WAG Elite Path or Track????

[profmom]

So it would be safe to assume a kid in L3/4 at age 9/10 is probably not on an Elite path? No matter what the parents have been told or what the parents think.

With the disclaimer, that it is a child not planning on doing multiple score outs in a year.

Fairly safe, though occasionally a late starter blows through JO quickly and focuses on training for elite compulsories. DD's gym does not train elites, but I have seen two girls who fell into that category.

TOPS, like the boys' Future Stars program, probably does not have as its primary benefit the production of elite gymnasts. Rather, these programs (and Hopes) provide a well designed national competitive program that encourages the development of strong fundamental skills and excellent form. These things will benefit any gymnast, and the competitions provide an incentive to kids, parents, and coaches to invest the extra time and commitment. I think it's very easy to get caught up in the competitions themselves, but the real benefit is the learning and growth garnered through participation, not in winning.

 

[Scotsgirl]

My dd has been put on the elite pathway meaning more hours for her , there are 6 or 7 girls in her class who are aged between 6 and 7 mostly 7 they are training for level 4 they will sit this when they are 9 , they are on a different pathway maybe faster progression ? This being said I know last year the class went from 7 girls to 3 as the hours are so high and some dropped out , I am sure I read that, here in the UK once a gymnast passes level 2 they are considered an elite gymnast so you could be on the elite track for many years .

 

[ZJsMom]

It does seem like in some cases, TOPs has become a racket. If you look at the list of TOPs team members, you'll see gyms that have a lot of girls on TOPs team consistently and have never produced an elite. It would seem they're getting good at TOPs but not much more. At the same time, when you look at that list, you'll notice a lot of big name elite gyms are not on there--no Chow's, Texas Dreams, WOGA. It looks to me like TOPs has taken on a life of its own outside of a way of training kids for the elite track. I guess that's just MHO though.

 

[B.Gold]

It does seem like in some cases, TOPs has become a racket. If you look at the list of TOPs team members, you'll see gyms that have a lot of girls on TOPs team consistently and have never produced an elite. It would seem they're getting good at TOPs but not much more. At the same time, when you look at that list, you'll notice a lot of big name elite gyms are not on there--no Chow's, Texas Dreams, WOGA. It looks to me like TOPs has taken on a life of its own outside of a way of training kids for the elite track. I guess that's just MHO though.

Part of the reason no chows, dreams, or woga is because TOPS is also a vehicle for coaches' athletes to get noticed by The Ranch so the coach gets invited down, with the athlete, and learns how to develope elite gymnasts. The gyms listed already have the tools, and political connections, to do that. Therefore, TOPS isn't necessary for those gyms.

 

[Natasha]

The way gyms use TOPs can vary greatly. DD's old gym had a program that they labeled "TOPS" It was invitation only and focused on training the physical abilities skills. However, it was only 1 1/2 hours extra. At the time it was a group of girls who were L4 and training only 6hrs a week at that level. TOPS was for the girls they identified with some natural ability and strength and perhaps girls they thought had what it would take to get to high level optionals, as the gym as a whole had very few girls who went past L7/8. In no way was it a program for girls who were elite bound (or even college bound for that matter) but had I at that time read the TOPS info on the USAG website, as a newbie parent knowing nothing about how gymnastics works, I may have thought that my kid was now training for elite…. So yes, I agree, the TOPS term is way overused and can simply mean they are working on training some of the conditioning skills.

 

[Deleted member 18037]

So yes, I agree, the TOPS term is way overused and can simply mean they are working on training some of the conditioning skills.

And when I look at the TOPs skill (and our gym doesn't do "TOPs"), our gym does a lot, if not all of those things except at our gym it's called practice

 

[duyetanh]

...better tell that level 3 parent their child needs to step up their game bahahaha....
(sorry...couldn't resist...have a feeling I know the story....)

 

[raenndrops]

OK so if you are a young gymmie, at what point do you go from tracking Elite, to acutally being Elite.

Is it an age thing, do you have to get to a certain level and then you switch to Elite?

And then if I am understanding this correctly you have a young gymmie and you say she is on an Elite path that doesn't necessarily mean she will eventually be an Elite gymnast, correct?

Just because a kid is doing TOPS, doesn't actually mean they be Elite?

They officially become an Elite when they compete at an Elite qualifier and get the qualifying scores on both the compulsory and optional routines. They can earn the qualifying score on the elite compulsory routines at the same qualifier or a different one than they earn the qualifying score on their optional routines.
You can be a Junior Elite as young as 11 years old... but you can also still be "pre-elite" in the Hopes program from 10-12 years old.
You may be on the Elite track and never become an elite - quit, get injured, want less intensity, etc.
TOPs does not guarantee that a gymnast will become an elite either, but they would be considered to be on an elite path.

 

[raenndrops]

See this is how ignorant I am.

There are elite compulsories? These are different then JO compulsories? And yet they still may not end up an Elite Gymnast.

https://usagym.org/pages/women/pages/index.html
If you go here and select Elite program, you can read about the elite compulsories and the qualifying scores, etc.

 

[JBS]

So it would be safe to assume a kid in L3/4 at age 9/10 is probably not on an Elite path? No matter what the parents have been told or what the parents think.

With the disclaimer, that it is a child not planning on doing multiple score outs in a year.

Correct.

 

[Jenny]

I agree with most of this. Though I would like to point out there can be a huge gap between a kid testing TOPS and competing at an elite qualifier. I know kids who made TOPS A camp as level 7's and 3 years later still are trying to successfully compete minimum level 9. I obviously don't consider TOPS gymnasts as training elite but that is just my opinion. I'm not a huge fan of the TOPS testing program. It seems like every gymnast should be training to improve on the TOPS physical abilities tests not matter how high or low their goal.

And by the strictest definition I agree with you that even junior elites could still be considered as "training elite"

Actually I totally agree with you on this but I didn't want to be seen as writing TOPS off completely lol.

 

[Jenny]

My dd has been put on the elite pathway meaning more hours for her , there are 6 or 7 girls in her class who are aged between 6 and 7 mostly 7 they are training for level 4 they will sit this when they are 9 , they are on a different pathway maybe faster progression ? This being said I know last year the class went from 7 girls to 3 as the hours are so high and some dropped out , I am sure I read that, here in the UK once a gymnast passes level 2 they are considered an elite gymnast so you could be on the elite track for many years .

Our elite system is very different from the US and is clearly set out from the age of 8. There is also a compulsory 1 to pass now. Then Espoirs and Juniors. Finally you reach Senior Elite level when you can compete at the British Championships.

 

[Sasha]

As I'm building my understanding, here's the model I'm seeing that would fit "Being on the Elite path" (not being elite per se)..

• Kid is on track age-wise to be competitive in TOPS-level skills (the bars, beam, floor) by the time she is 8 and testing the 'skills' portion (not just the physical abilities like rope climb).
  • Whether or not a gym actually participates in TOPS, it seems those kids who have the skills (with impeccable form of course) necessary to be competitive on the National Test (not just State test skills which are easier) would be on the right track to progress on a path to Elite.
    
    
  • The 8 year old TOPS National Skills are (I'm told by the TOPS coach here - so please correct if wrong!), about level 7. Connecting multiple kip-cast-45, free hips above horizontal, switch leap, BHS on beam...
    Link: https://usagym.org/PDFs/Women/TOPs/Testing/2015/national_skills.pdf
    
    
  • The skills get harder at age 9 and 10, so if not there by age 8, it's hard to 'catch up', though there is a possibility that girl who isn't ready at 8 (late starter perhaps), but is exceptional and makes enormous leaps ahead by age 9 or 10 could still work her way toward elite. There are always exceptions, I'm sure for a truly exceptional kid who doesn't fit the 'normal' elite path at a particular gym.
    
• Whether or not formally participating in TOPS or HOPEs in her gym, the gymnast likely focuses less on JO (many do participate in JO for competition experience, though), and at age 10-12/13 now instead works specifically toward the skills and routines needed to pass the Elite Compulsory and Optional routines conducted in Elite Qualifier competitions, with an eye to scoring well enough to be invited to the Elite Competitions (separate competitions from JO).
  Elite Compulsory Routine Playlist:

• • If choosing HOPEs (age 10-12 or 11-13 - not sure what it is this year?), this can be a stepping stone to Elite also (though not necessarily) and, I believe, designed to give kids not quite ready to test Elite an intermediary step with slightly easier than Elite routines and the chance to compete in something more exclusive than JO against other HOPEs ('elite Hopefuls') gymnasts and build up to being able to test in the Elite Qualifiers.
  • I see HOPEs as kind of a 'proving ground' of sorts to test oneself against other "Elite Hopefuls" and gauge if a girl is going to be competitive in that arena. Many won't be, and can move back to JO if not being successful in the more challenging HOPEs stream/competitions, and leave with a wonderful experience and great training that will probably make them very successful in JO. The ones who are most successful, however, will often work to push to test in the Elite Qualifiers and try to "become a JR. Elite" after acquiring the minimum scores.

There are surely steps and paths I'm missing, but this is just my personal understanding of what an "Elite Path" could look like. Happy to have corrections, though, as I'm learning as I go!!

 

[Jenny]

You don't need to be invited to elite competitions. You just enter them. There are not many , most compete in an open category often mixed with level 10.