WAG Mckayla Maroney/gymnastike

[happychaos]

Part of living in the real world is to stop pretending that any girl or woman with any kind of public presence can protect herself from this kind of garbage just by acting the right way, doing the right thing, or taking the right precautions. I agree wholeheartedly with the impulse that we should use this as a teachable moment, but what should we be teaching and to whom? If all we do is tell our daughters to be super duper extra careful and wary, we miss the point.

Teach your sons to respect women. Teach them to respect women's bodies and not to fetishize and commoditize them. Teach them not to take pictures without consent and not to share pictures without consent. Teach them that shaming any woman for the way she looks or dresses is wrong. Help them to see how awful this sort of thing is so that they will never do this to a woman, or to a man for that matter. And help them to have the courage to stand up to other men and say "this is wrong" when they see it happening. If we change our culture, we don't have to fear for our daughters so much.

I for one will not undermine all the wonderful things that gymnastics has done for my daughter in terms of her self image and perception of herself as strong by teaching her that she has to walk around in the world in fear because she walks around the world in a woman's body. I will teach her to respect herself and continue to be strong so that when someone tries to shame her or attack her (and it will happen, no matter how careful she is), she can respond appropriately, with all the strength and righteous fury that she can muster by believing herself to be entitled to equality.

I agree with you, except your last paragraph. Teaching your DD to be as safe as possible does not mean that you teach her to walk around in fear. I take reasonable precautions to keep myself safe, but I certainly do NOT walk around in fear, nor do I suffer from a lack of self-respect!

Teaching your daughter reasonable safety precautions does NOT mean that you are teaching her to be weak, unequal, or fearful. Righteous fury is great, but common sense precautions go a LONG way. No, you can never be 100% safe from crime, no matter what you do, but an ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure.

And, I can say the same for all of my girlfriends (and we will never be to old to stop calling ourselves girlfriends....). None of us live in fear. We expect equality. We respond with righteous fury when wronged. We STILL do what can to avoid being the victim of a crime.

I'd love to believe that teaching boys to respect girls will solve all these problems men make for us women But, remember what the "oldest profession in the world" is? Men have been praying on women as long as there have been men and women. I need to teach my DD to navigate these issues.

 

[Deleted member 14190]

Which brainless person at Gymnastike actually put a link to a nude photo!!!!! What were they trying to accomplish???? Can we start a thread titled, "Boycott Gymnastike" ?

 

[my4buffaloes]

Yes whoever posted the links to the photos should have been fired already. I have not nor will I go on gymnastike to see their responses to this.

 

[BachFlyer]

I agree with Profmom 100%.

Furthermore, I feel that even if the photos are real (and I'm not saying they are), she did absolutely nothing wrong in my mind. And neither did any other celebrity who's photos might have been real, and we have no business shaming them for it or gawking over it. I really don't see anything inherently wrong with it, for girls OR boys. I don't want my dds taking these sorts of pictures now, but it is more their maturity level that dictates how I feel about it at this moment, because they are just beginning down the road of understanding themselves in that way. But if they choose to do so when they are older, so what? I do agree that you have to protect yourself and sending/uploading/giving access to someone else opens it up for all to see, and this possibility is much worse than when we only had stills or video to contend with and not the viral power of the internet. But private photos for the sake of private photos? They fall into the territory of "to each their own" for me.

What IS undeniably wrong is the disgusting and illegal invasion of privacy in stealing the photos and making them publicly available, and I think we should focus on that.

 

[gymgymgymnast08]

I used to love going to the gym to workout. I was so excited when I turned 14 and was finally allowed to go up to the fitness center at the local Y by myself. Everything was great until I got older.

Once I hit 17, 18 I actually started looking like a woman because I am a woman! I used to go to the gym sometimes right after practice so I would be wearing a leotard and my spandex shorts and I would throw a tank top on right after. Unfortunately, a lot of the men at the gym would say very crude things to me especially if they recognized that the leotard meant I was a gymnast.

After that, I would make sure I changed before I went to the gym. I would just wear a t shirt and running shorts. Things got slightly better but I still don't enjoy going to the gym at peak hours.

Recently, I was running outside for about an hour. Within that hour, I got three very crude things shouted at me by three different groups of men. Later, I was telling some of my friends about it. The first question that every single person (male or female) asked was "What were you wearing?" I was wearing a loose t-shirt and running shorts. No spandex or anything.

Like some previous posters were saying, we females have to keep ourselves safe and do smart things so that nothing bad happens to us. I can see that I shouldn't wear just a sports bra and spandex when I go exercise, but what should I have to wear so that I don't have any guys saying crude things to me? Should I go workout in a knee length winter coat?

Back on topic, I feel very bad for McKayla and all the other celebrities involved. I have been semi-boycotting gymnastike ever since they made you start paying for stuff but I used to watch the occasionally video now and then. Now I will do a complete boycott.

 

[bogwoppit]

Which brainless person at Gymnastike actually put a link to a nude photo!!!!! What were they trying to accomplish???? Can we start a thread titled, "Boycott Gymnastike" ?

You sure can, I know of quite a few people who ditched their gold membership yesterday.

 

[Deleted member 14190]

Wow, i just read the response When asked to explain why Mikaylas post was still online, Joe Battaglia response was "Because we don't bury our heads in the sand on news just because the subject is uncomfortable." ..............................................
uh.... You sir are running a kids website and you apparently put up a link to nude photos.....

 

[bogwoppit]

Wow, i just read the response When asked to explain why Mikaylas post was still online, Joe Battaglia response was "Because we don't bury our heads in the sand on news just because the subject is uncomfortable." ..............................................
uh.... You sir are running a kids website and you apparently put up a link to nude photos.....

Exactly. Can you imagine us doing that and then defending it. Blew my mind that they did it in the first place, and then really blew my mind when it was defended.

They make a lot of money off our children's sport, and then exploit our children by linking to stolen nude photos in the name of journalism.

I suggest people close their gym doors to Gymnastike until they remove the offending people and apologise.

 

[Geoffrey Taucer]

Teach your sons to respect women. Teach them to respect women's bodies and not to fetishize and commoditize them. Teach them not to take pictures without consent and not to share pictures without consent. Teach them that shaming any woman for the way she looks or dresses is wrong. Help them to see how awful this sort of thing is so that they will never do this to a woman, or to a man for that matter. And help them to have the courage to stand up to other men and say "this is wrong" when they see it happening. If we change our culture, we don't have to fear for our daughters so much.

All of this is true.

But let's be honest here. How many would-be attackers or violators of privacy will, when told that it's wrong, respond by saying "well golly I guess I won't do it then"?

We tell people to lock their cars and not leave valuable items in them. Urging this precaution is not the same thing as blaming victims of car break-ins, nor does it remove blame from the criminals responsible.
We tell people to keep their PIN numbers secret. Urging this precaution is not the same thing as blaming victims of bank fraud, nor does it remove blame from the criminals responsible.
And we should tell kids in general and girls in particular not to take pictures of themselves they wouldn't want the whole world to see. Urging this precaution is not the same thing as blaming the victims, nor does it remove blame from the criminals responsible for stealing and spreading the pictures.

There are a lot of bad people in the world. Taking precautions against them is not the same as removing blame from them; it just means that we have to live in the real world.

I should be able to leave my car unlocked and leave my possessions in it without worrying, because I should be able to trust my fellow human beings to respect my property. I absolutely shouldn't have to worry about who has my bank information, because I should be able to trust my fellow human beings not to steal from me. And girls should be able to feel safe while walking alone at night and while taking pictures not intended for the general public to see, because they should be able to trust their fellow human beings to respect their privacy.

But that's not the world we live in.

 

[happychaos]

What I am waiting for is an apology for posting the link. I thought the article was fine, even though I am glad my DD didn't read it. We have the computer she uses totally locked down, except for the few dozen websites we have specifically allowed. If she had clicked on the link, it would not have allowed her go to that website anyway.

What I can't figure out is WHY Gymnastike has not apologized yet! From what I can tell, the link was only up for a very short amount of time. They removed the link very quickly, so they obviously realized it was a mistake. Why not make a formal apology?

I am curious now, as a few posters (Bog?) have mentioned other reasons for not liking Gymnastike. My DD and I love Gymnastike, (and we have the subscription), but I am wondering if it is a mistake. Does anyone want to share why (aside from this issue) they are so down on Gymnastike?

 

[wheezy]

It's so terrible that now they are talking about her lying about them being fake......PLEASE! this poor girl is 18 everybody! She is a baby!!!! wether they are real or not, isn't the issue!
I would probably deny it too! Now of course I would lie and say they are definitely me, but no one would care!!!
Poor thing, I hope her family is helping her through this. There are so many messed up people in the world.

 

[bogwoppit]

I am curious now, as a few posters (Bog?) have mentioned other reasons for not liking Gymnastike. My DD and I love Gymnastike, (and we have the subscription), but I am wondering if it is a mistake. Does anyone want to share why (aside from this issue) they are so down on Gymnastike?

Here is a link that explains why some people do not like gymnastike. It comes from the www.gymnasticscoaching.com blog that I love so much. It is the most balanced piece I can find. THere are lots of others out there, but this is about as good as it gets without going crazy either way.

http://gymnasticscoaching.com/new/2014/04/ncaa-championships-on-gymnastike/

In the end it is felt that gymnastike take content from the web, be it youtube or ESPN etc and package it up and then sell it through a "gold subscription" on their site. They rarely credit the source and often just help themselves to videos parents etc have put up there.

This bugs gym fans because content that has been free in the past now has become expensive and content that is sold as some of this turns out to be home movies from youtube.

 

[happychaos]

Here is a link that explains why some people do not like gymnastike. It comes from the www.gymnasticscoaching.com blog that I love so much. It is the most balanced piece I can find. THere are lots of others out there, but this is about as good as it gets without going crazy either way.

http://gymnasticscoaching.com/new/2014/04/ncaa-championships-on-gymnastike/

In the end it is felt that gymnastike take content from the web, be it youtube or ESPN etc and package it up and then sell it through a "gold subscription" on their site. They rarely credit the source and often just help themselves to videos parents etc have put up there.

This bugs gym fans because content that has been free in the past now has become expensive and content that is sold as thris turns out to be home movies from youtube.

Thanks Bog! Going to read it now.

 

[oplei]

Just adding my two cents..... This is a crime, these young women are victims. We can not protect our girls/boys from everything. We could take away all phone/camera privileges but that will eventually backfire, I agree we need to teach good choices. With technology today a creepo could take a picture of our child in a public place photoshop it into whatever they want and post it. Doesn't matter that our sons/daughters never took the picture or that anyone even knew the picture was taken. Despite having no knowledge he/she becomes a victim. However, I think that it is important to teach kids that if you are taking/sending/ receiving nude photos that #1 you are potentially committing a crime and #2 you are also making it easier for these pictures to be "out there". The example of locking your car doors is similar some people go through parking lots looking for random unlocked cars to burglarize. If you lock your doors you make it harder and lesson your chances of becoming the victim of a car burglary but if the burglar is targeting you and has a brick and your locked door isn't going to do much. Let's teach our kids to lock the doors and only have "grandma approved" photos to try to lessen the odds of becoming victimized.

 

[Terry]

All of this is true.

But let's be honest here. How many would-be attackers or violators of privacy will, when told that it's wrong, respond by saying "well golly I guess I won't do it then"?

We tell people to lock their cars and not leave valuable items in them. Urging this precaution is not the same thing as blaming victims of car break-ins, nor does it remove blame from the criminals responsible.
We tell people to keep their PIN numbers secret. Urging this precaution is not the same thing as blaming victims of bank fraud, nor does it remove blame from the criminals responsible.
And we should tell kids in general and girls in particular not to take pictures of themselves they wouldn't want the whole world to see. Urging this precaution is not the same thing as blaming the victims, nor does it remove blame from the criminals responsible for stealing and spreading the pictures.

There are a lot of bad people in the world. Taking precautions against them is not the same as removing blame from them; it just means that we have to live in the real world.

I should be able to leave my car unlocked and leave my possessions in it without worrying, because I should be able to trust my fellow human beings to respect my property. I absolutely shouldn't have to worry about who has my bank information, because I should be able to trust my fellow human beings not to steal from me. And girls should be able to feel safe while walking alone at night and while taking pictures not intended for the general public to see, because they should be able to trust their fellow human beings to respect their privacy.

But that's not the world we live in.

I appreciate very much what you are saying. And I agree with it.

I am going to go one step further and I hope I do not offend anyone by this. McKayla -- and all of the other women whose accounts were hacked into and stolen from -- were victims here. Period. I blame none of them for what happened.

But I do have concerns personally about young girls buying into the "I want to look like a sex kitten" culture. I do not think this is something we want to encourage our young athletes -- or any other young woman -- to do. That does NOT mean that I think that girls who pose in sexy pictures or wear low cut dresses etc etc are the cause of other people's criminal actions. They are not. But they are reinforcing stereotypes about women which i think are extremely unhealthy. Athletics does the opposite of that in my opinion. So I am dissappointed when I see athletic women doing it.

Do young girls have the right to dress that way and be safe from physical and verbal attack? of course. Does it provoke that kind of attack? I do not think so. But that does not mean that its a great way for girls to behave.

Just my opinion.

 

[gasrgoose]

What I am waiting for is an apology for posting the link. I thought the article was fine, even though I am glad my DD didn't read it. We have the computer she uses totally locked down, except for the few dozen websites we have specifically allowed. If she had clicked on the link, it would not have allowed her go to that website anyway.

What I can't figure out is WHY Gymnastike has not apologized yet! From what I can tell, the link was only up for a very short amount of time. They removed the link very quickly, so they obviously realized it was a mistake. Why not make a formal apology?

I am curious now, as a few posters (Bog?) have mentioned other reasons for not liking Gymnastike. My DD and I love Gymnastike, (and we have the subscription), but I am wondering if it is a mistake. Does anyone want to share why (aside from this issue) they are so down on Gymnastike?

I agree! We subscribed so my daughter could view the beyond the routine series. I think a sincere apology would go a long way to prevent people like us from cancelling our membership. But at this point and after the statement above how sincere would it be?

 

[gasrgoose]

Here is a link that explains why some people do not like gymnastike. It comes from the www.gymnasticscoaching.com blog that I love so much. It is the most balanced piece I can find. THere are lots of others out there, but this is about as good as it gets without going crazy either way.

http://gymnasticscoaching.com/new/2014/04/ncaa-championships-on-gymnastike/

In the end it is felt that gymnastike take content from the web, be it youtube or ESPN etc and package it up and then sell it through a "gold subscription" on their site. They rarely credit the source and often just help themselves to videos parents etc have put up there.

This bugs gym fans because content that has been free in the past now has become expensive and content that is sold as some of this turns out to be home movies from youtube.

That's interesting. We subscribed in the spring specifically for the beyond the routine series and the in gym content. They've been in our gym and filmed and seemed like great people. BUT this will make us consider cancelling. I'm going to wait and see how it plays out, though I'm not sure how they can fix it at this point.

 

[bogwoppit]

That's interesting. We subscribed in the spring specifically for the beyond the routine series and the in gym content. They've been in our gym and filmed and seemed like great people. BUT this will make us consider cancelling. I'm going to wait and see how it plays out, though I'm not sure how they can fix it at this point.

I think many of the individuals who go out for Gymnastike and film gym events, and in gyms, are wonderful people who love gymnastics. I have never heard a negative comment about those experiences.

Unfortunately the parent company is the one making these "legal" and "political" choices and that affects every employee, and reflects on them very poorly.

The parent company Flocast/Gymnastike needs to step up and deal with the mess they created if they want to save their name and those of the people who work for them.

 

[happychaos]

This is a good piece explaining cloud security and the "how" of the hack

http://www.wired.co.uk/news/archive/2014-09/02/j-law-cloud-security

 

[bogwoppit]

This is from Ingrid on gymscoop.com

"TMZ posted that McKayla now says that she was underage when those pictures were taken (meaning they are probably real, not fakes) and her attorneys are taking action against several sites that have posted them."

I did go to TMZ and a few other sites to check and this appears to be true.

Chances are this will not go away any time soon.