WAG Most Valuable Specialist, offshoot thread

[Deleted member 14190]

if she were in the SEC or at Utah, they'd be chanting "10,10, 10" , and she'd deserve it...how she doesn't get a 10 for this routine, when she hits it, baffles me..

1st glide was low, and did not hit her last H stand. just saying. other than that it was awesome.

 

[wandrewsjr]

Georgia Dabritz of Utah is a good recent example of a college gymnast good on both vault and bars. She competed a Yurchenko 1 1/2 before it was even needed to start from a 10, career 10's on both(and on floor too). She is also a good example of what Bookworm was talking about on beam. She was one of the best all-rounders in the country, but was at times left out of the team's beam lineup because of consistency. I would say beam is the event that has the largest pool of gymnasts in the country capable of competing an NCAA 10 start value set, but hitting that set consistently is another thing.

 

[bookworm]

1st glide was low, and did not hit her last H stand. just saying. other than that it was awesome.

And I did say "when she hits", but I've seen Gnat get a 10 with her vault and her legs are twisted in the air, and in Ohashi's first beam 10 this year, she leaned out of her series, so I think Price's routine is at least in those ballparks...

 

[tomtnt]

It's interesting that college bar is still relatively difficult skills (Paks, Shaposh, Toe-on Tkachev, E- dismounts) while Beam, Floor, and Vault are relatively waterdowned in comparison to elite/high level JO. For Vault, we are seeing fulls instead of 1 1/2 or doubles. Beam- no triple flights sequences. Floor- first pass is usually a double pike..

 

[bookworm]

It's interesting that college bar is still relatively difficult skills (Paks, Shaposh, Toe-on Tkachev, E- dismounts) while Beam, Floor, and Vault are relatively waterdowned in comparison to elite/high level JO. For Vault, we are seeing fulls instead of 1 1/2 or doubles. Beam- no triple flights sequences. Floor- first pass is usually a double pike..

*bars:I'd say that the reasoning for that is on bars it's pretty straight forward, you catch your release or you don't, and you can pretty much nail a dismount...so in terms of deductions, if you're a reliable bar worker, the risk is less to keep your big skills in college....
*Vault: 9.95 for a full with a good chance to stick your landing; 1 1/2: 10.0, blind landing, and with steps, likely to be more deductions than the delta in the SV....
*same with beam, unless you nail (and I mean no wobble, bend at the waist, lift your leg, windmilling your arms etc) the triple series 110% of the time, not worth the .5 deduction when you're on the ground after falling...the "bonus" of doing it isn't worth the risk of the fall/deductions , if it's not perfect.
*Floor...not a ton of regular JO kids have E passes like full ins or Arabians so not surprised that you don't see more in NCAA... they get to college at at least 18 yrs old so teaching those type of skills, while not unheard of, is more difficult to begin with...and again, the risk of not doing something clean isn't worth it in NCAA.

It all boils down to NCAA's big focus is clean and stuck and up to code...kind of like the "keep it simple stupid" philosophy for scoring well...and Oklahoma is a perfect example ..they are incredibly clean but I don't think they have many 10 SV vaults but they make up the difference in being clean on all 4 events and not giving away tenths in sloppiness.

 

[ayyyrial]

It's interesting that college bar is still relatively difficult skills (Paks, Shaposh, Toe-on Tkachev, E- dismounts) while Beam, Floor, and Vault are relatively waterdowned in comparison to elite/high level JO. For Vault, we are seeing fulls instead of 1 1/2 or doubles. Beam- no triple flights sequences. Floor- first pass is usually a double pike..

Well, a Pak, Shaposh, and Tkachev are all D skills, so it's pretty standard to have a few D skills in a college routine on any event. E.G. aerials on beam are also Ds, as are a lot of turning jumps on beam and a double back on floor. I think the big difference between NCAA and elite routines on bars is that winning routines in NCAA might have one or two "big" skills while elite routines are packed full of as much difficulty as possible. Which is true to an extent on every event...because NCAA is capped out at a 10.0 while elite goes as high as you can.

 

[tomtnt]

Well, a Pak, Shaposh, and Tkachev are all D skills, so it's pretty standard to have a few D skills in a college routine on any event. E.G. aerials on beam are also Ds, as are a lot of turning jumps on beam and a double back on floor. I think the big difference between NCAA and elite routines on bars is that winning routines in NCAA might have one or two "big" skills while elite routines are packed full of as much difficulty as possible. Which is true to an extent on every event...because NCAA is capped out at a 10.0 while elite goes as high as you can.

lol, that's true - I Guess I'm looking at it through my daughter's eyes. she has a big vault and big tumbling skills on floor and beam but not close to the corresponding difficult in bars skills..

 

[Deleted member 14190]

It's interesting that college bar is still relatively difficult skills (Paks, Shaposh, Toe-on Tkachev, E- dismounts) while Beam, Floor, and Vault are relatively waterdowned in comparison to elite/high level JO. For Vault, we are seeing fulls instead of 1 1/2 or doubles. Beam- no triple flights sequences. Floor- first pass is usually a double pike..

The requirements on bars have changed . You now need a single bar release (D or E). Or two D releases (shape to pak etc...) or any two E elements. So yes bars is a little more stacked , hence the need for swingers. Vault is also evolving in the same direction.

 

[Sasha]

Slight tangent question about college bars - is it true that the bars are "Set wider" for college competitions compared to "Fig" for elite competitions? If so, why is the Fig not so wide? And why is Fig one setting instead of letting people adjust it, like men adjust the pbars?

Curious about the rationale.

 

[Deleted member 14190]

Slight tangent question about college bars - is it true that the bars are "Set wider" for college competitions compared to "Fig" for elite competitions? If so, why is the Fig not so wide? And why is Fig one setting instead of letting people adjust it, like men adjust the pbars?

Curious about the rationale.

FIG is international , they are not a part of the NCAA, or American gymnastics. They do not allow different settings because they say so. One reason I was told is they do not want settings during competitions on any event because of appearances and coverage (tv) etc... there are a lot of politics involved as well.