WAG How to handle it when they get it wrong

[B&M's mom]

I've been a gym manager for our meet. Unfortunately incorrect scores do get flashed.

I 'm not sure what you mean by the scorecards? The judges have cards that they enter their scores on but the girls don't get those. The judges have to review all the scores entered into the official scoring system before they are released for awards. If there is an error, it is usually corrected, for example a deduction was not included. No scores are released without the judges' approval. That's not to say that there haven't been problems with girls' scores not showing up in the system because the girl's information was improperly entered. But that type of error impacts all of her scores not just one event.

 

[cbifoja]

My daughter was knocked off the podium by a beam score lower than hers. It was a bit aggravating because it was her first L7 meet but I certainly wasn't going to make a stink about it. I figure sometimes mistakes happen and in the grand scheme of things, is her life really going to change if she only has 97 medals instead of 98? I mean it was for 6th place, so not that big of a deal.

We were hosting a meet once and somehow screwed up the AA scores so that one of our girls "won" second place. We discovered the error before awards were all the way over and the real 2nd place winner's mother insisted that we call everyone in that age group up again. It was horrible to have to take the trophy away from a girl and then give it to someone else. Of course the other little girl deserved it because it was rightfully earned. And our little gymmie was a trooper. She smiled and saluted with her 3rd place trophy, never showed any negativity. Our score person felt HORRIBLE but the situation wasn't helped by the mother's attitude at all. She was yelling and waving her program all over the place. Did she have the right to do that? I suppose so, but I wouldn't have handled it the same way. I wouldn't have insisted on a public declaration because DD doesn't need public kudos for her gymnastics.

 

[Deleted member 14190]

Like I said I'm impressed with my daughter's grace and maturity with all of it and she is truly happy for her teammate who would have otherwise finished second...

My daughter has been taking home a lot of awards already this season, so that also makes me not want to say anything and again not be "that parent". If it hadn't been a score confused for a first place spot (both times now) truly it would be easier to shrug off.

I guess we will just take it meet by meet!

Your dd apparently takes after her parents with her dignity. Isn't that what life is really about? Very well played on your part, and great parenting. Unfortunately during awards things happen and the corrections are generally made in the form of getting mailed the ribbons or getting them afterward. Megan you have done everything correct and get 50 gold stars for raising a daughter with the same values! Of course if this happens at state expect the coaches to rectify it during awards and proper placement acknowledged at the end.

 

[meganliz77]

I've been a gym manager for our meet. Unfortunately incorrect scores do get flashed.

I 'm not sure what you mean by the scorecards? The judges have cards that they enter their scores on but the girls don't get those. The judges have to review all the scores entered into the official scoring system before they are released for awards. If there is an error, it is usually corrected, for example a deduction was not included. No scores are released without the judges' approval. That's not to say that there haven't been problems with girls' scores not showing up in the system because the girl's information was improperly entered. But that type of error impacts all of her scores not just one event.

I only have the meets we have participated in our state and neighboring states, but when they flash the score (by hand) there is a piece of card stock they bring them from event to event with their gymnast number or last name. On the back is where the judges write the score. And I did the math for what they announced as all around scores, and what was flashed during the meet was all accurate. The error came when they were reading scores during awards... Hoping that makes sense.. I think they simply misread a 2 for a 7.

She is a Level 3 and I know it's not the end of the world. it just left us wondering when is it okay to speak up and to whom...

 

[meganliz77]

Your dd apparently takes after her parents with her dignity. Isn't that what life is really about? Very well played on your part, and great parenting. Unfortunately during awards things happen and the corrections are generally made in the form of getting mailed the ribbons or getting them afterward. Megan you have done everything correct and get 50 gold stars for raising a daughter with the same values! Of course if this happens at state expect the coaches to rectify it during awards and proper placement acknowledged at the end.

Thank you for this, thank you very much... And I will definitely speaking up at State if something like this were to happen...

My kiddo is the kid who would throw up her hands and quit playing a board game if losing.... She HATES losing. But I have seen a completely different side of her since starting gymnastics 1-1/2 yrs ago. Although still super competitive... She has learned how to support others on her team and has truly blossomed as a team leader at the age of 7 (there are 12 yr olds on her team as well)

Yesterday, the same teammate that was awarded the first place on vault had a fall on beam-- my DD was the one who yelled "it's alright, just shake it off, you got this!"

It made my heart smile...

 

[gymdog]

I only have the meets we have participated in our state and neighboring states, but when they flash the score (by hand) there is a piece of card stock they bring them from event to event with their gymnast number or last name. On the back is where the judges write the score. And I did the math for what they announced as all around scores, and what was flashed during the meet was all accurate. The error came when they were reading scores during awards... Hoping that makes sense.. I think they simply misread a 2 for a 7.

She is a Level 3 and I know it's not the end of the world. it just left us wondering when is it okay to speak up and to whom...

They are reading a list of kids with their score next to it, so you can't just read a 2 for a 7...well, you can, but the order of kids will still be correct. The gyms use a software system where each child has an entry and all those scores are entered. The computer calculates the AA and spits out the list of placements (one sheet for each event and AA). The only possibility is 1. The wrong score was flashed or 2. The wrong score was entered. Which doesn't make a lot of sense since you say the AAs were correct. Are you sure this child had a 9.275 on her scorecard? Maybe they confused her for another child when entering a score? But then the AA would still reflect that because the computer does it all.

But, either way, the way current systems are set up this shouldn't be too much of an issue. I'm not sure why it is happening so much in your area...that seems weird. But unfortunately I'm not sure you can do much other than leave it up to your coaches,

 

[meganliz77]

They are reading a list of kids with their score next to it, so you can't just read a 2 for a 7...well, you can, but the order of kids will still be correct. The gyms use a software system where each child has an entry and all those scores are entered. The computer calculates the AA and spits out the list of placements (one sheet for each event and AA). The only possibility is 1. The wrong score was flashed or 2. The wrong score was entered. Which doesn't make a lot of sense since you say the AAs were correct. Are you sure this child had a 9.275 on her scorecard? Maybe they confused her for another child when entering a score? But then the AA would still reflect that because the computer does it all.

But, either way, the way current systems are set up this shouldn't be too much of an issue. I'm not sure why it is happening so much in your area...that seems weird. But unfortunately I'm not sure you can do much other than leave it up to your coaches,

Well then wouldn't it be possible that they misread the number as they entered into the computer for computation at the end of the meet? They announced the all around scores as they handed out awards for placement...the other girl's all around score added up to be a vault with a 9.225... (Not a 9.725)... So I guess I'm not sure where things went wrong but I'm confident they got it wrong...

At the first meet my daughter had scored a 9.2 on floor, two other teammates scored a 9.0. They awarded a three way tie for first on floor with 9.0. Her scorecard notes a 9.2 also.

Hmmmm... I don't know... Going to chalk it up to lousy luck, and a learning experience!

 

[gymdog]

Yes...but the AA is calculated by the computer

 

[meganliz77]

Yes...but the AA is calculated by the computer

Do they all use computers?? I'm still really new to all of this...

 

[gymdog]

I haven't been to a meet in my life that doesn't use computers. And I grew up in the 90s. But I guess it's possible they didn't, that seems completely insane though. Are the results posted online?

 

[kandkfunk]

If they didn't use computers, you would know. The old, computer-less system for tracking scores and placements literally required a an entire wall.

It seems very, very strange that the score for one event was incorrect but the AA score was correct. I've run scoring systems for large and small meets and I can't see how that would happen. The AA score is calculated by the software program based on the 4 individual event scores entered. The event and AA placements are entered into the scoring system by either a judge or a volunteer. Most meets in our area adhere labels to the back of each medal listing the score and placement. Maybe that isn't the norm in your area though.

 

[meganliz77]

I haven't been to a meet in my life that doesn't use computers. And I grew up in the 90s. But I guess it's possible they didn't, that seems completely insane though. Are the results posted online?

I actually looked today and no they are not...

 

[meganliz77]

[ QUOTE="kandkfunk, post: 347205, member: 12200"]If they didn't use computers, you would know. The old, computer-less system for tracking scores and placements literally required a an entire wall.

It seems very, very strange that the score for one event was incorrect but the AA score was correct. I've run scoring systems for large and small meets and I can't see how that would happen. The AA score is calculated by the software program based on the 4 individual event scores entered. The event and AA placements are entered into the scoring system by either a judge or a volunteer. Most meets in our area adhere labels to the back of each medal listing the score and placement. Maybe that isn't the norm in your area though.[/QUOTE]

I have no clue... I just looked at the score sheet I kept yesterday and if the other girl had actually had that score on vault she would have scored 2nd all around (my daughter finished 1st regardless) but she finished 3rd and her all around score was announced as what I have written down...

 

[gymdog]

I have no clue... I just looked at the score sheet I kept yesterday and if the other girl had actually had that score on vault she would have scored 2nd all around (my daughter finished 1st regardless) but she finished 3rd and her all around score was announced as what I have written down...

The only thing I can think of is they realized something was wrong halfway through the awards (plausible, since whoever was at the vault maybe remembered there were no 9.7s) and printed a corrected AA sheet (generally you print all he sheets separately), but they didn't want to take the medals back from the kids and thought it was best to just continue? I don't personally agree (I think they should just redo the awards and have the kids switch their medals..not the end of the world...my kids would know their scores anyway so wouldn't be surprised), but I understand it is dicey.

I think there probably would have been a delay during the awards if this scenario indeed happened since it would take time to retrieve the correct score, change it, and print a new sheet. More time than it would take to go through bars, beam and floor. But that's the only way I can understand how this could happen and the AA could be correct. Unless they switched her scores and she had a 9.7 on another event and they put a 9.2 for that...but I assume that would be easy to recognize.

 

[gymdog]

I was going to say if they posted them online you could see if they corrected the score because usually it's directly uploaded from the software.

 

[wnl256]

We were hosting a meet once and somehow screwed up the AA scores so that one of our girls "won" second place. We discovered the error before awards were all the way over and the real 2nd place winner's mother insisted that we call everyone in that age group up again. It was horrible to have to take the trophy away from a girl and then give it to someone else.

This is why parents should never talk directly to the meet officials! That kind of behavior is being THAT mom.

I have personally screwed up team awards at a meet by forgetting to limit the number of scores per team to 3. After awards one of the coaches asked for the team standings sheet. When she looked at it she noticed that the winning team scores were well above 120, a mathematical impossibility. I was mortified. We reprinted the results (corrected this time) and second and third place were reversed, so meet director had to go around to the coaches and explain the issue. Needless to say, I have never made that mistake again and now insist that everyone running the scoring system check the team scores on the results page before handing the stack over to the announcer. It is a very easy mistake to make as the default setting for that report is to count all scores from a team.

We had an issue at a different meet where we were informed after a session concluded, after we had printed and handed labels over, and while we were printing results pages for the announcer, that one of the athletes was in the wrong age group (caused by incorrect information submitted by the team's coach and not by anything we had done). I was very much of the opinion that it was too late, but our meet director insisted that we fix it and reprint everything. Awards were delayed quite a bit for that session as the volunteers had already started affixing labels to medals.

 

[profmom]

This is why I am signing up for two sessions of hand scoring at our home meet. Yes, it adds a lot more labor to the process, but this way, we can be sure it's done right. Judges write down the score on a score card. Runners bring it over to the table. Score is entered into the computer, then score card is given to the hand scorer. Hand scorer writes it in on the log sheet. At the end of the rotation, computer enterer and hand scorer cross check every score. Any discrepancies are corrected by reference to the score cards. Then and only then is the rotation official, but we hold onto every score card just to be sure.

 

[gymdog]

This is why I am signing up for two sessions of hand scoring at our home meet. Yes, it adds a lot more labor to the process, but this way, we can be sure it's done right. Judges write down the score on a score card. Runners bring it over to the table. Score is entered into the computer, then score card is given to the hand scorer. Hand scorer writes it in on the log sheet. At the end of the rotation, computer enterer and hand scorer cross check every score. Any discrepancies are corrected by reference to the score cards. Then and only then is the rotation official, but we hold onto every score card just to be sure.

Wow, I've never seen this done at a girls USAG meet. High school meets use to do it (I hope they still don't). It took forever even though there are way less competitors (teams have a limited number that can compete on each event, about a 1/4 of what an average event rotation would be at a big USAG meet).

 

[Ali'sMom]

We talked to DD afterwards and on the back of her medal we wrote 1st and her score... And she took it well and was happy that her teammate was recognized.. She even said she isn't going to tell the other girl because she doesn't want her to feel bad!! For being 7, and fiercely competitive, her maturity is impressive!

I don't know when to speak up about something like this, but I wanted to commend your daughter's maturity!!!

 

[MeetDirector]

Incorrect score entry is the bane of a meet director. I abhor little girls hand-flashing scores at each event; inevitably they get it wrong or are at least one gymnast behind. The modern scoring systems all handle remote entry of scores as well as some form of score display. At my meets, the only children I allow on the floor are runners to deliver the judge-marked score card to the scoring table; alternatively, a parent enters the judges' scores on the remote keypad. The scoring system then displays what was entered. Can there be errors? Sure. But the fewer people that touch the scores the better. We use a second set of eyes to verify the entry into the computer. If there are errors, I expect a coach (and only a coach) to bring them to my attention.