Parents Repeat Level 4 or Struggle through Level 6

[rjb123]

Honestly, for me I might consider letting her do 4 again, if she was allowed to work 5/6 skills along with it. Like, she has to hit 5 bar routines at 9.5 or higher and then she works clear hips. Cast to handstand can be done at 4, and that is absolutely needed in 6. Level 4 has some good foundational skills and if she really perfects them this will help her later on. Maybe talk to the coaches and see if they can work out a plan to help her perfect the level 4 basics while adding in the higher skills along the way.

 

[profmom]

Don't worry about the meets. They can enter her and then scratch her. Happens all the time.

If you frame it right, she should be able to handle doing another year at L4. And she might surprise you. My DD did two years at old L5 and was really upset about it for three days after she got the news. Then she picked up her chin and moved on.

 

[my4buffaloes]

I would say level 6. She was more than competent at the level 4 routines and skills. What would repeating gain? Not much. Uptraining and the ability to keep moving forward rather than remain stagnant is a huge benefit of going to level 6. You have 8 months for her to get the skills - which it sounds like she is close on.

My theory on the compulsory levels is that unless the season was a disaster and a child really didn't have the skills then move them up. But I am not a coach LOL.

 

[Deleted member 18037]

Another silly question. Why does she have to make all the meets. Very few of our girls are able to do every meet that is offered, for any number of reasons.

 

[Clover]

I would lean towards repeating 4 as well. If her high score was only in the 35s and her best event was vault then honestly sounds like she needs a bit more work on the others. Bars can be pretty tough at 6 if you can't at least cast to handstand and have a decently high clear hip. At least in my area we saw plenty of Level 7 skills at Level 6. Someone who wasn't stellar at L4 bars will get killed at Level 6. Also, beam can be a challenge without at least a BHS. There seems to be a rush to get to optionals, but not sure it does these girls any good without really good basics from compulsory.

I too would ask the coaches about opportunities for uptraining while competing 4.

 

[Deleted member 18037]

I would lean towards repeating 4 as well. If her high score was only in the 35s and her best event was vault then honestly sounds like she needs a bit more work on the others. Bars can be pretty tough at 6 if you can't at least cast to handstand and have a decently high clear hip. At least in my area we saw plenty of Level 7 skills at Level 6. Someone who wasn't stellar at L4 bars will get killed at Level 6. Also, beam can be a challenge without at least a BHS. There seems to be a rush to get to optionals, but not sure it does these girls any good without really good basics from compulsory.

I too would ask the coaches about opportunities for uptraining while competing 4.

This.

Especially given she is still struggling with skills. Most especially bars. If those basic Level 4 skills aren't there I can see it would make L6 way more difficult. And if she is still struggling with skills she shouldn't be bored because there is a lot to work on

Regarding her vault. That is the least of it. Level. 4 is the first time they are doing a FHS. So while it's great she is doing it well. At L 6 I am sure there are many doing it well. What looked so outstanding at Level 4 might not so much at Level 6, where kids may have been doing it for 2-4 years.

So it might not be middle of the pack it may be more like bottom.

She is 8 where is the rush. I always worry that rushing can lead to more pressure. And pressure combine with weak skills equal injuries. Not a risk I would be willing to take as a parent especially given her biggest worry you have shared is staying in her "friend" comfort zone. That is just not a good reason to move. It should be about the skills.

She needs to score out to move, so clearly your gym does score outs (ours does not) so I would wait until the coach feels she is ready and her skills (not her friends) prove it.

Having to deal with a change of friends/people you work with is a fact of life and temporary.

Weak skills and not good strong basics will last and effect her much longer then getting use to a new group of girls. JMO

 

[profmom]

We can say whatever we want, but probably none of us have seen this kid train or compete. I'd ask the coaches what they think the pros and cons are, as they are the ones who knows where she is with respect to the skills she will need to be a successful L6. These calls are more difficult to make in regions where there are two competitive seasons, but even so, I would guess the coaches will take the sensible path of training her to see where she ends up by the time they need to make a decision. It's nice that the compulsory season starts earlier, since she doesn't need to learn routines for it if she stays at 4. Hopefully she will make good progress on bars and be ready to start learning optional routines in the fall instead of competing L4.

But honestly and truly, in three or four years, this will not seem like a big deal in retrospect. If her coaches know what they're doing, either path can lead to success. Good luck and don't worry!

My kids' gym does not allow compulsories to skip meets without a good reason, but we also don't do a million meets, either on the boys' side or the girls'. Once they reach optionals, they can choose not to go to the really expensive travel meets, though they are encouraged to do so if they are hoping to be in the running for college gym.

 

[Deleted member 18037]

My kids' gym does not allow compulsories to skip meets without a good reason, but we also don't do a million meets, either on the boys' side or the girls'. Once they reach optionals, they can choose not to go to the really expensive travel meets, though they are encouraged to do so if they are hoping to be in the running for college gym.

Just curious why the kids have to go all scheduled meets? What's the gyms logic.

We would lose a bunch of girls who have scheduling conflicts if they couldn't occasionally not make a meet. Especially if it's a First Communion year.

For us it's also financing as parents pay by the meet.

I try to keep my girl to three meets, plus states/regionals. And once she qualifies for states, we then factor timing and expenses for when and how many.

 

[my4buffaloes]

Meet schedules come out very far in advance. You are committed to the team. Therefore expected to attend all meets. In the case of injury they make adjustments. If you have something big on the schedule like a First Communion or a wedding, etc you are talk to them about it ASAP and they will work it out. But as part of the team you are expected to attend all meets.

 

[Seeker]

We are committed to all the meets too unless there is an injury. I can't recall any gymnast ever missing for any other reason.

 

[gymmomtotwo]

Thanks to all for your answers. It good to hear the different perspectives. Since my main concern is a halt in her uptraining, I think that will be the main part of the discussion for me. By the end of the Level 4 season, she was scoring a 9 on bars and she would have had an allaround in the 36s if she hadn't fallen on beam. But I agree with all of you that bars is where it is at, and because it is a difficulty for her, it will probably hold her back a year. My only frustration is that the decision has to be made so soon, and yes where she trains for summer rides on the decision now. I wish she could continue with her group through most of the summer, and then decide and join the other group to practice routines for the meet seasonif she isn't ready by August. She does know the other girls, and they are actually more her peers from an age standpoint than her current group. In the end, it is in the hands of the coaches with my full support.

 

[gymmutti]

Go with the coach's recommendation as they will have your daughter's best interests. I have seen girls pushed up when parents said they would be bored repeating and quit. They often quit after the next season when they could not keep up. I have seen girls repeat old L5 and new L4 and end up with a lot more confidence in themselves and in their ability in all 4 events, leading to a lot of success in the upcoming years (including catching up and sometimes surpassing girls who did not repeat compulsory. Bars are one of those areas where having strong basics is very important. If she had been strong on bars but weak on vault, I would bet they would have moved her to L6 ( there is a reason you compete FHS from L4-L7 - it just takes some time for some girls to get. But you want kids who are moving to optionals to have strong kips, casts, taps and form (tight, legs glued together with pointed toes). If you truly feel your daughter will have a kip cast handstand on bars and a solid clear hip (not the kind that looks like a back hip circle), and a fly way straight out of a cast by November, then push for L6 - otherwise, I would stay with L4 and let her have a great year.

 

[Gymmomto2]

From another point, my ODD scored out of old L6. Her old L5 yr was terrible! No 35 or higher. Moved to new L6 & placed thru out the season. Came is 2nd on vault & 3rd on beam at States with 6th AA with 36.35. Clearly she is a better optional gymnast than compulsory. My YDD is now preparing to do the same this summer. Go for L6. She can always repeat. Bars will come!

 

[profmom]

Go with the coach's recommendation as they will have your daughter's best interests. I have seen girls pushed up when parents said they would be bored repeating and quit. They often quit after the next season when they could not keep up.

That's why a good coach will be best situated to make this call. They know about how far the child needs to go to be competitive, and they have a good sense of how the child will respond, based on what they've seen while coaching that particular child.

As for attending all meets at our gym, first communion or injury = good reason to miss. Mom and Dad don't want to pay or little Susie wants to go to her friend Ana's birthday party = not good reason. Being on team is a serious commitment, and part of that commitment is to compete. The gym sends the kids to a reasonable number of meets (about five or six a year for compulsories), and they're expected to be there. If a family is having trouble affording five or six compulsory meets, it's going to be very tough moving on in this sport. It doesn't get cheaper.

 

[gracyomalley]

This situation right here is why I think its great when teams offer both L5 and L6 to kids. There really are kids who would benefit from a year at L5 (this sounds like one of them - if she's getting 9s on L4 bars she is certainly ready to be working on and likely competing L5 bars - and the floor and beam changes enough to give her a real step up in preparing for optionals). Sure, L6 is more fun, and L5 scores tend to be lower in general, but the L5 bars CAN be easier because of cast requirements - and it would give her another year of maturity before optionals - then to me it makes sense to have the option of skipping to L7 if she's taking off with some muscle mass pre-pubertal growth/maturity (which is what makes them suddenly get it together at about 10 - happened with my DD - low 8s on bars in the few meets she did as a 9 year old old level 6, 9s as a level 7, 8 months later...) - or do L6 at age 10, etc.

If there is no uptraining during comp season, does that mean that she and her group have been uptraining the last few months? It has to happen sometime....if she's really been trying to get to the L6 standard and isn't there then would she even score out of L5?

I agree - a strong vault score at L4, while wonderful, can mean a lot of things...and height is one of them! If she's a good vaulter and ALSO a good tumbler with tight form on beam, then I'd say moving might make sense...That was where DD was - bars was just behind and she only trained old L6 for a month prior to competing - by the way, I thought her coach was crazy to have her do L7 the next year - until I saw her compete it....and as she went through puberty her bars have suffered again as she is a strength bars worker, not a swing kid...it kept her from Level 8 this year. Coaches do usually have good reason for what they choose.

Oh, and my DD friend who just competed Nationals as a barely 12 year old L9 never scored 36+ in any compulsory level OR L8....came close repeatedly. And my DD has quite a few 36+ scores under her belt, lots of state medals, and still really wasn't ready to move up. Each kid has their own path to follow.

 

[Deleted member 14190]

If she were my gymnast I would have her compete 4, and then jump to 6 (if she has the skills). that way she gets much needed success and meet exposure prior to the jump. It's a win win.

 

[Deleted member 18037]

Meet schedules come out very far in advance. You are committed to the team.

Actually gymnastics while there is a team, and I get the importance of the kids supporting each other as a team. It is really an individual sport.

As for attending all meets at our gym, first communion or injury = good reason to miss. Mom and Dad don't want to pay or little Susie wants to go to her friend Ana's birthday party = not good reason. Being on team is a serious commitment, and part of that commitment is to compete. The gym sends the kids to a reasonable number of meets (about five or six a year for compulsories), and they're expected to be there. If a family is having trouble affording five or six compulsory meets, it's going to be very tough moving on in this sport. It doesn't get cheaper.

I guess that is why everyone picks the gym that works for them. The first thing the coach said to me when I started looking for a new gym because our old gym didn't have any degree of flexibility at all. The first thing he said was "They're kids. The need to have a life. We get that they have other things to do. There needs to be balance. It supposed to fun and we don't want to burn them out. He said eventually they will need to pick up the commitment but they're kids".


So yeah at the lower levels there is more flexibility in training and meets. They expect them to go to enough to qualify for states and have a comfort level at meets. So no the last meet before states, unless it was a huge thing, they expect everyone there. But they try to put enough meets on the schedule so if there is a conflict its Ok to miss one or 2.

And I happen to like that the gym that doesn't want to drive out a kid because of finances.

This year my husband was out of work for a time. We had to decide where to put our funds. Our daughter is involved in activities almost 7 days a week. And I am in healthcare so I work weekends and holidays So yeah when we have a three day weekend. Its not going to be a meet, unless its something like states.

Nice to have a gym that affords some flexibility and we and other families appreciate it. We have our girl and 21 yr old brother so its rather like an only. But other families appreciate that they can manage some things for siblings and such and not have the pressure that every meet is a must. The expectation is you attend most but all not required.

 

[my4buffaloes]

Actually gymnastics while there is a team, and I get the importance of the kids supporting each other as a team. It is really an individual sport.

Actually there is no way you can truly do this individually. This sport is a team investment for the gym. You are competing individually as well as for the team. But a gymnast can't really do this sport on their own. Maybe at the elite level there might be just one, but they are still part of the team at their gym.

Your gym is a rarity in not requiring everyone to attend all the meets.

 

[z2akids]

Actually gymnastics while there is a team, and I get the importance of the kids supporting each other as a team. It is really an individual sport.



I guess that is why everyone picks the gym that works for them. The first thing the coach said to me when I started looking for a new gym because our old gym didn't have any degree of flexibility at all. The first thing he said was "They're kids. The need to have a life. We get that they have other things to do. There needs to be balance. It supposed to fun and we don't want to burn them out. He said eventually they will need to pick up the commitment but they're kids".


So yeah at the lower levels there is more flexibility in training and meets. They expect them to go to enough to qualify for states and have a comfort level at meets. So no the last meet before states, unless it was a huge thing, they expect everyone there. But they try to put enough meets on the schedule so if there is a conflict its Ok to miss one or 2.

And I happen to like that the gym that doesn't want to drive out a kid because of finances.

This year my husband was out of work for a time. We had to decide where to put our funds. Our daughter is involved in activities almost 7 days a week. And I am in healthcare so I work weekends and holidays So yeah when we have a three day weekend. Its not going to be a meet, unless its something like states.

Nice to have a gym that affords some flexibility and we and other families appreciate it. We have our girl and 21 yr old brother so its rather like an only. But other families appreciate that they can manage some things for siblings and such and not have the pressure that every meet is a must. The expectation is you attend most but all not required.

I find this fascinating. Sorry to drag this off topic. But, how does your gym handle competition/coaches fees? If you don't attend a meet, are you still responsible for your pro rata share of the coaches fees/team entry fees, etc?

We have never had a team member miss more than 1 (out of 6 ir 7) meets, unless it is injury related. We rarely have more than one team member missing. Certainly if someone had another commitment. But, team is expensive and the cost of meets is part of that. If a girl at our gym misses and they give enough notice, they may not be saddled with the cost of their entry to the meet, but they still have to pay for the coaches to be there, team entry fees, etc.

Sure, gymnastics is an individual sport. However, it is a team sport as well and, in an area with multiple good gyms, those rec parents love to see trophies. Since they are the bread and butter of the gym business, missing multiple meets is frowned upon. Doing so means that the gym does not benefit from the child's talent and they may as week stay in rec and nut receive training at such reduced rates. Sure, team girls pay more outer month, but for the hours, your cannot compare.

I would be upset as a parent if my meet fees went up a lot because of girls who simply skip multiple meets.

 

[Deleted member 14190]

Coach meet fees should be assessed yearly, period. You skip a meet too bad, the coach should not take a pay cut because you couldn't make it and the other parents should not have to pay more for you. Gymnastics is a team sport, watch any college meet all about the team, most kids only compete one or two events for the team...