Parents L10 gymnast (The Reality Of College Gymnastics)

[rlm's mom]

Incredibly lucky!! We can’t figure out the issue. I guess coaches do not want to invest the time or energy. We have interested and engaged parents. Certainly young kids at 10/11 years old who are competing level 8 and scoring well (several of our kids) have the potential to keep going, but everything just fizzles out on level 9. It is truly not the kids. I guess this is a whole other thread but I wish we had some guidance to build a program just to get these girls to 10, let alone elite.

It takes years to build up a competitive level 10 program, never mind coaching elites to a competitive level - Unless Simone Biles happen to train the same gym
Ours has been running since the 1990’s I think and has a very competitive optionals program but elite program is still weak. We have had 2-3 elites at any given time since we’ve been there and a few more competing Hopes.

 

[FlippinLilysMom]

It takes years to build up a competitive level 10 program, never mind coaching elites to a competitive level - Unless Simone Biles happen to train the same gym
Ours has been running since the 1990’s I think and has a very competitive optionals program but elite program is still weak. We have had 2-3 elites at any given time since we’ve been there and a few more competing Hopes.

Yes and no. Our gym never had or trained elites, in the first year they began training hopes they sent two girls to the hopes championship and one finished 4th and made the hopes national team. The next year they again sent two to hopes championship (one finished 2nd) and sent a 3rd to USA championships as a junior elite. Very small gym, trained 20 hours per week and all went to regular school, no home schooling.

 

[LJL07]

And if you‘ve never heard of it, it can’t be so.

Well its being done. Scoring mid 8s as first years. They get it’s going to take longer to up their skill difficulty. They know they aren’t going to Nationals. Probably not regionals. But they are doing it. And they do things like Varsity track and soccer. And they are L9 gymnasts.

Our gym doesn’t waste practice time. 3 hours, no snacks, chit chat. Water breaks only. Lots of conditioning. Get in, get to work, done. More hours available in the summer. Of course it can be done.

Yes you can get to Level 9 on 12 hours a week. You not going to be a 6/7 th grader but it can be done.

Mine got L7 doing 9 hours. Folks saying that can’t be done either.

This sounds like total nonsense. I’m sorry. I don’t even think you can get adequate conditioning in for true level 9 skills with those hours. The only way I can see this working is if your gym has maybe 1 or 2 level 9s with very focused coaching. Almost like the girls are getting private instruction.

Sure, you can do level 7 on 9 hours. You’ve mentioned the skills your child was doing too and made it clear that she wasn’t scoring 38s on those hours. You cannot really expect to be competitive on those levels at those hours. Is your gym regularly producing college gymnasts with those hours?

I saw you arguing about this same thing in another thread, so I’ll stop now.

 

[LJL07]

Yes and no. Our gym never had or trained elites, in the first year they began training hopes they sent two girls to the hopes championship and one finished 4th and made the hopes national team. The next year they again sent two to hopes championship (one finished 2nd) and sent a 3rd to USA championships as a junior elite. Very small gym, trained 20 hours per week and all went to regular school, no home schooling.

They must have been really dedicated! You’ve shared bits and pieces about your gym. I’ve always wished someone over here would do what they have done.

 

[JBS]

I don’t think more domestic competitions should help. More international meets and country vs country tournament opportunities would encourage more kids to stay at the elite level. In European countries for example there are many small meets between 2/3 countries on a regular basis. All elites have a chance to get involved - including juniors!

I agree with this… this would be very fun.

 

[rlm's mom]

And if you‘ve never heard of it, it can’t be so.

Well its being done. Scoring mid 8s as first years. They get it’s going to take longer to up their skill difficulty. They know they aren’t going to Nationals. Probably not regionals. But they are doing it. And they do things like Varsity track and soccer. And they are L9 gymnasts.

Our gym doesn’t waste practice time. 3 hours, no snacks, chit chat. Water breaks only. Lots of conditioning. Get in, get to work, done. More hours available in the summer. Of course it can be done.

Yes you can get to Level 9 on 12 hours a week. You not going to be a 6/7 th grader but it can be done.

Mine got L7 doing 9 hours. Folks saying that can’t be done either.

A level 9 scoring mid 8s is considered a top gymnast. Level 9 scoring is extremely low. A mid 8 on every event would get to roughly 37.00 AA which would qualify the Easterns and Westerns I think in every region! You can correct me if I’m wrong with that.
Point being I don’t believe your low-hours level 9’s are scoring mid 8s in their first season. You picked the wrong level to make that claim.

 

[gym_dad32608]

I think you have to remember the context of the discussion. Which is about creating a gym/program that can produce these high-scoring athletes. So we are already talking about averages. On average, it takes around 20 hours/week of practice to produce this level. Can you do with less? Sure. But those are outliers, probably due to a variety of different factors that might be difficult to recreate, on average. Like particular coaching staff, equipment, gym layout, number of gymnasts, other classes at gym, and yes, the inherent talent of the gymnasts themselves. There are many variables that affect production. So I know we can always find an example (usually our own) of X but remember its across the population.

 

[Deleted member 18037]

A level 9 scoring mid 8s is considered a top gymnast. Level 9 scoring is extremely low. A mid 8 on every event would get to roughly 37.00 AA which would qualify the Easterns and Westerns I think in every region! You can correct me if I’m wrong with that.
Point being I don’t believe your low-hours level 9’s are scoring mid 8s in their first season. You picked the wrong level to make that claim.

I did not pick the wrong level, your math is wrong.

mid 8 is 8.5. That would put them at 34

To get to 37 they would need to average low 9s.

I can assure they are level 9s

 

[Deleted member 18037]

. On average, it takes around 20 hours/week of practice to produce this level.

Not true. You are discounting total time to get skills. Really it’s not about the level but getting the skills solid.

My experience is it takes them longer (as in months) to get the skills solid and consistent doing less weekly hours but they get them.

Our kids are not aberrations. They are talented, JMO anyone who can run at a stationary object and flip a vault and do a BHS BHS on a 4 inch beam is talented. But they aren’t lightening in a bottle talented. Mine is doing L9 floor and beam skills, though beam is spotty currently. Her vault and bars are not there.

What they are is hard working gymnasts, who want to do gym but not do high hours. And they have adults in their lives who support that. Rather then saying it can’t be done so don’t bother. Good solid coaching who understand you don’t have to do high hours. Who know that asking the gymnasts to give up other things they want to do, would drive them out of the sport. And parents who are OK with the fact that their gymnasts may not ever get to L10, may take longer to get to L9. The adults understand it doesn’t have be done by puberty And they don’t have to get a ride to college for gymnastics. And still and be good at gym.

And now that there is more room for event specialists I can see more of our gyms future gymnasts doing 9/10 as event specialists.

 

[Deleted member 18037]

Is your gym regularly producing college gymnasts with those hours?

And there it is. If you are not regularly producing college gymnasts. They are not worthy of being considered gymnasts. It’s not “real” gymnastics.

No our gym is not regularly producing college gymnasts. They do feed to gyms who do. They do produce solid gymnasts. They do produce NCAA including D1, athletes in other sports because of the foundation built in their gym.

Our gym has the kids that attitudes like yours drives the kid out of the sport. We have those kids. Hard working kids doing solid gymnastics because they simply want to.

 

[gym_dad32608]

Not true. You are discounting total time to get skills. Really it’s not about the level but getting the skills solid.

My experience is it takes them longer (as in months) to get the skills solid and consistent doing less weekly hours but they get them.

Our kids are not aberrations. They are talented, JMO anyone who can run at a stationary object and flip a vault and do a BHS BHS on a 4 inch beam is talented. But they aren’t lightening in a bottle talented. Mine is doing L9 floor and beam skills, though beam is spotty currently. Her vault and bars are not there.

What they are is hard working gymnasts, who want to do gym but not do high hours. And they have adults in their lives who support that. Rather then saying it can’t be done so don’t bother. Good solid coaching who understand you don’t have to do high hours. Who know that asking the gymnasts to give up other things they want to do, would drive them out of the sport. And parents who are OK with the fact that their gymnasts may not ever get to L10, may take longer to get to L9. The adults understand it doesn’t have be done by puberty And they don’t have to get a ride to college for gymnastics. And still and be good at gym.

And now that there is more room for event specialists I can see more of our gyms future gymnasts doing 9/10 as event specialists.

You make my point exactly. I am not saying you cannot be successful at low hours of practice. You are an example of such. But over all the gyms, the average gym, with average coaches, and average gymnasts, they are going to practice about 20 hours a week. That's just a fact. Because its an average you are going to have some that train less and some that train more than that, but the cluster is going to be around 20 hours.

If one was starting a gym, with the goal of high-perfoming level 10's that would be the starting point of planning. Of course, one could and probably would adjust based upon the situation, maybe like your situation they don't care if it takes longer to get to that point?

Please with the judgy tone though.

 

[Deleted member 18037]

You make my point exactly. I am not saying you cannot be successful at low hours of practice.

If you are a L9 gymnast you are successful. And it doesn’t require 20 hours.

That folks insist you can only get to optionals with high hours drives all those L4s out of gym. I’m so grateful that my kid got to continue gym rather then ending her gymnastics as a L4 state champion.

 

[gym_dad32608]

If you are a L9 gymnast you are successful. And it doesn’t require 20 hours.

That folks insist you can only get to optionals with high hours drives all those L4s out of gym. I’m so grateful that my kid got to continue gym rather then ending her gymnastics as a L4 state champion.

Of course, its all about how you define success, every girl who makes optionals is successful by one definition, absolutely, no doubt, I would never think less of any girl who pushes through challenges and fears to make it to that level, but read the title of this thread, its not just about doing optionals, the context of this discussion is being a L10 progressing to a college gymnast. In that regard, by your own admission, your gym, in low hours is not very successful

our gym is not regularly producing college gymnasts..

Gyms that do that, do train higher hours. Yes, its a trade-off, yes some people are fine with that, yes some people are not. I am not saying either path is wrong or right, everyone makes their own choices. What LJL is lamenting is that she has a gymnast(s) that is willing to train those hours, to obtain the college gymnast dream, but is limited by access to a gym that can provide that.

 

[LJL07]

And there it is. If you are not regularly producing college gymnasts. They are not worthy of being considered gymnasts. It’s not “real” gymnastics.

No our gym is not regularly producing college gymnasts. They do feed to gyms who do. They do produce solid gymnasts. They do produce NCAA including D1, athletes in other sports because of the foundation built in their gym.

Our gym has the kids that attitudes like yours drives the kid out of the sport. We have those kids. Hard working kids doing solid gymnastics because they simply want to.

What in the world are you saying? And I second the judgey tone comment mentioned.

This thread is about the realities of doing college gymnastics. The reality is that a gym like the one you describe (yours) cannot produce college gymnasts. Neither can our gym (probably--we shall see.) You don't know anything about my daughters' attitudes. And no one said anything about girls doing lesser hours not being "real gymnasts" or not working hard. I think we have established in this thread that an elite path or very high hours are not for every kid or every family. And you are fortunate that you do have gym options for those girls wanting to be more serious. We do not have those options.

If you are a L9 gymnast you are successful. And it doesn’t require 20 hours.

That folks insist you can only get to optionals with high hours drives all those L4s out of gym. I’m so grateful that my kid got to continue gym rather then ending her gymnastics as a L4 state champion.

A level 4 does NOT need 20 hours a week of gymnastics. I have seen absolutely no one insist that this is necessary. And *IF* you have a child wanting to do college gymnastics, it is not enough to simply do level 9 and score mid 8's. This is the reality. Why are you arguing this?

My daughter consistently scored right around a 35 most of the season on 9. This is slightly higher than just mid 8's. It was not enough. I would never say she isn't a "real gymnast." We had to rent space from another gym all season, no pits, very low hours, limited equipment. The girls knew it was not enough. It is kind of a miracle that my youngest daughter made it on the state team for regionals under these circumstances. She worked very hard with what we had available this season.

 

[gymgal]

I don’t think more domestic competitions should help. More international meets and country vs country tournament opportunities would encourage more kids to stay at the elite level. In European countries for example there are many small meets between 2/3 countries on a regular basis. All elites have a chance to get involved - including juniors!

I think more domestic competitions help to a point as at least the gymnasts are competing against others at their level and they won't feel as much need to drop back to L10 but I agree that part of the draw of elite is being able to compete internationally. One of the reasons so many drop back to L10 is that they know they won't get one of those international spots and then they are not competing at all (well, just a couple of domestic meets).

 

[rlm's mom]

If you are a L9 gymnast you are successful. And it doesn’t require 20 hours.

That folks insist you can only get to optionals with high hours drives all those L4s out of gym. I’m so grateful that my kid got to continue gym rather then ending her gymnastics as a L4 state champion.

No one on here is supporting 20 hours a week at level 4. You don’t need high hours to reach optionals, you need high (er) hours to be competitive at upper optionals

 

[LJL07]

And now that there is more room for event specialists I can see more of our gyms future gymnasts doing 9/10 as event specialists.

I have also looked into becoming an event specialist . It is true that many college programs are looking for vault and bars specialists. However, it is my understanding that you need a 1.5 yurchenko full scoring VERY well and bars probably 9.5 or higher to really be considered for an event specialist. And certainly at least a 10.0 SV on bars for event specialist. Maybe the requirements are less stringent for the D3 programs. It is not easy, and the girls need to be VERY strong at the event. Someone please correct me if that is wrong.

 

[FlippinLilysMom]

I have also looked into becoming an event specialist . It is true that many college programs are looking for vault and bars specialists. However, it is my understanding that you need a 1.5 yurchenko full scoring VERY well and bars probably 9.5 or higher to really be considered for an event specialist. And certainly at least a 10.0 SV on bars for event specialist. Maybe the requirements are less stringent for the D3 programs. It is not easy, and the girls need to be VERY strong at the event. Someone please correct me if that is wrong.

I would 100% agree. If you have a high scoring yurchenko 1.5 you can almost guarantee a team will want you. Same with bars, if you are consistently scoring high 9s on bars colleges will definitely be looking at you. Added bonus if you have both vault AND bars. Luckily those are my daughter's best events.

 

[Deleted member 18037]

This thread is about the realities of doing college gymnastics.

What in the world are you saying? And I second the judgey tone comment mentioned.

This thread is about the realities of doing college gymnastics.

I find your ”tone” and others rather judgy. I just don’t complain about it.

My daughter will do college gymnastics. It just wont be NCAA. She will be happy and get an education and continue gymnastics. As a parent that’s a win for me.

 

[Deleted member 18037]

level 9 and score mid 8's. This is the reality. Why are you arguing this?

You were busy insisting you could not even be a L9 on less then 20 hours. You keep moving the goal line. Make up your mind.

I never said you could get a ride, I simply said you could be a L9 on under 20 hours. That is in fact true.

The reality is gymnasts peak no matter the hours. Many a kid left our gym in search of “glory“ to high hour gyms. Because their parents thought it was not their talent that was the problem but “the gym“ and ”the low hours”. The reality is they are scoring no better then our gymnasts, same level (L7/8 and 9s). They just go a boatload more hours for the same scores. Some kids are simply not high scorers not matter the hours. The truly talented ones are scoring better and will likely get rides. Maybe not D1 but certainly D3. Not because they moved to higher hours but because they are that good.

And then there are a bunch of super talented girls who technically go “high” hours but slack off, miss practices, barely participate at practice and still go to Nationals. They are simply that dang good. It is what it is.

Again, if your kid loves gym, she will have opportunities to do gym in college.

Unfortunately, your “judginess” won’t consider club gym.