Parents Sharp's home raided last night

[2gymmies]

This is definitely a unique situation so don't judge that parent until you've walked in their shoes. From what I've read, these events that occurred were not just a parent sending a kid to a random meet with her coach - these were take an elite hopeful to an elite qualifier and/or developmental camp. Many people talk on this board about being in gymnastics means trusting your child's coach. Well, IMHO, being in an elite program takes a completely higher more complicated level of trust and that parent trusted her child's coach. Child predators are so good at tricking people that I'm not surprised that it took so long to come out (isn't it called grooming) - don't blame the child or the parent - put the blame where it deserves to be.

There are kids that go to developmental camp on this board... I hope one of them verifies this, but from what I'm told, parents are not welcome at the ranch during these camps, it is all coaches alone with their gymnasts (they don't stay in the same hotel as them though)...

 

[2G1B]

For dd, she was 8 the first time she travelled with team Ontario for T and T. Then again at age 9 for Artistic and T and T. There is no choice when they represent the Province at Eastern's, or another meet. They travel with the team. They fly with the team, room with another athlete, and are responsible for the most part for everything on their own. There is a team coach and team manager to help them with their hair, make sure they are up and ready, etc. but for the most part they are on their own.

I did go to the meets, but I flew out on my own, stayed in a hotel, and saw dd only at the meet venue.

This being said, they do not stay in a room with another adult. They room with an athlete of similar age and level. But it was a huge deal for us to allow her to go. But she earned her spot on the team and we knew her own coach would be there (female). I have never heard of anyone not allowing their dd to represent Ontario at Nationals or Eastern's.

Wow. Even for that level, I don't think that I could have done that at 8 year old. I'm not sure that we have that happening under 10 even for the most talented gymnasts...

 

[bogwoppit]

Travelling as a team representing a country or state or province is really pretty safe. Kids room with each other and there are multiple adults in charge. Yes some of them are pretty young, but it is really not much different than summer camp.

Travelling alone with a coach is less usual for meets. Lots of elite hopefuls travel to the ranch with coaches, but they usually stay in the cabins at the ranch with other gymnasts, never with their coaches. The only difficulty I have seen with this is in the event of plane cancellations and forced overnights. That definitely vcould cause issues with young gymnasts and their coaches.

 

[2G1B]

This is definitely a unique situation so don't judge that parent until you've walked in their shoes. From what I've read, these events that occurred were not just a parent sending a kid to a random meet with her coach - these were take an elite hopeful to an elite qualifier and/or developmental camp. Many people talk on this board about being in gymnastics means trusting your child's coach. Well, IMHO, being in an elite program takes a completely higher more complicated level of trust and that parent trusted her child's coach. Child predators are so good at tricking people that I'm not surprised that it took so long to come out (isn't it called grooming) - don't blame the child or the parent - put the blame where it deserves to be.

There are kids that go to developmental camp on this board... I hope one of them verifies this, but from what I'm told, parents are not welcome at the ranch during these camps, it is all coaches alone with their gymnasts (they don't stay in the same hotel as them though)...

Good point. And I do send my kids as young as 7 to Flip Fest; so I guess I can see that I'm not being consistent; but I guess that the thing for me even at developmental camps is that the kids are staying with other kids, not in a hotel. Plus, there are so many people around, not anonymous people like in a hotel, so I feel it is less likely (though not impossible) for something like this to happen at the camps than it would be for a kid to be in a hotel with coaches.

 

[cftmoonlight]

This thread makes me sad. Besides the sadness for the affected children, it makes me sad for myself and other trustworthy coaches. Because of the bad choices that these predators make, those of us who are good and kind will be scrutinized even more. There are plenty of coaches who take athletes here and there purely because we are trying to be helpful when there aren't other options. We give rides to meets or to practice because kids don't have any other way and we don't want them to miss out. We do teambuilding activities at our homes and throw parties for the kids both at residences and the gym simply because they are a great part of bonding. I fear all of these things will end because parents will have to assume the worst or because coaches are too afraid of accusations. Obviously, parents need to do what they think is best, I just hate to see people with good intentions suffer because of the bad eggs.

 

[Anna's_Mom]

My daughter will probably never face this as she isn't destined for those types of meets. However, any youth organization (church, sport, scouts...) should have a plan for keeping children (and their coaches) safe. There are lots of guidelines out there. The organizations I've worked with stipulate that adults can never be alone with a single child, that adults can never share sleeping areas with a child, and there should always be at least two adults within eye-shot of each other when around children. It is possible to put these types of rules in place and keep everyone safe. I would always ask very detailed questions before I allowed my child to travel with a group like this, but I would be OK once a clear plan was explained. I let my children go to summer camp -- I see travel as no different provided that the same type of guidelines were followed.

When I led the youth group at church, I finally realized that these rules protected the adults as well as the children. And angry child making an accusation can pretty much ruin an adult's life, after all. I would be very, very suspicious of a gym that didn't understand and practice all of this, for everyone's sake. In our gym, a parent has to be present and have clear line of sight to their child during a private lesson when the gym is otherwise closed, coaches are not permitted to transport gymnasts and the only photo shoots have been populated with dozens of people, including parents. Were I the girl's parents in the article, the solo photo shoot would have been a huge red flag and I would have followed up with coach and daughter, and it would never have happened again. Though I also hope that my daughter would have said no to begin with.

 

[B.Gold]

^^^ cftmoonlight there is good and evil in every corner of the universe. People already scrutinize. Who doesn't look around a movie theatre when they enter or an airplane when they board? Those who trusted their children's coaches, and teachers and neighbors before this event still do.

 

[GymmieC]

This thread makes me sad. Besides the sadness for the affected children, it makes me sad for myself and other trustworthy coaches. Because of the bad choices that these predators make, those of us who are good and kind will be scrutinized even more. There are plenty of coaches who take athletes here and there purely because we are trying to be helpful when there aren't other options. We give rides to meets or to practice because kids don't have any other way and we don't want them to miss out. We do teambuilding activities at our homes and throw parties for the kids both at residences and the gym simply because they are a great part of bonding. I fear all of these things will end because parents will have to assume the worst or because coaches are too afraid of accusations. Obviously, parents need to do what they think is best, I just hate to see people with good intentions suffer because of the bad eggs.

This is so true. I can 100% sympathize as I am a teacher. It seems like it's every day another story comes through where an adult male or female has abused a child. Not every coach or every teacher etc has these evil intentions. We are living in very difficult, scary times unfortunately.

 

[Deleted member 18037]

When I led the youth group at church, I finally realized that these rules protected the adults as well as the children. And angry child making an accusation can pretty much ruin an adult's life, after all. I would be very, very suspicious of a gym that didn't understand and practice all of this, for everyone's sake.

This

 

[Deleted member 18037]

For dd, she was 8 the first time she travelled with team Ontario for T and T. Then again at age 9 for Artistic and T and T. There is no choice when they represent the Province at Eastern's, or another meet. They travel with the team. They fly with the team, room with another athlete, and are responsible for the most part for everything on their own. There is a team coach and team manager to help them with their hair, make sure they are up and ready, etc. but for the most part they are on their own.

I did go to the meets, but I flew out on my own, stayed in a hotel, and saw dd only at the meet venue.

This being said, they do not stay in a room with another adult. They room with an athlete of similar age and level. But it was a huge deal for us to allow her to go. But she earned her spot on the team and we knew her own coach would be there (female). I have never heard of anyone not allowing their dd to represent Ontario at Nationals or Eastern's.

Again, different scenario. And you went. If your child ended up hurt or in trouble you were there.

 

[Deleted member 18037]

Having team bonding activities and doing it responsibly are not mutually exclusive.

Again protecting the child and yourself (from false accusations) should always be part of any plan.

 

[shelovestoflip]

I guess I don't get how one leads to another. List? What list are you speaking of? Whatever. Yes, we all have opinions, same, different, whatever.
I commented based on your previous statement. I was not speaking in terms of agreeing, not agreeing, etc. I have been in this sport for well into 25 years...never realized that long...just with my two daughters.
If we agree to disagree, is there a need to get huffy? I don't know if you are, but I wonder. Either way, I will leave it alone. Things tend to unravel so easily here. This I have seen. Very unfortunate. If I have offended anyone, well I apologize. That is never my intention. But what good are intentions anyways?
Fact of the matter is that this Sharp situation is very bothersome. But the most I can do is watch my child, and avocate for her and the children I come in contact with.

By list I meant Chalkbucket….
And no, I wasn't getting 'huffy'. Actually, I thought I was pretty reasonable. I was just giving my opinion, yes, different from yours.

 

[Deleted member 14190]

Travelling as a team representing a country or state or province is really pretty safe. Kids room with each other and there are multiple adults in charge. Yes some of them are pretty young, but it is really not much different than summer camp.

Travelling alone with a coach is less usual for meets. Lots of elite hopefuls travel to the ranch with coaches, but they usually stay in the cabins at the ranch with other gymnasts, never with their coaches. The only difficulty I have seen with this is in the event of plane cancellations and forced overnights. That definitely vcould cause issues with young gymnasts and their coaches.

I had to travel to the ranch with gymnast, then get her home..... it was not ideal and goes against all the rules that are usually followed, but the only alternative was to have one of the parents fly out, stay in a hotel the whole time and fly back just to avoid the hour drive. So sometimes it just happens....

 

[Deleted member 18037]

I had to travel to the ranch with gymnast, then get her home..... it was not ideal and goes against all the rules that are usually followed, but the only alternative was to have one of the parents fly out, stay in a hotel the whole time and fly back just to avoid the hour drive. So sometimes it just happens....

And I am sure you a great guy. And I would of gotten my kid there.

Part of our gymmies were away this week, I forget where, they were upper level kids, not on my radar. Again not our level I don't inquire about the details and arrangements, the male coach however stayed home and coached at the gym.

 

[bogwoppit]

I had to travel to the ranch with gymnast, then get her home..... it was not ideal and goes against all the rules that are usually followed, but the only alternative was to have one of the parents fly out, stay in a hotel the whole time and fly back just to avoid the hour drive. So sometimes it just happens....

Totally agree, and 99.9999% of the time it is not an issue.

 

[gymdog]

I had to travel to the ranch with gymnast, then get her home..... it was not ideal and goes against all the rules that are usually followed, but the only alternative was to have one of the parents fly out, stay in a hotel the whole time and fly back just to avoid the hour drive. So sometimes it just happens....

Ranch is a little different. Was she staying in a hotel with you?

 

[Deleted member 14190]

Ranch is a little different. Was she staying in a hotel with you?

No she was at the ranch, but I had to fly with her and drive to and from the ranch from the airport with her. As do many of the coaches at the ranch. It's definitely not ideal, but when you go to the ranch with a gymnast there really isn't any way to pull it off without doing this.

 

[Deleted member 14190]

I would also like to add that we make our parents travel to the meets. No way do I want to be in charge of a bunch of kids!

 

[gymdog]

No she was at the ranch, but I had to fly with her and drive to and from the ranch from the airport with her. As do many of the coaches at the ranch. It's definitely not ideal, but when you go to the ranch with a gymnast there really isn't any way to pull it off without doing this.

I would likely be okay with that. I suppose the car ride is not ideal but that's really the only time the coach and gymnast are alone. Flying is not really alone and gymnasts stay separately from the coaches with other kids while they are at the ranch. The incidents alleged to have happened in this instance happened at a hotel room, not the ranch. It would likely be a good idea for USAG/National Team to review ranch procedures and perhaps figure out a better system for transportation from the airport to the ranch so that a male coach especially can avoid driving alone with one gymnast. Who knows, this may inspire such changes.

I realize it's not their responsibility per se, but all the USAG materials on this say the policy is to never have one coach with one child, but then the ranch procedures basically make it so it would be severely inconvenient for another person to travel and with no reason (since there is nothing even for parents to watch at the ranch they are just wasting money). So they should be making it so it possible for everyone to follow the policy without severe inconvenience or expense that makes it so the child can't participate. Flying isn't a huge deal, flights nowadays are all full and the parent can drive the child to the local airport so if USAG policies fix the to and from the ranch part there is no issue with one coach being alone with one child.

 

[2girls_gymmomma]

We don't know all the details of this man's abuses of both his status as a trusted grown up and coach, or what the red flags were that he was doing hurtful things to children. Thankfully someone spoke up with credible information and now he will have to face the consequences of his decisions. It is a reminder to me to remain vigilant and to teach my daughters and son to trust their gut and to stand strong, even if they think it might upset an adult or someone they care about. And that we as a family do NOT ever agree to keep secrets from each other.