WAG Recreating WAG

[raenndrops]

just take a year off? With all respect that's a horrible thought to kids coaches and parents. And yes I absolutely have had kids who scored 37 even 38 and were not ready (and knew it) for the next level.... happens for various reasons.

Not ready for the next level with 10.0 SV ... but mastered the previous level. Therefore compete with a lower SV... it wouldnt be a big deal because the gymnast wouldnt be the only one.

 

[MILgymFAM]

just take a year off? With all respect that's a horrible thought to kids coaches and parents. And yes I absolutely have had kids who scored 37 even 38 and were not ready (and knew it) for the next level.... happens for various reasons.

Why? What is so horrible about training a new level until you’re ready to compete it? We’ve had at least three gyms that allowed it for various reasons, so it’s not universally horrible to coaches or gymnasts. I’m not seeing the apocalyptic downside of continuing to train, pressure free, until you meet your gym’s requirements to compete a next level.

 

[mommyof1]

just take a year off? With all respect that's a horrible thought to kids coaches and parents. And yes I absolutely have had kids who scored 37 even 38 and were not ready (and knew it) for the next level.... happens for various reasons.

I would be delighted to have my kid take a year off from competition and just uptrain. But there are few things in life I dislike more than watching meets, so maybe that's just me.

 

[MILgymFAM]

Didnt you say you coached? And aren't you trying to win every argument here on CB? Lol.

I do not coach (nor would I). I am not trying to win an argument, as I see it as a discussion rather than a debate. It’s kinda in how you view things. I love to discuss things and go back and forth on perspective. Maybe you like the same thing but call it an argument. Semantics, I guess, but I love semantics.

I respond to it from an academic perspective- should competition be fair, what would make it more fair. My original post on this thread was merely about eliminating age groups (because I don’t see the point of them) and the majority of awards. I tend to respond when I feel questioned, or when I feel I have a perspective to add. I guess that is what we all do.

 

[Deleted member 18037]

just take a year off? With all respect that's a horrible thought to kids coaches and parents. And yes I absolutely have had kids who scored 37 even 38 and were not ready (and knew it) for the next level.... happens for various reasons.

They are not taking a year off. Taking a year off would be not going to gym for a year. They are not competing. These are not the same things. You still practice, work on rehabing an injury. You work on getting skills for the next level. You step back to deal with a block.

You are not taking a year off. And if fact the only thing you are doing is taking the pressure to compete off. Which could actually be a good thing.

 

[Deleted member 14190]

They are not taking a year off. Taking a year off would be not going to gym. They are not competing. These are not the same things.

Most kids like to compete or
Play the game. Season is what gets them through the endless hours of training . So forcing these kids to just take a year off is a free ticket to retirement for many.

 

[Deleted member 18037]

Most kids like to compete or
Play the game. Season is what gets them through the endless hours of training . So forcing these kids to just take a year off is a free ticket to retirement for many.

And kids not getting medals is retirement to many. And kids repeating a level is retirement to many.

Kids have different peaks, different points when they are done.

My experience is too many hours is perhaps the biggest reason for retirement for many.

 

[MILgymFAM]

Most kids like to compete or
Play the game. Season is what gets them through the endless hours of training . So forcing these kids to just take a year off is a free ticket to retirement for many.

Ok, I promise this will be my last response to you because I think you misunderstand my intent.

But could it be that you breed an environment that makes girls feel like that? That your style of coaching breeds a specific mindset? We have been in three states, ten gyms, and three separate programs (usaigc, Xcel, jo) and I’ve not met these uber competitive girls you speak of. Every girl we’ve met has loved practice completely on its own merits. I would wager that of all the gymnasts we know, 95% would say the summer is their favorite time of year. Before the season and the pressure, when gym is about fun and skills and team building.

 

[Deleted member 14190]

I do not coach (nor would I). I am not trying to win an argument, as I see it as a discussion rather than a debate. It’s kinda in how you view things. I love to discuss things and go back and forth on perspective. Maybe you like the same thing but call it an argument. Semantics, I guess, but I love semantics.

I respond to it from an academic perspective- should competition be fair, what would make it more fair. My original post on this thread was merely about eliminating age groups (because I don’t see the point of them) and the majority of awards. I tend to respond when I feel questioned, or when I feel I have a perspective to add. I guess that is what we all do.

The other 99.percent aren't like that particularly kids who compete , hence the word competition.

 

[Deleted member 14190]

Ok, I promise this will be my last response to you because I think you misunderstand my intent.

But could it be that you breed an environment that makes girls feel like that? That your style of coaching breeds a specific mindset? We have been in three states, ten gyms, and three separate programs (usaigc, Xcel, jo) and I’ve not met these uber competitive girls you speak of. Every girl we’ve met has loved practice completely on its own merits.

Most coaches are competitive , but none compare to some of the parents I run into ! Frankly most parents would not want kids to be coached in any sport by a coach who wasn't competitive.... those coaches usually are not very good ...

 

[Deleted member 18037]

Most kids like to compete or
Play the game. Season is what gets them through the endless hours of training . So forcing these kids to just take a year off is a free ticket to retirement for many.

So again, you mitigate. First years don't compete with multi years. That would even help a kid "not ready" for next level. Because what "level ready" is not the same for all coaches/gyms. Or let the 38 and higher scorers duke it out in their own division.

And the 20 plus hour home school gyms duke it out in their own division.

 

[MILgymFAM]

Most coaches are competitive , but none compare to some of the parents I run into ! Frankly most parents would not want kids to be coached in any sport by a coach who wasn't competitive.... those coaches usually are not very good ...

Oye- you pulled me back in for one more.

That’s completely not a fair judgement. The coaches that we’ve met who allow training without competing are amazing coaches, probably two of them are the best coaches we’ve ever had and both of those have coached gymnasts on the national and elite level. There doesn’t have to be only one way to do things.

Ok, I’ll shut up now.

 

[Deleted member 14190]

And kids not getting medals is retirement to many. And kids repeating a level is retirement to many.

Kids have different peaks, different points when they are done.

My experience is too many hours is perhaps the biggest reason for retirement for many.

Puberty is the top

 

[Deleted member 14190]

Oye- you pulled me back in for one more.

That’s completely not a fair judgement. The coaches that we’ve met who allow training without competing are amazing coaches, probably two of them are the best coaches we’ve ever had and both of those have coached gymnasts on the national and elite level. There doesn’t have to be only one way to do things.

Ok, I’ll shut up now.

Your competitive nature brought you back

 

[Deleted member 18037]

Puberty is the top

Actually I was thinking of the many gone before puberty because the kids wanted to do more then gym.

 

[profmom]

I don't think distinguishing between first-year competitors and level repeaters is going to be all that helpful. Until you get to around L8 or L9, at big meets, the kids on top are generally going to be the ones who only need one year at a level before they master it and move on. Maybe the girls' compulsory levels should consider trying it the way the boys do it now, with one division that has base routines and another has bonuses.

Was the original question remaking WAG or remaking meets? It's interesting how much the conversation has focused on making competitions more "fair."

One thing I don't think has been mentioned is providing more alternatives in compulsory routines and early optionals that enable coaches to limit backbending skills. I think the provision of BHS as an alternative to BWO on beam was a good change. I also like the changes that make vault more progressive toward flipping vaults.

I'd like to see the option for judges to exact a significant deduction against a team score upon observing abusive or hostile treatment of athletes by a coach at a meet. I know it would be hard to get that one to be used, but I've seen instances where I think it would have been warranted.

 

[raenndrops]

Most kids like to compete or
Play the game. Season is what gets them through the endless hours of training . So forcing these kids to just take a year off is a free ticket to retirement for many.

Or let them compete with lower SV until they have full SV routines. Nobody has to "not compete" if they want to compete, but if they choose not to, they dont have to compete. It would be their choice.

 

[mommyof1]

I would like to see a deduction if the coach does not stand between the bars to spot tap swings.

 

[John]

Not competing until a gymnast is ready is an idea I like. My daughter lives for new skills and could care less about toe-point or dance or where her arms are. She is young and that may change with time. Teach her new progressions and new skills and she will love you as a coach. Isn't this method what is used to get a 9-year-old gymnast to level 10? I know surely he or she didn't spend a year at each level. How can training and not competing be good for some but not others?

I think winning and competing is driven by coaches, gym owners, and parents as a way to validate. That is a shame.

To recreate WAG has to mean NEW things in the gym and during competitions. It has to mean breaking from tradition, lose compulsory routines, leo restraints, judging (the 10) and many other non-sense things left due to tradition.

 

[Flippin'A]

Honestly I'd probably not allow competition of any kind until the kids are 8. I know that's not going to be appealing to many, but I feel like it would help the kids develop more intrinsic motivation and help gyms not rule out 7 year olds for team because they're too old. It would give everyone more time to focus on strength and basics without worrying about running the level 2 beam routine ad nauseam. At that point I'd say the kids can start in whatever compulsory level their coach says they're ready for. I know saying this as my six year old prepares for level 3 next year probably makes me a hypocrite, but I'm working under the system we have, not the one I would like.