Martha Conference Call

[raenndrops]

By that logic so does Laurie with a hit routine. She and Gabby each have a 6.5 start value with a hit routine. I think a lot of people here are assuming Martha is going with the 4 strongest bar workers meaning Simone, Laurie and Gabby are vying for the AA, however there's a better chance Martha goes with reputation and past results and puts Aly in the AA over Laurie.

And this is where I start to take issue. I don't think you get to use the strongest bar workers, most medals argument to put Gabby in the lineup, but then sit Laurie in favor of Aly when Laurie is superior to Aly on bars even on an off day. This is where to quote Daggett "the sport loses fans." We see an argument used to justify one thing for one athlete, then the opposite thing done in favor of a different athlete? Am I making sense here?

I sit Aly out of Bars… I sit Madison out of Vault.
That means Simone, Laurie, and Gabby compete AA (given that Marta said she is competing Gabby AA)… otherwise, Gabby could sit out either Beam or Floor. But I understand wanting her to "get back on the horse" that bucked her too.

 

[emilykatherine]

That's ridiculous.

 

[Deleted member 18037]

This whole thing fascinates me because this really is about how folks expectations or how they think it should be vs how it really actually is, in gymnastics, that is.

And I don't follow the men's side as closely never have even before I had a daughter, never mind a gymmie daughter. And my daughter is interested in all sports, especially football. She would like to coach in the NFL some day........

So most Olympic trials are an any given Sunday type thing. We watched track and field qualifiers and one guy considered a shoe in had a terrible terrible race. Wasn't even close to top 3. No Olympics for him. He pretty much was first place finisher all year, except that race. Their trials are sudden death, top three take all.

And silly me, years ago, before kid, thought ALL sports worked that way. Come to find out, umm not woman's gymnastics. I had to readjust my expectation of how its done.

So to say the ladies should compete. Well they have been. But it is just not an any given Sunday, competition. The powers that be, read as Marta. Has been watching and comparing and judging all along. And that is where they (she), is coming from. And their (her) focus is what is best for the US team. The girls have been and are being evaluated constantly............. there is just not one meet to settle it.

 

[Sasha]

This whole thing fascinates me because this really is about how folks expectations or how they think it should be vs how it really actually is, in gymnastics, that is.

And I don't follow the men's side as closely never have even before I had a daughter, never mind a gymmie daughter. And my daughter is interested in all sports, especially football. She would like to coach in the NFL some day........

So most Olympic trials are an any given Sunday type thing. We watched track and field qualifiers and one guy considered a shoe in had a terrible terrible race. Wasn't even close to top 3. No Olympics for him. He pretty much was first place finisher all year, except that race. Their trials are sudden death, top three take all.

And silly me, years ago, before kid, thought ALL sports worked that way. Come to find out, umm not woman's gymnastics. I had to readjust my expectation of how its done.

So to say the ladies should compete. Well they have been. But it is just not an any given Sunday, competition. The powers that be, read as Marta. Has been watching and comparing and judging all along. And that is where they (she), is coming from. And their (her) focus is what is best for the US team. The girls have been and are being evaluated constantly............. there is just not one meet to settle it.

Timely example of USA Track qualification.... our best hurdler, who just broke a long-standing world record, won't be in Rio...
Link Removed

 

[profmom]

Here's my prediction of the likeliest outcomes from most to least likely for AA and bars, assuming for each that the person competes the necessary event(s) in qualifications:

Biles gold AA
Kocian medals on bars
Raisman silver AA
Hernandez silver AA
Douglas silver AA
Douglas medals on bars
Hernandez medals on bars

That is why I'd prefer Raisman having the AA shot, though if Raisman does not compete AA in quals, Hernandez has a very decent chance at an AA silver medal.

That being said, I can see Martha putting Douglas up AA because a hit bars routine from her does a lot more for the team in quals than a hit routine from Raisman and more importantly they will want Douglas doing bars in team finals. Douglas is needed as the fourth beam and floor routine in quals and probably the third vault, so that adds up to four events for her. Both Raisman and Douglas are professionals and will deal just fine with whatever decision is made.

On the men's side, I think the big question is whether they let Leyva have a chance at AA or just stick with Brooks and Mikulak. I think they do not put Leyva up on FX or rings in quals, but I guess it all depends on how he's training. At his best, he is very, very good. I just hope the man can hit his pommel set twice (three times if he competes AA and makes the AA final)!!

 

[Deleted member 18037]

Timely example of USA Track qualification.... our best hurdler, who just broke a long-standing world record, won't be in Rio...
Link Removed

I'm thinking that was it. I do remember watching hurdles that night as well as some sprints, I was in and out of the room though.

 

[CoachMeg]

What will happen, will happen. We have no idea what's going on behind closed doors and inside the ranch. We have no idea of the little injuries that USAG wants to keep hush-hush. We also have no idea how these girls are dealing with the pressure of making the Olympic team. Perhaps Gabby is blossoming, and knowing now that she IS going to Rio has sent her confidence through the roof. The truth is we really just don't know. I know it's hard for some of us as we've watched most of these girls for 4 years (some even longer). We've grown attached and want our favorites to go out and win.

We can sit here and argue all day who the most consistent is/who's in the most tip-top shape/who's mentality is the most in check....but the truth is we really don't know. Any of them could go up to do AA in the qualifications. They ALL (key word, ALL) deserve it. Don't even argue with me on that. The real enemy should not be another All-Arounder (*cough* Gabby) taking a spot away from someone else, but the SYSTEM of taking only 2 from each country. Why not take the top 20 that competed AA in quals, regardless of what country they're from. I mean that's TRULY the best in the world competing against each other.

Anyway, no matter what happens....Go Team USA!!

 

[profmom]

It just makes me so sad to think about 2020. This is bad enough. And as awful as it is for the women, I think it's even worse for the men because they have six events to cover with only four guys. I know the intent is to make more space for event specialists, but I don't think it's a good bargain.

Gym should have more slots at the Olympics.

 

[skschlag]

It just makes me so sad to think about 2020. This is bad enough. And as awful as it is for the women, I think it's even worse for the men because they have six events to cover with only four guys. I know the intent is to make more space for event specialists, but I don't think it's a good bargain.

Gym should have more slots at the Olympics.

LOL. I just realized (and yes I am slow) that with the 4 per team, and the 4 up in qualifying, all 4 of our athletes will have to be all arounders

 

[raenndrops]

LOL. I just realized (and yes I am slow) that with the 4 per team, and the 4 up in qualifying, all 4 of our athletes will have to be all arounders

But event specialists will be able to earn spots outside of team competition.

 

[WillWork4Flips]

Quite frankly as a former coach and gymnast and a middle school season on the track team I am happy gymnastics is NOT like track. gymnastics is not the type of sport that really exist in a vacuum! At one point some one can be doing well then within a month someone else is on top. That's just the way the sport works! For example gabby was 2nd at worlds Aly tried to compete AA at worlds and came in 5th (worlds is actually more similar to olympics then the Trials to be quite honest! Then Aly did great at us secret got gold, then Gabby rocked it out at the American cup got gold. Aly did great at trials and P&G, but honestly Gabby's work at worlds speaks for itself. Both girls have a lot to offer I really don't see how either one 'deserves it more' and if gabby has that beam on point and hasn't missed a routine at camp like Marta said then she should compete AA. AA just works in Gabby's favor, it's not deliberate or favoritism. Whoever mentioned that they should bench gabby on bars, I am just floored by the ignorance of the comment. She had 15.2 compared to Aly's 14.5! Why would we put someone who 'just wants to get through" something on bars our worst event. By sitting other girls out and letting Aly compete wouldn't that be the very essence of favoritism people complain about? However, some people don't have issues with that scenario? Why would we sabotage any point or points in quals even if we are the best, that is so disegenous and phony. If we were weak on floor and we had to pick a floor specialist along with Aly and gabby had to sit I could care less. Unfortunately, team USAs weakness is not in Aly favor and if it was the other way Marta would not bat an eyelash. It does suck because suck because Aly works hard, but not as hard as anyone else.

 

[profmom]

The argument for having Raisman do AA in quals is that she is either the second or third best AA female artistic gymnast in the world, depending on what you think of Hernandez's scores at Trials. It may not be a knockdown argument, but it's not one to be dismissed out of hand either. Martha has to decide whether that's enough of an argument to bump Douglas's higher scoring bars routine out of the qualifying round. My guess is that 1) Martha will go with the sure thing in quals by competing Douglas AA, 2) Hernandez will top Douglas in quals to advance to the AA final, and 3) all will be just fine.

 

[flowerchild]

I'm not as slick as some, so I couldn't post the link. Shamier Little is the women's world record holder in 400 m hurdles. Places 6 th in her semifinal race at Olympic Trials and didn't even make finals! This is a woman that hadn't lost a race in a few years! So - I think Track and Field is poss harder to qualify than gymnastics! Crazy!!!

 

[GymDad9.9]

I'm not as slick as some, so I couldn't post the link. Shamier Little is the women's world record holder in 400 m hurdles. Places 6 th in her semifinal race at Olympic Trials and didn't even make finals! This is a woman that hadn't lost a race in a few years! So - I think Track and Field is poss harder to qualify than gymnastics! Crazy!!!

Qualifying in track and field for the Olympics may be as simple as making the cut in the Trials only, and the rest of it be damned. Whether that is sound policy remains to be seen.

 

[WillWork4Flips]

Actually I beg to differ with 'best in the world' 3rd best that day at trials or 2nd best at P&G ITA. However gabby has the 2nd best in world title though. It goes back to that idea that gymnastics does not exist in a vacuum. The only person who deserves AA due to proven consistency coming in first is Simone. Whoever is bringing it or peaking right before the olympics gets it what is best for the team should always come first, and based on what they need for team does not fit into a great scenario for Aly. I'd love to see her compete AA,but logically at the moment it does not make sense.

 

[WillWork4Flips]

If gabby is on point like Marta stated, and is like she was at worlds it's possible Hernandez may not qualify for AA. love her, being a Jersey girl myself, perhaps she will, whoever does though I am really excited to watch. They are a plethora of talent and all worked hard.

 

[Gymmommy71]

Does Laurie have the potential to beat Aly on beam and floor? I honestly can't imagine her doing anything but bars in qualifications if not.

Simone - all events so she can qualify for beam, floor and vault EF and AA
Gabby - all events cause Marta said she's going to and so she can qualify for bars EF (and AA)
Aly - floor and beam for EF
Madison - bars for EF

All of the above will give us our 2 AAs (Simone and Gabby), 2 beam EF (Simone and Aly)
2 floor EF (Simone and Aly), 2 bars
EF (Madison and Gabby) and 1 vault EF (Simone - which is all well get anyway since we didn't bring Mckayla).

Leaves open - one slot on bars, one slot on beam, two slots on vault (Aly will get one for sure cause she has an amanar) and one slot on floor to be taken by people who are not expected to make EF for that event. These slots are basically just there to protect against others above making mistakes like falling (cause if the top 3 hit, the score will be dropped), but can also turn into opportunities/spoilers.

Whether or not Marta wants there to be spoilers when it comes to this stuff is a big question IMO. I always wonder if she had 2012 to do over again if she would still have put 3 girls in there for AA in qualifications. It all worked out, but that whole situation really could have hurt the team dynamic for TF. Not sure she'd take that risk again.

 

[Deleted member 18037]

I'm not as slick as some, so I couldn't post the link. Shamier Little is the women's world record holder in 400 m hurdles. Places 6 th in her semifinal race at Olympic Trials and didn't even make finals! This is a woman that hadn't lost a race in a few years! So - I think Track and Field is poss harder to qualify than gymnastics! Crazy!!!

And if they didn't base it on one weekend/one race, In essence any given Sunday, but rather like women's gymnastics she would probably be going to the Olympics.

Can't really say its harder though, its just different.

 

[Empowered]

Martha will have three vie for AA in qualifying. Not because one might not qualify, but because she'll want a backup in case of injury.

 

[cadybearsmommy]

Does Laurie have the potential to beat Aly on beam and floor? I honestly can't imagine her doing anything but bars in qualifications if not.

On floor, probably not but on beam absolutely Laurie's beam has been amazingly good here lately. No doubt she would qualify for beam finals and probably medal. She's just consistently good all around, I would hate to see her be left out of the AA. Her form is so on point and I think the international judges will really like her. She just has that charismatic quality to her routines that can't be taught. I don't want to see Aly be left out of the AA either and I would go with her over Gabby but it's not my choice and it is what it is. Too bad they can't all go for AA and may the best two move on to finals lol. Still many more things could happen before the olympics actually begin and and I'm guessing we won't know for sure who is competing AA until we actually see it.