Parents Hours in the gym?

[Gym Chix Mom]

My daughter is 10 years old in her second year at level 5. At our gym level 5 can either attend 4 days or 5 days a week (3 hours each day). My daughter goes 5 days (15 hours) plus 1 hour of dance is required. Additionally, the gym offers a 45 minute vault clinic, 45 minute bars clinic, 45 minute beam/floor clinic and a 2 hour open gym. So in total she could end up in the gym over 19 hours. She usually goes 18.5 hours and loves it. (I'm tired just thinking about it!)

 

[LasswadeCoach]

I coach in the UK, and my 6&7 year olds attend my national gymnastics school, and train 40 hours a week

 

[JBS]

I coach in the UK, and my 6&7 year olds attend my national gymnastics school, and train 40 hours a week

Wow...this would be considered extreme in the US. What do they do during all of this time?

Do we have any other UK coaches here? How do you feel about this amount of time?

(By the way...I checked out your website, your gym looks very nice.)

 

[LasswadeCoach]

Thank you, and yes that amount of hours we train is considered extreme in the UK too, but we only accept very few children and of extremely high standard, and the parents rarely object, they train 5 days a week for 7 hours on a monday - thursday, and six on a sat & sunday, 3 hours is spent on physical preparation, flexibility, strength and drill work each day. The rest is spent on full routines, and the training of new skills

 

[JBS]

Thank you, and yes that amount of hours we train is considered extreme in the UK too, but we only accept very few children and of extremely high standard, and the parents rarely object, they train 5 days a week for 7 hours on a monday - thursday, and six on a sat & sunday, 3 hours is spent on physical preparation, flexibility, strength and drill work each day. The rest is spent on full routines, and the training of new skills

Do you set any time aside specifically for dance/choreography? Also...is Lasswade Gymnastics the UK version of WOGA? Have you produced any world class athletes?

 

[LasswadeCoach]

No, we havent produced any world gymnasts, because our gym is quite new, and yes we have 1 and a half hours set aside for choreography each day, it is a very very important part of gymnastics in my eyes. However our best gymnast, who's 11 recently won the British championships and will be competing at the next commonwealth games, we do hope to hav world class stars of the future, as our yougest kids are already competing very difficuly skill.

 

[davjam]

hour in the gym

Thats a lot but i guess every one is different

 

[littlegymchampsmom]

why more hours?

I am curious, especially after reading about how many hours a young gymnast can work out each week.. why talented gymnmasts are asked to work out even MORE hours? I hope this does not sound too naive or even silly to ask... but I am so new to all of this. If there was true talent would'nt they be able to greatly excel during regular gym time? My daughter who is only 5 (her coaches stress 5 and a half to me when I say this, she turns 6 in sep) works out 8 hours a week on a pre-team class training for level 5 + takes a one hour rec class and goes to a couple of open gyms every month for fun + she is always practicing at home, well anyway on top of this her coaches approached me and said they think she is very talented and wanted us to add a private lesson every week. They stressed it was not about the money (I kind of asked that in a round about way), but rather that she can't reach her full potential with her current schedule... now as a proud mommy of course I can rave about all of her accomplishments and know she is a wonderful gymnast, but I see so many talented young gymnasts around. She does seem to catch on quickly and I think she is a pretty stong kid, but don't the kids all catch up at some point on a more equal playing field? How do coaches measure talent vs' drive and determination... what do they look for in a gymnast that says you need more time in the gym?? She does have a couple of other things that are probably a little advanced for her age, but again in a couple of years don't they kind of even out? I wish I just understood this sport a little better. It just seems the better they do the more the coaches want more??

 

[Geoffrey Taucer]

My philosophy is to limit the hours that kids spend in the gym when they're young, simply because I don't want them to burn out. I'd rather have a kid wishing he/she could come more than burning out and wanting to spend less time in the gym.

But then, my gym isn't aiming to train top level elite gymnasts.

It often gets on my nerves when coaches try to arrange private lessons and additional gym time with their most talented kids, when the ones who really need those lessons are the less talented ones. A less-talented kid who works hard can pass up a talented kid who doesn't very easily.

 

[littlegymchampsmom]

... I actually saw that happen at a meet last week. lesser talented, hard worker placing higher then the more naturally talented gymnast...

Now, I don't want to bad mouth our coaches at all... I think they are very passionate about what they do and have been wonderful to all of the girls on pre-team and team - they coach all the way from pre-team to elite.... and I love watching my daughter progress and see she responds so well to them... but at this age, learning to go around on the bar (sorry I don't know what this is called) and backwalkovers on the beam - i think that is a level 6 skill? do coaches try to get them to do as much as possible - earlier the better sort of thing? .. she can't even compete level 5 for another year and a half... why do they push to learn the more difficult skills so soon now? AND should I be careful about that?? as a parent I know nothing about this and I feel like I should know when to step in and say enough, but I really don't know... honestly, even I get sucked into the "wow, look at how little she is and how much she can do" sometimes... that matched with me seeing she does have strong desire to learn more... maybe what I am missing is that at that age they are probably just so hungry to learn, learn, learn? Do we just let them? but honestly it would be silly to add private lessons just to advance more/sooner, right??? sorry now I am just thinking more out loud.. they only approached me yesterday about this and I actually lost sleep over it last night... maybe I am just making more out of it then what it even needs to be...

 

[LasswadeCoach]

your child, as such a young gymnast, should NOT be able to compete such high levels skills on the amount of hours she is training she is not doing enough conditioning and drills to make her muscles and joints strong enough for these moves, she is more than likely performing them incorrectly, or could be severley damaged in later life, a specific amount of conditioning needs to be done for these skills at her age, as her body has not yet developed, particularly her joints, coaches who 'throw' skills as i call it, to impress the parents, are completely out of order. your child could be seriously injured if this continues

 

[Geoffrey Taucer]

Lasswade, I don't think it's fair for you to make that call without being familiar with the coaches or the kid in question.

littlegymchampsmom: if you are concerned, bring up your concerns with the coaches. Odds are they'll be willing to listen and discuss it with you.

 

[JBS]

your child, as such a young gymnast, should NOT be able to compete such high levels skills on the amount of hours she is training she is not doing enough conditioning and drills to make her muscles and joints strong enough for these moves, she is more than likely performing them incorrectly, or could be severley damaged in later life, a specific amount of conditioning needs to be done for these skills at her age, as her body has not yet developed, particularly her joints, coaches who 'throw' skills as i call it, to impress the parents, are completely out of order. your child could be seriously injured if this continues

This is why I was asking what you do for 40 hours a week. "Throwing" a skill is not what damages the body (it damages the coaches back)....it's the week in and week out constant pounding. Right or wrong...overuse injuries come from overuse. Yes, they happen much more often when the wrong technique is used. But at 40 hours per week, your gymnasts have a lot more time to overuse themselves. Many gymnasts are bow legged...this has nothing to do with muscles. Bones and growth plates are still developing at a young age.

Yes...developing great muscles and technique will minimize injuries...unless the injuries are coming from doing too much strength. Proper strength for a young child can be achieved in just a few hours per week. At my peak I was only doing a half an hour to 45 min of strength a day. I was STRONG!

A gymnast with great technique will, by nature, develop much more power. With more power...little bodies are getting hit harder. The key is the advances in equipment. Are you letting your gymnasts pound themselves to death on hard surfaces....or are they on trampolines and soft mats most of the time????

 

[littlegymchampsmom]

Lasswade,

I appreciate what you are saying, and maybe in some cases this is correct. In our case, my dd's coaches spend the majority of the time in the gym working on strength, conditioning and flexibility. They only spend about 14 minutes on power tumbling. I have watched how they work and I trust them. I don't understand about "throwing"?? not sure what that means. I can tell you that my little one would have done it with or without their help... she can not be forced into anything, but if she wants it, she figures it out. She has her basics and they teach them to do everything correctly. The coaches require certain skills before they even approach more difficult ones, Strong long hang pullover straight legs and then forward, then repeat
5 times , and then be able to hold L for 10 seconds, hold with legs up for 10 seconds and then hold upside down for 10 seconds. this is just one example of their requirements... My dd is probably a little strong naturally ( i believe some are born this way) + for whatever reason on top of her gym time she trains herself at home - without even realizing it... she has made a game of how many handstands she can do in a push up position and many other things that I laugh at because she just does not realize she is working , she even taught herself her press to handstand, straight arms from a straddle L. I think this takes some strength and control right?

I am sure your girls are all very talented, but too much time can sometimes hurt as much as not enough time I would think... and being a new program
perhaps you don't know the long term effects of your situation either... as a parent you always pray you make the right decisions for your little ones. I am learning and I really got a chance to vent here yesterday which was wonderful - this is a really great board I do worry sometimes becaiuse I know so little about the sport, but I am learning as we go and as long as my little one is happy, then we are good

I did speak to the coaches yesterday and said no to the privates and they were very understanding... Right now she is excited to get to the gym and I want it to stay that way.

Thanks to all who responded... every child IS a case by case.... but opinions - all of them - do matter and it all just helps make better informed decisions.

 

[Megley]

Littlegymchampsmom, it sounds like your daughter is doing great, is in a good program and is extremely talented. If she can do a straight arm straddle press from L that is fantastic. My daughter is only a month younger and is close to her straddle press but has to bend her arms to get up and she doesn't make it every time. I've been told by her coaches that even this is very good for a 5yo so your daughter sounds truly amazing. Obviously your daughter has a ton of natural strength and is working on improving that strength (my dd does this strength stuff at home too - bizarrely, she LOVES it). From your original post, I think there is nothing wrong with working back walkovers on beam. Our preteam does this too for those kids flexible enough to try them and if they are well spotted, I can't see anything dangerous in this. They are also, of course, working on handstands and cartwheels. It sounded like possibly they were having your daughter do giants? That is the only skill that I can see might be too advanced for this stage since I don't that even comes into play until Level 7. Since your daughter is training for Level 5, I would imagine that they are working on Level 5 and Level 6 skills (which would include the back walkover). Anyway, it sounds like you are in a good program and have a super talented gymnast. I look forward to hearing more about how she does once she actually starts competing.

 

[littlegymchampsmom]

Hey Megley

It is so nice to hear from you... it sounds like our girls are on the right track. My dd originally started her straddle press with bent arms but just time and repetition has worked it out and she can now hold for 5 or 6 sec and then control herself back down - well most of the time.... still always in progress. I think it is funny how they obsess about something and then work on it until they get it.... maybe we will have a couple of TOPS girls!! I am so excited that your dd is so close to perfecting as well. I have been wondering/trying to find other 5 year olds that can do that. It is an exceptional ability IMO... because not everyone can do it. When they love to work hard bottom line is that you know they love it... and that is the biggest joy of all. Please KIT about your daughter as she will began to compete this year right? best to you

 

[Megley]

Actually she won't compete until January of next year because our competitive season runs from January through May. They will move her to 12 hours a week with the new Level 4s once the state meet is over (occurs mid-May). Right now she is only going 6 hours a week. You are right about the obsession - the straddle press is Lily's new obsession. For awhile it was handstands - now it's this. She practices it every single day so hopefully it will improve soon. She isn't very good at straddling down yet but I'm sure that will come with time. I have heard of TOPS but am not entirely sure what it entails. I understand they have to be 7 to be tested so I guess they have some time to work on getting stronger and more flexible!

 

[LasswadeCoach]

I agree JBS, bvut we are extremely careful in what our gymnasts train, you must take into account they get 3 hour breaks every day, and much time is also spent on gentle stretching. None of our gymnasts have had any injuries what so ever so far.

and ok littlegymchampion, your daughter is doing reasonable at one straddle press, it doesnt require much strength, my girls at 6 can do 25 on the beam with no stops

I disagree with the theory that great conditioning can come from little hours, if muscles aren't continuously trained they can tighten back up again

 

[bpatient]

LasswadeCoach wrote: "I coach in the UK, and my 6&7 year olds attend my national gymnastics school, and train 40 hours a week."

Since no child can reasonably be expected to make a meaningful career choice at that age, I'd be interested in what the parents of those little girls expect their daughters to do in the future.

I had the occasion to think about this in the context of my own life with my daughter, a fourth-grader who is competing at Level 7 in the USA Gymnastics Junior Olympic scheme. She recently returned from an injury that had kept her sidelined since the summer to announce, "I was really worried, but I'm getting strong again; I think I can still go to the Olympics!" I know that I could have simply smiled, but for some reason I looked across the breakfast table and leveled with her: "Sweetie, we're very glad that you're so happy and that you're healthy and strong, but you should know that there are lots of little girls in Texas who have been training 20 or 30 hours a week since they were tiny. Some of the girls who want to go to the Olympics don't really go to school like you." She thought for a moment before she said, "While, I'll just be the best I can be at gymnastics, but I think that school is more important." A few months later she sat at that same table and gave me the look that says that she wants to tell me something important. "I'm not sure that I want to do gymnastics in college," she said. "I want to be a doctor like you and Mama, and I think I'll have to spend too much time studying to work out."

Just like those parents who take pride in what their 6 year-olds can accomplish with 40 hours of training a week, I'm glad that my daughter is making progress on the path that I helped her to choose at a young age. I can see where that path might take her, and it's unlikely that injury will keep her from achieving her goal. However, I really don't understand what the parents of your young students can expect for their kids. What do they tell you--and what do you tell them?

 

[JBS]

Just something to read::reading:

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Be careful...know your children...watch for injuries. It is possible to train many hours and be fine...it is also possible to train few hours and be fine. Both ways can injure you, too. Who's right and who's wrong...don't know???

Less Stress...More Reps. (I think that's Tumbl Trak's motto)