Parents Strength vs flexibility

[Faith]

Another here with a stronger/less flexible gymnast.

I think if you're very flexible early on you may have the static strength, it's the dynamic, fast twitch that is difficult to train.

My concern at the minute is the lack of flexibility is slowing up her basic floor skills (walkovers etc)- so while she's streets ahead on vault and bars, because early on they don't work those apparatus as much she's not getting the chance to progress on her stronger points...

 

[Neelysmom]

My DD has Unbelievable upper body strength but has horrible flexibility in her back. She is close to having all of her splits. She can out do most of the older girls on chin ups on the high bar and she is only 5.

 

[monkeysmom]

I'm not really sure which my 7 year old is. She can do all her splits and has good shoulder flexibility, but she didn't just naturally go down into her splits, she worked on them at home while she was watching Martha Speaks until she got them. I'd call her rmore stubborn than flexible. One type she definitely is -- "a stubborn Swede." She is on pre pre op (they are calling them "Bronze" this fall and may get to compete this winter if they can do their routines). I posted a while ago that she tried out for preteam and was placed on prep op last spring. It's really hard to get on regular team at her gym, they're pretty competititve--and represented in St. Paul this week--yeah!!!! Can't wait to watch!! Anyway, I guess it's all perspective, it's hard for kids who haven't made it on yet, maybe those who did would say it was easy! Back to the stubborn part, she made a new chart last week (the kids loves to make charts, leave me notes in my work bag etc-- cracks me up). She came out with her chart to show me. One the top is a big pink 20 and a big purple 25. She said that's the number of pull ups and toe ups she is going to do at regular team tryouts in May. When I asked where she came up with the numbers, she said the most pullups anyone did at practice that day was 15, so she is going for 20. When I asked where the 25 came from, she said it's because she's better at toe ups than chin ups (she's at 6 pullups and 7 toe ups at the moment). Being as determined as she is, she will probably get there by May. I guess my job is to make progress something to really celebrate, because that doesn't automatically put her on team. Ah, managing those expectations without squashing her determination and enthusiam. My tactic at the moment is to distract her and talk about something else--school, friends, playing guitar. She's a little like a dog with a bone though. I think her ancestors were tough stubborn Nordic types.

 

[mamaoftwo]

Wow, you must have a very competitive team. My L6 DD still wouldn't make your team's L4 cutoff and she placed in every event at L4 and L5 States. She's got about an inch to go on the middle split (though she has the over splits on both left and right legs - and her upper body strength is pretty ridiculous). It really makes me appreciate the head coach at our gym. Not sure what she saw in DD when she invited her to try out for the team, but it certainly wasn't inate flexibility with any body part.

Thanks for the reply! I think that it is great that there are so many differnt gym "types". Well, to be honest, our gym has not actually been that competitive in compulsories, though they did do ok at states this past year (I think 4th place L4, 1st place L5, no L6s). They've been rebuilding their team program. But we are "competitive" in the sense that we get 80+ girls at L4 tryouts in December. Among those 80, we currently have 17 total L3 gymnasts (though we may be losing 2 of them in Sept) which will also try out for about 20 spots. Many of the younger girls already have the strength, but are missing their splits yet.

I do get the impression that if a preteam girl is missing one component, she will likely get a pass unless someone seriously "outscores" her at tryouts. Usually, that is pretty unlikely given our rec program. Most 3's that don't make it at tryouts have other issues (focus, drive, behavioral issues or lack of body awareness -eg consistently bent legs). But that said, those are the posted "requirements" for making team. That said, our 4's don't work out that intensely compared to some (6 hours per week Jan-June, then 8 hours per week June-end of comp season, then varied by move ups, etc). So, they want the girls as ready as possible, I think.

Curious to note, I was watching the L4-L7 girls warm up today, and I'd bet that not even half have their splits anymore! Though I suppose that maybe it wasn't a requirement when they tried out.

And congrats to your DD for doing so well! That's great! Sometimes, I think they just "know", if you know what I mean.

 

[skschlag]

My ds (9) is quite strong. He has been able to use his strength to power thru alot of skills early on (kip, high bar swings, etc). Now that he is leaning out a bit (still strong, but growing) he is having to relearn some of the proper techniques. He is still fairly flexible, has 1 side oversplit, 1 side split and about 1 inch from middle split, but definitely the strength moves are his forte.

 

[k2bdeutmeyer]

Very interesting! DD is also one of the opposites, though her coaches claim she is strong?!? She is definitely more of the long & lean body type and is crazy flexible (she's the only one in her class that has her splits not only all the way down, but also has her oversplits). BUT, she is the only one who cannot do a lot of the strength. I will say that she does seem stronger than other children her age (non-gymnasts), but....not in comparison to the other gymnasts her age. That being said, she was the only one out of her class selected for TOPs because she was "the only one who had both the strength and flexibility", so....maybe I just don't know what I'm talking about! LOL!

 

[Linsul]

My DD is stronger than she is flexible, but as she's only in gymnastics for recreational fun she's not pushing beyond the warmup for flexibility. I figure she'll try harder with flexibility if she decides to love gymnastics again in the future, or dance, or cheer.

it's the dynamic, fast twitch that is difficult to train.

That x's infinity! As a coach 'weak' or 'tight' gymnasts have their own set of challenges, but there's no cap on their gains in either area if they are willing and able to improve. Fast twitch and quickness is a different story. I spoke to Yevgeny Marchenko on the topic recently as it regards to developmental gymnast selection. His opinion is that when it comes to fast twitch you can improve it maybe 5, 10, 15% but there's a cap on gains and it comes through a ton of work that involves training fast twitch specifically. We're pretty much playing the hand we were dealt by nature when it comes to that.

 

[BlairBob]

I've been at a handful of gyms and every one of them has had standards for each level.

To be honest, so long as the gymnast had her skills she would make that level regardless of how she wasn't 180 on her splits, or could not do x number of rope climbs or presses (from sitting in a straddle) or this or that.

It sure is nice to put on paper for legitimacy though.

Fast twitch fibers are mostly genetic based. However, you can get slower TypeII fibers to act as fast twitch.

An interesting thing I found out while looking at a gym known for training baseball players is that they are 3 types of shoulder sockets basically, one basically sucks for anything overhead while the 2nd is hit and miss and the 3rd tends to be uber flexible.

Strength and Flexibility are at opposite ends but of course you'll get kids who have varying degrees of both or none.

Some kids are loose and flexible

Mongolian like contortionism is probably very genetic. It appears that many contortionists simply have more ROM in their joints available and ligaments that allow for this.