly since you said she's taking over the gym anyway) either way before a decision is made.

My DD has a coach who she feels hates her. The coach doesn't. She's awesome, but tough. But you know your daughter and whether she's an exaggerator or not. Mine's a drama queen but I know when something is really bugging her.

 

[Deleted member 14190]

You're assuming that the communication line is clear. I know for a fact my 8 year old DD has likely nodded her head at her coach not fully understanding what she's asking her, whether due to the language barrier or because my DD has a hard time converting words into body action (she does better when a coach actually has another kid show her or holds her body in the position she needs). Coachp seems to often forget these are LITTLE GIRLS who want to please the adults around them and will nod in agreement for fear of letting someone down. It isn't easy to admit you don't know what's being asked of you. Even ADULTS have a hard time with this. It's also the COACH'S responsibilty to ensure the girls understand what is being said.

==
I would tend to agree on occasion but this is obviously more than that and has already been discussed multiple times between coach/ child / mom. Like I said, Again and again and again and again. I have zero problems spending a few days/weeks on something simple but after a while you have to question the listening or willingness of the child. I would really like to see the written corrections that she is not understanding, that will give us at least an idea.... currently we are just speculating.

 

[MomIdidit!]

I have to agree with coachhp. It sounds like you have a talented dd, and maybe instead of finding a new gym discuss with your dd ways that she can work with the coach to make her an even better gymnast.

 

[Deleted member 14190]

Also, remember people, if this was a bad coach they would just let her do whatever and ignore her..... What tells me that this coach could be a good one, is the fact that she is not letting it go. As a coach when a child is not making a correction you can either give up or COACH. Sounds like the coach is coaching to me.

 

[Mimiluv]

I agree and have told my daughter how much that can irritate a coach (having been one). I think part of the problem is the way the coach does speak to her, like I posted about originally. I think that's why she is hesitant to speak up to this coach.

I have told her that she has to speak up and tell her she doesn't get it.

I guess as being a former coach. When I gave a kid a correction and it wasn't a hard one and they still didn't do it. I assumed that they didn't understand it and I would need to explain it differently for it to make sense to them and or I needed to show them how it should feel. Because not everyone child or adult understands directions the same way.

Trust me, I do stick up for this coach and my daughter doesn't always like it.

But as an adult, it's very hard for me to ask someone I find unapproachable for help also lol. I can only imagine how hard it would be for a child.

We just need to get over this personality conflict or whatever it is or go else where.

I actually do believe I told this coach in one of our first meetings that my daughter is shy and her shoulder shrugging isn't being sassy.

Thanks for the help. I do understand what all
Of you mean. I look at both sides of the coin.

 

[COz]

I think you've already had great advice in this thread. Just wanted to add, please please don't try and communicate this via email. As this problem looks like it's communication based, don't add any other potential avenues for misunderstanding.
The coach will need to see that you are genuinely trying to figure this out rather than laying blame. You need to see their response to your words so you can give further clarification or ask more questions. You need to see the recognition in their eyes so you know that they 'get' that your daughter isn't understanding and is not being rude.
I know that you feel that if everything was on paper that it would all be clear, but in this case it is too complicated had you risk making things worse.
Good luck. It does sound like the coach is trying hard to get through and is frustrated but hasn't given up on your child. As mentioned above "this happens at school too" is a brilliant comment. You can also use "I get frustrated when she nods at me at home and I realise later that she didn't understand", "we're trying to work on her shoulder shrugs at home. I don't know where they came from. She doesn't mean to be rude, when she does it it means she doesn't know/understand, not that she doesn't care".

 

[mimi]

I think sometimes kids think that they understand the correction but they can't make their bodies do what their brain knows that it needs to do, especially when they are learning something new. I have a hard time believing that a kid doesn't apply corrections right then and there in the moment just because they are lazy or don't feel like doing it. I can't speak for anyone else, but I know with my own child that no one is more frustrated than her when she can't seem to make a correction. Even if she doesn't show her frustration outwardly, she comes home and vents it to us.

 

[Mimiluv]

Oh and I have told my DD that, when I was a coach, I would devote more time to the girls who were working to make the corrections and that she needs to show her or tell her coach she really does want to make them, but she needs some help. I told her I wouldn't spend a lot of time on the girls that didn't seem to really be trying or making an effort.

I'm not a totally wishy washy mom either lol.

 

[Mimiluv]

I think sometimes kids think that they understand the correction but they can't make their bodies do what their brain knows that it needs to do, especially when they are learning something new. I have a hard time believing that a kid doesn't apply corrections right then and there in the moment just because they are lazy or don't feel like doing it. I can't speak for anyone else, but I know with my own child that no one is more frustrated than her when she can't seem to make a correction. Even if she doesn't show her frustration outwardly, she comes home and vents it to us.

And that's what I think also. My daughter works hard and gets frustrated with herself also. I just want to her to feel able to tell the coach this somehow or have the coach recognize that she obviously isn't getting it or she would be making the correction.

 

[gymmomx2]

I think sometimes kids think that they understand the correction but they can't make their bodies do what their brain knows that it needs to do, especially when they are learning something new. I have a hard time believing that a kid doesn't apply corrections right then and there in the moment just because they are lazy or don't feel like doing it. I can't speak for anyone else, but I know with my own child that no one is more frustrated than her when she can't seem to make a correction. Even if she doesn't show her frustration outwardly, she comes home and vents it to us.

This, x100. My DD is going through this right now with her ribs sticking out in her handstand. She KNOWS what it needs to be but she can't make her body do it. Her coach says she needs to build the muscles to keep her ribs in. Meanwhile, the coach does keep reminding her to keep the ribs in (to build those muscles) but she really cannot do this yet. She really really tries but she CANNOT. Thankfully she has a coach who understands why she can't seem to apply this SIMPLE correction.

 

[Sasha]

I guess as being a former coach. When I gave a kid a correction and it wasn't a hard one and they still didn't do it. I assumed that they didn't understand it and I would need to explain it differently for it to make sense to them and or I needed to show them how it should feel.

I like this approach. Yes, kids will often nod thinking they understand, then not be able to physically translate the instruction (in any sport, as I've taught/coached several). Explaining another way and/or showing when possible sure does help. Recently my son(7) who lives and breathes gym came out of class telling me he might want to just do his other sport more and gymnastics less. This was out of the blue and shocking coming from him. Upon gentle digging, turns out he had to 'climb the rope' for not applying a correction on vault. He understood all the words coach was saying, but really didn't understand what his body was supposed to do to make it happen. He felt defeated, embarrassed, and 'in trouble' even though he tried his very best (he is an attentive, hard worker in gym). My heart sank for him. He always speaks up when he doesn't understand - in every walk of life (like he won't just write down a math answer you tell him - he has to understand it first) - but he didn't know what to ask in this case since he understood all the words and had every intention of applying them to his best ability. But couldn't.

Well, I knew the correction in question (heel drive), so even though mom isn't supposed to "coach", I took him home and spotted him on some super-slow motion 'vaults' using the sofa to illustrate. Me lifting him in the position was an immediate light bulb moment. He went in the next day and kicked butt on vault to much praise by coach.

I love his coach for many reasons, but I do wonder sometimes why a coach would choose to 'punish' a kid for not making a correction when the kid in question DOES routinely ask questions, IS focused, and clearly puts forth effort to make corrections. Wouldn't a coach see that the kid truly doesn't get it (like you said) and try another approach?

I don't want to derail your original questions. Just agreeing that it's not always the kid's 'fault' for just not speaking up. Sometimes it is, especially when it's a pattern (my oldest son is notorious for nodding when he has no idea what you just said - argh - annoying as heck), but knowing when a kid isn't focusing vs. in need of another approach is what makes a great coach, imo.

 

[tegan_tegan]

This is like what has happened to me / happening to me. Me and my team mates went to our other coaches and told her about it and she said she would talk to her but we don't believe she has, as we have seen no change. We also told the other coach we would not continue at the gym if we only had her and she was caring and supported us with that choice and said as long as you are doing gymnastics I don't mind .
The coach we were talking to is stopping coaching us, that was one the the main motives for us talking about it .

Sorry I meant to just say I was sort if going through the same thing as your daughter but I kind if rambled on a bit.

 

[coachmolly]

This is a hard one for me. As a gymnast, I experienced coaches who said inappropriate/ineffective/down right mean things to me which have greatly affected the way I see myself to this day. They really wore me down and suck a lot out of me. However, as a coach, I am tough and have high expectations for my girls, meaning that I am not always well liked by my kids, especially when the asst. coaches are present who are much more lenient and "fun." I am not demanding of these girls because I want to be mean or think it's fun to beat them down (and I hope I'm not beating them down), but because I see their potential and want them to work up to it. There are times I will call kids out for misbehavior, not working to potential, or cheating because those are things that I am not okay with as a coach. I try not to make an example of a kid or humiliate them in front of others, but talking to the group as a whole or personal chats in the middle of a rotation don't always seem to do the trick, so sometimes I'll need to say something out loud where other girls can hear. But, I also try to offer praise for hard work or trying to make corrections so it's not all negative.
So it's tricky. Have you watched any of the practices to get a sense for yourself of what is going on? Or talked to any other parents? I don't mean gossiping, but asking in discrete ways how other girls feel about how practices are going to gauge whether this is a common problem or one more specific to your child.
I don't think walking out the door is the answer, as there are lots of sides to every story, but I also don't think you should minimize what your daughter is saying. It's tricky. Perhaps start drafting a list of some definitive examples of things that have happened, not only how the coach reacted, but also anything that lead up to it. This could maybe show some patterns and help get a better picture of what is going on- if there are things your daughter can do differently and a means to gauge whether these are just personality conflicts or valid concerns for your daughter's well-being.
I hope things resolve themselves and your daughter can continue doing what she loves!

 

[Anna's_Mom]

I recently re-learned a lesson that I thought I had mastered when my kids were preschoolers. Then, when someone said that my child wasn't doing what was expected, wasn't paying attention, wasn't trying and/or when the child was complaining about a teacher's being mad at them, I knew to run through "the basics" before assuming it was either the child or the teacher. Or when my kid was repeatedly having trouble at home. You know, are they getting enough sleep, are they hungry, can they actually see and hear what is being asked of them... So last week I got a completely frustrated email from DD's coach about how she was unsafe because she wasn't watching the coaches as they demoed things, not paying attention, and not trying... Sat and talked to DD -- finally figured out that her vision had changed enough that she literally couldn't SEE what the coach was pointing to nor could she always see the vault or bars clearly. She wears glasses in the classroom but hadn't needed them at the gym and we just didn't think about it. No wonder it looked like she wasn't trying to do what the coach was pointing out! Got contacts this week and instant change. Which is a very long way of saying, before deciding it is either child or coach issue, make sure it isn't a third influence that you haven't identified.

 

[beamer]

This is a hard one for me. As a gymnast, I experienced coaches who said inappropriate/ineffective/down right mean things to me which have greatly affected the way I see myself to this day. They really wore me down and suck a lot out of me. However, as a coach, I am tough and have high expectations for my girls, meaning that I am not always well liked by my kids, especially when the asst. coaches are present who are much more lenient and "fun." I am not demanding of these girls because I want to be mean or think it's fun to beat them down (and I hope I'm not beating them down), but because I see their potential and want them to work up to it. There are times I will call kids out for misbehavior, not working to potential, or cheating because those are things that I am not okay with as a coach. I try not to make an example of a kid or humiliate them in front of others, but talking to the group as a whole or personal chats in the middle of a rotation don't always seem to do the trick, so sometimes I'll need to say something out loud where other girls can hear. But, I also try to offer praise for hard work or trying to make corrections so it's not all negative.
So it's tricky. Have you watched any of the practices to get a sense for yourself of what is going on? Or talked to any other parents? I don't mean gossiping, but asking in discrete ways how other girls feel about how practices are going to gauge whether this is a common problem or one more specific to your child.
I don't think walking out the door is the answer, as there are lots of sides to every story, but I also don't think you should minimize what your daughter is saying. It's tricky. Perhaps start drafting a list of some definitive examples of things that have happened, not only how the coach reacted, but also anything that lead up to it. This could maybe show some patterns and help get a better picture of what is going on- if there are things your daughter can do differently and a means to gauge whether these are just personality conflicts or valid concerns for your daughter's well-being.
I hope things resolve themselves and your daughter can continue doing what she loves!

Coach Molly: Having read your posts over the years, I get the sense you would never be sarcastic or belittling when you are coaching your gymnasts.

This is where the line gets drawn. It is one thing to get outright mad, stern or emphatic when you are trying to get a kid to understand and apply corrections... or whatever. It is entirely another thing to lodge these corrections in a way that makes the athlete feel like an idiot -- especially when this is done in front of the athlete's peers. We all know the difference between these two approaches. And we all know that the former technique is constructive and the latter is destructive.

In the latter circumstance, walking out the door is usually the only recourse.

 

[Mimiluv]

This is a hard one for me. As a gymnast, I experienced coaches who said inappropriate/ineffective/down right mean things to me which have greatly affected the way I see myself to this day. They really wore me down and suck a lot out of me. However, as a coach, I am tough and have high expectations for my girls, meaning that I am not always well liked by my kids, especially when the asst. coaches are present who are much more lenient and "fun." I am not demanding of these girls because I want to be mean or think it's fun to beat them down (and I hope I'm not beating them down), but because I see their potential and want them to work up to it. There are times I will call kids out for misbehavior, not working to potential, or cheating because those are things that I am not okay with as a coach. I try not to make an example of a kid or humiliate them in front of others, but talking to the group as a whole or personal chats in the middle of a rotation don't always seem to do the trick, so sometimes I'll need to say something out loud where other girls can hear. But, I also try to offer praise for hard work or trying to make corrections so it's not all negative.
So it's tricky. Have you watched any of the practices to get a sense for yourself of what is going on? Or talked to any other parents? I don't mean gossiping, but asking in discrete ways how other girls feel about how practices are going to gauge whether this is a common problem or one more specific to your child.
I don't think walking out the door is the answer, as there are lots of sides to every story, but I also don't think you should minimize what your daughter is saying. It's tricky. Perhaps start drafting a list of some definitive examples of things that have happened, not only how the coach reacted, but also anything that lead up to it. This could maybe show some patterns and help get a better picture of what is going on- if there are things your daughter can do differently and a means to gauge whether these are just personality conflicts or valid concerns for your daughter's well-being.
I hope things resolve themselves and your daughter can continue doing what she loves!

I totally get what you're saying. I was the same way with the girls I knew had a lot of potential. I was harder on them But at some point I would pull them aside and quietly tell them WHY it seemed like I was being harder on them. Because I saw in them what they maybe couldn't see yet. They always really liked that and then they didn't feel like I was just picking on them.
I

 

[Mimiluv]

See now like today she doesn't want to go to practice. She says she just wants a day off, but she hasn't been to practice in 3 days she had a meet on Sunday.

I don't know if I should force her to go or not. I really want her to go and I think she should, but should I? As a parent it gets murky. But it concerns me. Before coming to this gym she NEVER wanted to miss practice.

 

[twinmomma]

See now like today she doesn't want to go to practice. She says she just wants a day off, but she hasn't been to practice in 3 days she had a meet on Sunday.

I don't know if I should force her to go or not. I really want her to go and I think she should, but should I? As a parent it gets murky. But it concerns me. Before coming to this gym she NEVER wanted to miss practice.

We went through a rough patch with DD when her Xcel team last season switched coaches and therefore coaching styles (SIGNIFICANTLY). Only once did she not want to go, but we took her and she was fine- had a blast as always. I have to say though it's things like this thread that make me terrified to switch gyms. My wife and I are seriously discussing it given some of what has gone on at DD's gym this season but I'm worried more about the devil I don't know than the devil I know right now.

Can you make an appointment for a sit down serious heart to heart away from the normal talking after practice sort of thing?

 

[Mimiluv]

Have a heart to heart with whom? I never get a chance to talk to her coaches after practice, or do you mean my DD?

 

[Deleted member 14190]

See now like today she doesn't want to go to practice. She says she just wants a day off, but she hasn't been to practice in 3 days she had a meet on Sunday.

I don't know if I should force her to go or not. I really want her to go and I think she should, but should I? As a parent it gets murky. But it concerns me. Before coming to this gym she NEVER wanted to miss practice.

==
Yes she goes to practice.