WAG Intervene with mean girl issue?

[Midwestmommy]

Oh, I will also add that one of these girls behaving terribly to other kids (stealing, really whacky stuff)—her mom’s “theme “ was that she is a victim of bullying in multiple schools, is special and therefore hard to relate to her peers. When others excluded her because she was mean, really mean, to them..that reinforced the mom’s theme of her kid as a victim. It’s complicated, and a better culture up front might have helped all involved and the program..

 

[duyetanh]

Best to let the coaches deal with it, keeps everyone out of it. We have a rule with the kids, (not that we still don't have issues, that will always happen) it's "YOU ARE NOT ALLOWED TO NOT GET ALONG". yes it's a double negative.

I think this is an awesome rule, and my kid's gym is the same. But I think (correct me if I have this wrong OP) this stuff is happening outside the gym, via cyber bullying. Because I value your opinion, i would like to know what you think...would you want your girls to tell you about this happening, even though it isnt happening at the gym?

 

[Deleted member 14190]

The intention behind this is excellent. Be aware though that some mean girls are adept at flying under the radar of adults. My opinion is that most teachers and coaches are clueless about bullying, and indeed their “favorites” occasionally can be the worst offenders.

Think of it from one of those kids who is being targeted. They see this sign, they perceive the bully and/or their parents as fav’s of the coaches, and they think “things are already bad enough for me, if I speak up I will be perceived as a troublemaker.”

I know a real life example where in a program (not gymnastics or a sport)... two kids were horrible to the other kids. All the kids were told they were expected to be professional and get along. The mom of one of these kids ingratiated herself to the staff to the point where it was nauseating to other parents. Eventually it got so toxic that kids started leaving in large numbers... when it all came out, the staff were shocked that none of the kids or their parents came forward because of fear that their kid would be blamed somehow and would have their kids’ opportunities limited.

Also, I have seen a couple coaches in my day who are bullies themselves, and whose misguided policies of having favorites and fomenting competition in a mean-spirited way created a toxic culture.

They key to preventing bullying is creating a culture at the outset where it is considered bad behavior by the group, this takes some up front time and work and strong leadership by the adults. There are plenty of resources on bullying prevention for the classroom which would work in a gym.. I think it would pay off by creating a healthier supportive environment, Staying “out of it” is just sticking your head in the sand. Work needs to be done on creating the right culture up front and reinforcing that culture before bullying becomes a big issue.

An experienced teacher,coach is definitely not clueless about girls being mean. This is an age old problem. The problem you describe is the exact same outcome when it comes to parents because.... drum roll.... your kid is after all your Favorite! Believe me, trying to tell a parent that his her child is a bully is almost comical at this point in my career. So I usually don't even bother. I have seen parents get into huge fights over this and no one wins and the kids lose. This is replayed year after year, and I have very rarely encounter a parent who was like "oh yea my kid is a bully". In fact the biggest problem kids usually have the most defensive parents. So my point is... Parents are not equipped to deal with this and will only make it worse, most are incapable of accepting that Suzie is actually a brat to the other kids. Attention parents, if your kids are in a group of 8 you have a 1 in 8 chance that the offending child is yours, not a zero chance. If everyone took the time to talk to their own children to make sure they are kind to others, again and again and again (you know... parenting) the problem would be lessened. But yes, there are definitely some programs that actually let this behavior run wild, I have seen it first hand, in person, on social media and on video etc....

 

[Deleted member 14190]

I think this is an awesome rule, and my kid's gym is the same. But I think (correct me if I have this wrong OP) this stuff is happening outside the gym, via cyber bullying. Because I value your opinion, i would like to know what you think...would you want your girls to tell you about this happening, even though it isnt happening at the gym?

Absolutely, if our kids are being mean to each other via text or insta, it's the same. The problem seems to come up each year with a new group and we do our best to squash it. Some girls are just mean!

 

[duyetanh]

Absolutely, if our kids are being mean to each other via text or insta, it's the same. The problem seems to come up each year with a new group and we do our best to squash it. Some girls are just mean!

Excellent. Thanks. Glad we arent having this issue over here!

 

[mommyof1]

This is replayed year after year, and I have very rarely encounter a parent who was like "oh yea my kid is a bully". In fact the biggest problem kids usually have the most defensive parents. So my point is... Parents are not equipped to deal with this and will only make it worse, most are incapable of accepting that Suzie is actually a brat to the other kids. Attention parents, if your kids are in a group of 8 you have a 1 in 8 chance that the offending child is yours, not a zero chance. If everyone took the time to talk to their own children to make sure they are kind to others, again and again and again (you know... parenting) the problem would be lessened.

I wouldn't totally give up on telling parents when their kids are the offenders, especially if a normally well-behaved child is suddenly engaging in uncharacteristic mean-girl behaviors. I once got a call from the school about something my child had done (a case of two wrongs not making a right, where she was the one committing the second wrong), and although my child came home in tears and immediately confessed the whole thing I very much appreciated the fact that the school notified me and provided an adult perspective on the entire incident. We parents are your partners in this--engage us!

 

[Texasmomof3]

I highly respect coachp, but I disagree about bringing stuff from outside the gym into gym.

There is a girl on my daughter's team who does the mean stuff on social media -- the typical name calling, talking bad about people, childish stuff. I would never bring this to a coach and try to make the coaches police the behavior of another girl. I mentioned it once to the offending girl's mom, in a very low key I-know-kids-can-push-boundaries-as-they-grow-up-but-you-might-want-to-look-at-some-of-this-stuff way, and of course she went all mama bear and claimed her daughter was the victim. So, my solution is my dd blocks the mean girl on all social media and does not socialize with her outside gym, but is kind to her at gym. How would telling the coach help? I'm not going to have a coach tell me my dd must engage someone outside gym, and our solution works for us.

I'm also thinking specifically of a teammate who spent the night at my house a couple of times for group get together. She ended up stealing from my dd. We actually caught her; this isn't conjecture. That child is not invited back to our house, but I would never go to the gym and accuse another child of being a thief. It didn't happen at the gym, and I think it would be wrong for my dd to tell everyone at gym about it. I think even such an accusation at gym would create drama for everyone. I have never told another parent and I told my dd that if anyone ever asks why this child isn't at any future sleepovers at our house, just to say she was busy. I'm not sure the value in telling the coach that both girls share and have to trust?

 

[Deleted member 14190]

I highly respect coachp, but I disagree about bringing stuff from outside the gym into gym.

There is a girl on my daughter's team who does the mean stuff on social media -- the typical name calling, talking bad about people, childish stuff. I would never bring this to a coach and try to make the coaches police the behavior of another girl. I mentioned it once to the offending girl's mom, in a very low key I-know-kids-can-push-boundaries-as-they-grow-up-but-you-might-want-to-look-at-some-of-this-stuff way, and of course she went all mama bear and claimed her daughter was the victim. So, my solution is my dd blocks the mean girl on all social media and does not socialize with her outside gym, but is kind to her at gym. How would telling the coach help? I'm not going to have a coach tell me my dd must engage someone outside gym, and our solution works for us.

I'm also thinking specifically of a teammate who spent the night at my house a couple of times for group get together. She ended up stealing from my dd. We actually caught her; this isn't conjecture. That child is not invited back to our house, but I would never go to the gym and accuse another child of being a thief. It didn't happen at the gym, and I think it would be wrong for my dd to tell everyone at gym about it. I think even such an accusation at gym would create drama for everyone. I have never told another parent and I told my dd that if anyone ever asks why this child isn't at any future sleepovers at our house, just to say she was busy. I'm not sure the value in telling the coach that both girls share and have to trust?

A teammate is a teammate both on and off the field . The end ....

 

[Deleted member 14190]

I highly respect coachp, but I disagree about bringing stuff from outside the gym into gym.

There is a girl on my daughter's team who does the mean stuff on social media -- the typical name calling, talking bad about people, childish stuff. I would never bring this to a coach and try to make the coaches police the behavior of another girl. I mentioned it once to the offending girl's mom, in a very low key I-know-kids-can-push-boundaries-as-they-grow-up-but-you-might-want-to-look-at-some-of-this-stuff way, and of course she went all mama bear and claimed her daughter was the victim. So, my solution is my dd blocks the mean girl on all social media and does not socialize with her outside gym, but is kind to her at gym. How would telling the coach help? I'm not going to have a coach tell me my dd must engage someone outside gym, and our solution works for us.

I'm also thinking specifically of a teammate who spent the night at my house a couple of times for group get together. She ended up stealing from my dd. We actually caught her; this isn't conjecture. That child is not invited back to our house, but I would never go to the gym and accuse another child of being a thief. It didn't happen at the gym, and I think it would be wrong for my dd to tell everyone at gym about it. I think even such an accusation at gym would create drama for everyone. I have never told another parent and I told my dd that if anyone ever asks why this child isn't at any future sleepovers at our house, just to say she was busy. I'm not sure the value in telling the coach that both girls share and have to trust?

I will also add that inviting everyone to a sleepover except this kid is not going to go well. You are creating the same problem in the team.....

 

[Texasmomof3]

So what would you do as the coach in the case of a team where someone tells you one girl is a thief and a mean girl online (same girl)? The girl denies it, but the parents say they say it first hand and whether it happened is not up for debate?

As a mom, it is not up for debate that my dd be required to be her friend or engage with her online or invite her back for birthday parties, etc.

 

[Texasmomof3]

And i take issue with you saying the child who was stolen from is the one causing problems by not welcoming the thief and bully in her home. Talk about a skewed view of things.

The thief is the only one to blame if she is excluded, as her behavior caused the exclusion. Natural consequences.

 

[Deleted member 14190]

So what would you do as the coach in the case of a team where someone tells you one girl is a thief and a mean girl online (same girl)? The girl denies it, but the parents say they say it first hand and whether it happened is not up for debate?

As a mom, it is not up for debate that my dd be required to be her friend or engage with her online or invite her back for birthday parties, etc.

Theft is an issue that cannot be handled unless the kid is caught red handed. So I do not engage in that. But being mean in social media is easy. Just send me a screen shot of it and I am on it.

 

[Deleted member 14190]

Your post was a little unclear also. Did you say that the thief parents admitted to it? If so then yes I would agree with not inviting her. But if it's just suspected then good luck with that

 

[twinmomma]

Our coach always wants to know if there's an issue, because it WILL bleed into the gym. Period, end of story.

 

[Redford]

Texasmomof3: Because bullying can and in most cases will leak into the teams behavior during practice, where the coach is expected to deal with it.

Fact is: Neither the coach nor the parents can do it on their own. The coach has no authority whatsoever over the childrens social media whereas the parents can't possibly do anything about the team athmosphere. In many cases the school is probably another part of the bigger picture. Which is why I think all parties have to pull on one string for this. It's not easy mind you (at university we have entire seminars on how to speak with parents and for good reason) but well worth it.
To be honest up to this day the handling of bullying in all kinds of institutions is suboptimal to put it nicely. A lot of poeple still view it as an unavoidable evil, just as a bad thunderstorm or an earthquake. It's a force of nature, it just happens and we'll deal with the consequences when it does. Or maybe not at all in case it didn't hit us...
Something has to change in our approach to the problem and I think hopping into one boat would be a huge step into the right direction.

 

[Deleted member 14190]

Texasmomof3: Because bullying can and in most cases will leak into the teams behavior during practice, where the coach is expected to deal with it.

Fact is: Neither the coach nor the parents can do it on their own. The coach has no authority whatsoever over the childrens social media whereas the parents can't possibly do anything about the team athmosphere. In many cases the school is probably another part of the bigger picture. Which is why I think all parties have to pull on one string for this. It's not easy mind you (at university we have entire seminars on how to speak with parents and for good reason) but well worth it.
To be honest up to this day the handling of bullying in all kinds of institutions is suboptimal to put it nicely. A lot of poeple still view it as an unavoidable evil, just as a bad thunderstorm or an earthquake. It's a force of nature, it just happens and we'll deal with the consequences when it does. Or maybe not at all in case it didn't hit us...
Something has to change in our approach to the problem and I think hopping into one boat would be a huge step into the right direction.

double post

 

[Deleted member 14190]

Texasmomof3: Because bullying can and in most cases will leak into the teams behavior during practice, where the coach is expected to deal with it.

Fact is: Neither the coach nor the parents can do it on their own. The coach has no authority whatsoever over the childrens social media whereas the parents can't possibly do anything about the team athmosphere. In many cases the school is probably another part of the bigger picture. Which is why I think all parties have to pull on one string for this. It's not easy mind you (at university we have entire seminars on how to speak with parents and for good reason) but well worth it.
To be honest up to this day the handling of bullying in all kinds of institutions is suboptimal to put it nicely. A lot of poeple still view it as an unavoidable evil, just as a bad thunderstorm or an earthquake. It's a force of nature, it just happens and we'll deal with the consequences when it does. Or maybe not at all in case it didn't hit us...
Something has to change in our approach to the problem and I think hopping into one boat would be a huge step into the right direction.

I agree with much of what you said., but as a coach I absolutely have the authority to discharge a child from team for inappropriate social media comments made towards teammates. Please no offense , but I think people really don't understand the concept of being part of a team.

 

[suebee]

Theft is an issue that cannot be handled unless the kid is caught red handed. So I do not engage in that. But being mean in social media is easy. Just send me a screen shot of it and I am on it.

She said the kid was caught red-handed.

 

[Midwestmommy]

Again, the most important thing a gym can do in this regard is establishing a culture to prevent bullying.

Just like many bad things that happen, I prefer to prevent a fire rather than counting on the extinguisher.

There are many things classrooms and gyms can do up front to create a culture where bullying behavior “is not cool” in the peer group which is more effective than punishing a bad apple or a good kid being a “follower” of a bad apple. Not everyone has to be best friends, but it is possible to create an atmosphere where it is less likely to happen, or in the case of a bad apple the other teammates help be part of the solution instead of contributing to the problem.
Let parents know the culture and expectations as well. I’ve seen it on paper everywhere, but it only works when the coaches actually mean it. You coaches have a lot more power and influence within those four walls than you know, use it to help these kids grow up to be decent humans and supportive teammates.

This takes an adult who is a leader, cares about each kid, and is willing to invest a little time and learning to create a healthy supportive culture that is a safe harbor and outside stressors are left at the door.

 

[Redford]

coachp: Sure you do but that's the last resort isn't it?
There has to be some problem solving going on in between someone making nasty comments and throwing her off the team.

Midwestmommy: Would like to like that several times. Agreed on every aspect, but as I mentioned above, it's hard work since a lot of outside factors contribute to the behavior and envoirment inside the gym.