WAG State rec league vs USAG

[LJL07]

Anyone have any experience with scoring differences? The routines are the same and the judges are same ones who are at USAG meets for whatever that is worth. DD's team is usag, but they participated in a state rec league meet. She did well, but just curious how that typically compares to USAG scoring. I honestly couldn't tell a difference. I think some of the gyms do the state rec league until level 4, whereas others start at usag level one.

 

[flippinam]

In my state, the rec league appears to be scored more generously that USAG. They also have different divisions based on score rather than age. So, the first meet of the season is a test meet & gymnasts are placed into a group that scored similarly for the rest of the season. For example, the 37+ is together & that's division 1. Division 2 would be the 36's & so on. I believe you can move up a group but not down during the season. Also there's a mandate score & if you achieve that, you have to move up then next season, so no sandbagging. Though I'm not too fond of this rule for safety purposes. This is how you get kids chucking skills at meets without adequate preparation. Anyway, it's much easier to place high because gymnasts compete only with others who score similarly. A gymnast that I know competed at a state rec meet & scored a 37 AA. She did a USAG meet with the same quality routines & scored a 35. The scoring difference appears to be rather large here. My club competes USAG, so I've never actually attended a rec meet, but based on what I've observed there is indeed a difference. However, it is likely different from your state

 

[LJL07]

I think the biggest difference I saw was that the teams weren't as competitive so our team placed very high with our much smaller group compared to the very large rec teams. Yet the scoring seemed comparable to USAG. At least I hope so! If it's that far off we might be in for a rude awakening at our next meet!

 

[flippinam]

That was just what I've observed in my state based on one person & two meets. The USAG meet could have been one of those extremely harsh meets or the rec one could have been a very generous meet. I'm sure your daughter and her teammates will do great at either! Good luck to her at the rest of her meets!

 

[z2akids]

Our gym has a rec team and a usag team. The rec team competes at levels 2 and 3while we have L3+ in usag. The rec team competes in a local (large greater metro area league). In our rec league the judges are often the same as at usag meets, but only one judge per event and the scoring is significantly more generous. I watched part of a meet last weekend and girls were receiving 9.3 ish on routines that I would expect would receive in the low 8s (basically, they weren't 1/10th'd to death). L3 beam routines with handstand less than 45° and missed dismount receiving close to 9. Fair amounts of text errors that are overlooked in the scoring.

Our local rec league does ribbons, but does not do placements until the championship meet. So, it is a nice introduction to competition without the stress of placements. But, we don't do "pre-team" here and the rec league serves a similar function for many gyms (and a majority the local gyms participate including several gyms that are well regarded nationally).

However, a usag team would not be allowed to participate in these meets, and for good reason. Our L3 rec team practices 5 hours per week (which is fairly typical in our area) as compared to local usag teams practicing 9-12 hours per week.

 

[LJL07]

However, a usag team would not be allowed to participate in these meets, and for good reason. Our L3 rec team practices 5 hours per week (which is fairly typical in our area) as compared to local usag teams practicing 9-12 hours per week.

Yes, I don't know how or why we were signed up to do this meet. It seemed kind of unfair as our USAG team just looked much better and no doubt practices more hours. Same deal with just one judge per event at the rec meet. Our team tended to score around 37-ish AA, and then there was a sharp drop off with AA of 33 and below for the rec teams. I am just worrying that if the scoring is that "generous," will we end up scoring whole points lower at this next USAG meet? Most of our girls scored around a 9.4 on the floor routine. They had very clean routines, so I find it hard to believe those routines would score mid to low 8's, but who knows...I'm just wondering what to expect and hoping DD won't be disappointed.

 

[2G1B]

I would prepare her that scoring will be a little tougher at a USAG sanctioned meet. It is likely that the scoring at this meet was on the generous side for clean routines since they were going up against girls likely not as clean due to lack of hours...

 

[gymdog]

Yes, I don't know how or why we were signed up to do this meet. It seemed kind of unfair as our USAG team just looked much better and no doubt practices more hours. Same deal with just one judge per event at the rec meet. Our team tended to score around 37-ish AA, and then there was a sharp drop off with AA of 33 and below for the rec teams. I am just worrying that if the scoring is that "generous," will we end up scoring whole points lower at this next USAG meet? Most of our girls scored around a 9.4 on the floor routine. They had very clean routines, so I find it hard to believe those routines would score mid to low 8's, but who knows...I'm just wondering what to expect and hoping DD won't be disappointed.

Rec leagues don't always use USAG trained judges due to cost and availability (simply, there's a judge shortage and barely enough for requested sanctioned events, filling a rec meet with all USAG judges would be impossible). A college club in this state hosted a meet last year and ended up with this problem, even while expanding to certified high school judges which is allowed in NAIGC invitationals. The priority was USAG JO/Xcel meets and in my state where we typically have multiple JO invitationals on a given weekend, there just aren't extra judges.

So it just depends on how the judges knew the compulsory routines. There are not just form deductions, but also specific deductions for each element. For example, on floor in a high school or Xcel or any optional meet really, it would be acceptable to bend your leg and then open it straight at the height of your leap ("stag" preparation). But if you do this in compulsories, it is a tenth deduction. So if your team has not scored close to what they scored at this meet at sanctioned events, then yes the scoring was probably inaccurate for USAG compulsories, but might be an accurate representation of what they would score if they performed that routine in Xcel bronze.

 

[LJL07]

These are the USAG judges from all the other meets. Two of them have been judging since the late 80's. The bar judge will probably be the one of the same judges on bars at this upcoming meet. It will be very interesting to see how these routines score.

 

[balancedmom]

Most of our girls scored around a 9.4 on the floor routine. They had very clean routines, so I find it hard to believe those routines would score mid to low 8's, but who knows...

we moved from a rec league to USAG, and believe me, it is fully possible to go from mid-9s at a rec league to low 8s or even 7s in USAG. Much more focus at USAG on every single movement and form issues. We had it happen to our girls who moved over. Over time though, my DD raised her scores and is now getting high 8s and low 9s, so not podium, but feels good competing.

 

[2G1B]

Even though the judges are the same, I'd likely prepare her that the SCORING might not be the same. they use the same judges for different levels and Xcel with USAG. The judges know that for the different levels and Xcel that they are looking for different things. Likely they are going to be more forgiving in rec judging than in USAG (or even Xcel). Which, IMO, is as it should be.

 

[sevenatenine2]

I think it depends WHICH rec league you compete in. In our state, there is a league that the state amateur athletic federation runs and the routines are judged by the same judges that judge USA. In addition, the kids that compete it in are not recreational kids, but kids that are either on teams that may not work out (quite) as many hours, a spring compulsory season works best for them, OR the kids will compete their new level in the spring league and then have it perfected for USA in the fall.

Our rec league does have the different division based on score, so for example, Level 3 Division 1 is for kids scoring like 38.5 and up (very few kids in this division), all the way down to Division 7 which is kids scoring below 31. As the kids get better, they move up a division, but the kids you are competing with all have their high score within a point of your best---which is a feature i LOVE! You still have to have to have a great meet to do well, but the odds aren't stacked against you.

The big name gyms don't do this league OR they have a team as part of their gym that JUST does this league, but the kids are all pretty good. I can't really tell a difference in the lower levels. In the higher levels, yes.........there would be a difference.

 

[LJL07]

I guess it really does vary by state. I asked around, and the "rec league" is a little like xcel. Some of the gyms do the rec league prior to USAG level 4 and a few other gyms that do it are in rural areas that don't do USAG at all. It may be judged a little bit easier, but it shouldn't be a whole point difference--more like a few tenths. I wondered because DD did really nice bar and floor routines and received scores that seemed really high. From what our coach said, she would still get high scores on those routines, maybe just not quite that high.

 

[Sasha]

Yeah, until you have experience seeing and comparing with your own eyes, I'd prepare yourself (and maybe your DD if you feel she can comprehend rationally) for a guess of about .5 lower in USAG JO. Could be more or less, but that's what I'd tell myself going in and see what happens.

Btw, I'm a person that likes to "have some expectation" going in to something, even if I know it's a total guess based on incomplete information. It's just a way I feel prepared, like I've 'done my homework' and have readied myself for different outcomes. So I relate to your question even if there is no way to know for sure, and it doesn't even really matter. This is the way I "relax and enjoy the ride" - by researching and gathering data/inputs then seeing how that compares to the actual experience.

 

[LJL07]

Yeah, until you have experience seeing and comparing with your own eyes, I'd prepare yourself (and maybe your DD if you feel she can comprehend rationally) for a guess of about .5 lower in USAG JO. Could be more or less, but that's what I'd tell myself going in and see what happens.

Btw, I'm a person that likes to "have some expectation" going in to something, even if I know it's a total guess based on incomplete information. It's just a way I feel prepared, like I've 'done my homework' and have readied myself for different outcomes. So I relate to your question even if there is no way to know for sure, and it doesn't even really matter. This is the way I "relax and enjoy the ride" - by researching and gathering data/inputs then seeing how that compares to the actual experience.

That's why I posted that video in the other forum. I wanted some ballpark idea. Very high score, but when I saw someone above post a whole point difference, I can't imagine that routine would score in the 8's. .5 or .4 sounds about right. There are some not so great looking USAG teams too in the area. I'll have to report back, although every meet is so different it's hard to compare! Can't wait to get this meet over with.