WAG Kip cast for the older/taller girl

[Kcanflip]

My DD is an 11 1/2 year old gymmie who is struggling getting a cast of any sort out of her kip. Is this something that could be related to her being older already or being height related? She's actually average height for her age at 4 ft 9, but 3 of those inches have come very recently. She is also not struggling with weight...she's pretty average to maybe a bit skinnier than average. Is this just something that is going to take time? Or is there a quicker fix for this? I'm sure a video would help, but alas, I don't have one. Just tossing this out there. And yes, I will leave it to her coaches as I am sure they are working it with her and likely just as frustrated with her not getting this as I am. I tend to see her as a bit stubborn and one who tends to do the same thing over and over and not one that implements corrections easily or quickly. Not sure if she just struggles with impelmenting or if she thinks she is doing what is asked...who knows. Anyway, just asking as a concerned parent who is afraid her 11 year old is going to top out at level 4 if she can't figure this out! We are kind of on the fence about the direction her gymnastics is going to take (what path) but regardless, even if we move to Xcel she needs this skill to progress on bars!

 

[MILgymFAM]

I am not sure if it relates to age or height but I can say my DD is 13 and 5'5 and bars has always been her easiest event- she learned her kip in a week and her long hang kip in another. She does kip cast easily. On the other hand she really struggles on floor. I just think the girls all have their strong suits and their struggles. The kip is a common one.

 

[GymnastMomX2]

My DD is the exact same age/height and also struggling with casting out of a kip. She can occasionally hit handstand with a straddle cast without the kip, but with the kip she's lucky if she's barely above horizontal. She is actually competing 6 (first meet in a week) even without the cast, but she and her coaches are frustrated. The weird thing is she already had Giants on a single rail by herself, she just can't kip cast into them lol. Edited to add that up until now bars has always been her best event, 9.975 level 3, 9.75s level 4. So I think that makes it extra frustrating that she's hit a wall. I figure they will get it eventually.

 

[flips123]

Not being able to do any sort of cast out of it makes it sound like she's not finishing the kip with her shoulders over the bar, which is a problem I've had for a very long time. Casts are very hard when your body is fighting the power of the kip by finishing leaning backwards. It's very frustrating because I know what I am doing wrong, but I am too scared to do what I need to do in order to fix it. Best of luck to your gymmie on figuring it out

 

[Kcanflip]

Not being able to do any sort of cast out of it makes it sound like she's not finishing the kip with her shoulders over the bar, which is a problem I've had for a very long time. Casts are very hard when your body is fighting the power of the kip by finishing leaning backwards. It's very frustrating because I know what I am doing wrong, but I am too scared to do what I need to do in order to fix it. Best of luck to your gymmie on figuring it out

Yep, I do think that is a big part of the issue. What is risk/fear involved in getting shoulders over the bars more? It seems as if you would almost just front hip circle over the bar if you leaned to far.

She also seems to really struggle with heal drive. Isn't fast at all in this respect, so she struggles with the FHS vault too. Is this a 'slow twitch' muscle thing?

 

[Sari]

Yep, I do think that is a big part of the issue. What is risk/fear involved in getting shoulders over the bars more? It seems as if you would almost just front hip circle over the bar if you leaned to far.

In a front hip circle, your hips are touching the bar. During a cast, not so much.
There are a lot of scenarios gymnasts could be afraid of. Most commonly, in my (humble and limited) experience, of their hands slipping off the bar and them falling flat on their face or crashing onto the bar.

Anyway. Yes, this is frustrating. But the cast will come in time as long as she keeps working on it!

 

[flips123]

In a front hip circle, your hips are touching the bar. During a cast, not so much.
There are a lot of scenarios gymnasts could be afraid of. Most commonly, in my (humble and limited) experience, of their hands slipping off the bar and them falling flat on their face or crashing onto the bar.

Anyway. Yes, this is frustrating. But the cast will come in time as long as she keeps working on it!

Precisely. I've gone face first over the bar one too many times :/ It has left me with some nice bruises on my thighs and a great fear of putting my shoulders over and my butt up.

 

[Quadqueen]

I would say it could be related to fast growth, in terms of "adjusting to her body," if she had the skill before and doesn't have it now. But if that's not the case, and she never had the skill, I would say height is not a factor. 4'9" is not really the height where many gymnasts run into trouble because of their height on bars. Tack on 6 inches or more and things often get tricky for many girls.

 

[Deleted member 17723]

I'm a tall gymnast-around 5 foot 4 inches. Give or take a little. A kip cast is a bit harder for me than my little teammates, but I can do it. I don't think it is fear, I think she needs to finish with her shoulders over the bar. If she isn't, have her do BOTH pike AND straddle glides. I straddle glide because I am taller, but piking works some more muscle. Good luck!

 

[coachmolly]

I have a group of girls, most who learned kips in the last few months, who are struggling with casting out of their kips. I think a large part of it is that it is just part of the process of learning a kip. There are some kids that learn a technically correct kip from the start and can cast out of it with no problems, but I think a fair number of kids, at least in my experiences, spend quite a bit of time getting the kip to the point where they can successfully cast out of it. And I've seen this problem across the board- 7/8 year old tiny kiddos all the way up to high schoolers. So I don't think height is the problem, more often it's finishing the kip with toes behind the bar in stead of slightly in front of shoulders not leaning forward.
This is a pretty good video, not to offer coaching tips to your DD, but to show the angles needed to get a nice cast out of a kip.

 

[Deleted member D3987]

conditioning. that's how the girl above got there. NOT from practicing what you see.

 

[wgymmom]

4'9 is not tall for an 11.5 year old! That's how tall DD is, and she's the shortest girl by far at her level.

 

[Kcanflip]

Thanks all! Loved the responses and the video which l will share with her. I wasn't at her practice but she said she was making progress tonight. Hoping she truly is.